We can't afford health care but somehow we can afford this?!? (salary, enemy)
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I hope to see the Tea Party crow talking about this deficit spending!!
typical military, can't do anything cost effective or on time, just a bunch of out of touch bureaucrats that have nothing in common with us. Proves the military can't do anything cost effective, just like always.
sound familiar?
those fighter jets will come in handy when al quida puts chemicals in our drinking water or blows up the golden gate bridge or an airplane over Detroit or bombs another one of our embasies overseas.
We absolutely can afford health reform.. This isnt health reform, its a tax bill, being called a health reform bill..
Health care should NOT come under fiscal restraint. As i said before, UHC's have never bankrupted ANY country that has implemented it and the USA would be no different. Paying a tax so that EVERY American recieves good health care is a small price to pay for the health of the nation. To say that the Govt. cannot run a health system is dumb.....they did a great job with implementing and running the space programme.... that was built from scratch too and cost trillions but no one complained about that. If this health reform fails then every American who dies or suffers or goes bankrupt because of the current health system can blame the fellow "Americans" who did NOT step up to the mark when change was offered to them....... I hope they realise how selfish, short sighted and narrow minded they are............
We absolutely can afford health reform.. This isnt health reform, its a tax bill, being called a health reform bill..
Excellent comments. And very true. Frankly, while it might sound nice - to provide health insurance to everyone, we simply cannot, as a nation, afford to do so. And, this is a fact.
Health care should NOT come under fiscal restraint. As i said before, UHC's have never bankrupted ANY country that has implemented it and the USA would be no different. Paying a tax so that EVERY American recieves good health care is a small price to pay for the health of the nation. To say that the Govt. cannot run a health system is dumb.....they did a great job with implementing and running the space programme.... that was built from scratch too and cost trillions but no one complained about that. If this health reform fails then every American who dies or suffers or goes bankrupt because of the current health system can blame the fellow "Americans" who did NOT step up to the mark when change was offered to them....... I hope they realise how selfish, short sighted and narrow minded they are............
Quote:
Paying a tax so that EVERY American recieves good health care is a small price to pay for the health of the nation.
small price?????
20,000-40,000 per household is a small price????
what I am saying is that government care (medicare for all, singlepayer, government option) is UNAFFORDABLE
LOOK at the numbers; look at the cost of our current systems: the more costly medicare; or even the less costly medicaid....go ahead look at the numbers
1. MEDICARE currently covers (only partially, it is not 100% coverage) about 40 million (about 1/7th of the population) seniors and has an ANNUAL COST of 500 BILLION dollars.............................to cover all, would cost anywhere from $2.5-4.5 trillion A YEAR..............
2. we spend 300 BILLION dollars on MEDICAID ...to cover (at 100%) about 30 million (most esitmates are between 25 million and 35 million).....transfer that number to 320 million people (our population) the cost would be about 3 TRILLION A YEAR...................
NOW lets look at what the taxpayer would expect:
divide those numbers (2.5 trillion to 4.5 trillion) by the 120 million taxpayers(according to the IRS)...that's an average tax bill of $20,000-38,000 EACH HOUSEHOLD, EACH YEAR, an always rising.......can you afford that,,, I certainly cant...and its a HECK OF A LOT MORE THAN PRIVATE INSURANCE. and a heck of a lot especially if you dont go to a docotor but once a year.....is that what they want a once a year doctor bill for $20,000plus
you really want government to take care of you?????
the FDA has been screwed up for years, the government has been full of red tape for years...its the government red tape...always has been, aways will be
and that is the problem,,,that's why single payer (government) will NOT work here
I injured my back in 2003,,, what was recommended back then was FUSING of the vertiba...well in europe they have been doing disc replacement for 20 years...finaly in 2004 the FDA approved for that type of surgery here,,,,,tried to get it in 2005,,through TRI-CARE (the GOVERNMENT health care system for the military) they said "NO, its a new experimental proceedure"....even though it had been done for the last 20 years in europe........the government answer,,,deal with the pain, or get FUSED and lose mobility and still have pain
that is government single payer health crap care...and for those of you who say a single payer is not 'government care' ....
but it is government health care when they are the PAYER...and that has been the key word for years whether its private or government...the PAYER is the one who(m) determine what is and isnt paid for.......
I dont trust the government as far as I could throw them..from fluoride to DDT to health care
am I defending insurance companies???? NO- WAY, I cant stand the insurance companies private or government
IF you are disabled and unable to work...get on disability[b]...lets FIX disability[..first/B], making it less of a hassle to get on, but also police it to stop the false claims
IF you are poor, or temporarily out of work...let them quailfy for medicaid....lets FIX mediciad get rid of the abuse
if you are a senior, or real close (say 60) let's allow you to start being covered by medicare..why can you get ss at 62, but you have to wait for 65 for medicare????...lets FIX the problems with medicare get rid of the fraud, waste and abuse
pass a 2 page law that forbids any pre-existing clause....you would probably get 100% passage out of congress,,,but instead they do 3000 page monstrosities
pass a 2 page law that allows PORTABILITY of existing health coverage when you move locations or jobs
pass a law that gets rid of the STUPID uncalled for lawsuits....but supports TRUE neglegence lawsuits
do it that way you would have almost every one on board near 100%...instead the liberals want to MANDATE INSURANCE and still have the EXISTING problems with the ALREADY FAILING GOVERNMENT SYSTEMS.......what the neo-libs want will bankrupt the USA
even in england where they spend half as much as what we spend here,(us 8k oer person, britian 4k per person) if we used their costs it would be 1.5 trillion A YEAR to cover our 320 million people...that's more than half the intake of the irs right there
I hope to see the Tea Party crow talking about this deficit spending!!
Read the link. Disgusting - the spending they are burdening us with. Tea Party Crows will probably defend it with lines like: "You can't put a price on Freedom" blah, blah, blah. "Gotta win that war on Terror" blah, blah, blah.
The logic behind military spending just flabbergasts me. The Defense Spending Bill went virtually unnoticed - not a whimper about it.
I know if there never was a 9/11, the Pentagon would still spend us into oblivion - they've been doing it forever.
Sadly, we're letting them get away with it.
I hope to see the Tea Party crow talking about this deficit spending!!
How did I know this was going to be crying about military spending, just by reading the thread title and its author? Because I know liberal progressives.
The one thing the federal government is tasked with spending taxpayer money on, the armed forces and national defense, is always the one place liberals want to cut spending on. If we did things the way you people want us to, we would not even have a military. But the libs would be all smiles if we had 0bama's "civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded" as the military.
BTW, $323 billion would create one hell of a lot of jobs, much more then the money spent for the stimulus bill. This kind of spending is exactly what FDR spent money on during WWII, which you people keep telling us was what got us out of the depression. So which is it?
Health care should NOT come under fiscal restraint.
Um.. this bill not only comes under fiscal restraint, but also restricts fiscal spending on other healthcare like medicare..
Quote:
Originally Posted by geeoro
As i said before, UHC's have never bankrupted ANY country that has implemented it and the USA would be no different.
UHC has never been implimented by a country already bankrupt...
Quote:
Originally Posted by geeoro
Paying a tax so that EVERY American recieves good health care is a small price to pay for the health of the nation.
Fine, then you volunteer to pay it because I for one avoid federal taxes like the plague.. Ohh hell, now that you are volunteering to pay more, please send me a check to cover my "health care tax".. When you do, I'll believe what you say..
Quote:
Originally Posted by geeoro
To say that the Govt. cannot run a health system is dumb
They ALREADY contract out many of their health systems because PRIVATE industry does it better. They contract out medicaid in most, if not all states, along with every prison system in the nation.. They even contract out parts of the VA, and SS systems.. To believe they can run systems better when they already admit they cant is whats dumb!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by geeoro
they did a great job with implementing and running the space programme.... that was built from scratch too and cost trillions but no one complained about that.
I think you just did complain about their "wonderful" program based upon cost.. You are making progress
Quote:
Originally Posted by geeoro
If this health reform fails then every American who dies or suffers or goes bankrupt because of the current health system can blame the fellow "Americans" who did NOT step up to the mark when change was offered to them....... I hope they realise how selfish, short sighted and narrow minded they are............
ooh please.. americans dont die or go bankrupt because of the current health system. This happens BECAUSE THEY GET SICK, which of course will still happen with UHC.. And I hope those who realise how selfish they are to take from others so they can get something FOR FREE will stop posting about how selfish everyone else is..
I injured my back in 2003,,, what was recommended back then was FUSING of the vertiba...well in europe they have been doing disc replacement for 20 years...finaly in 2004 the FDA approved for that type of surgery here,,,,,tried to get it in 2005,,through TRI-CARE (the GOVERNMENT health care system for the military) they said "NO, its a new experimental proceedure"....even though it had been done for the last 20 years in europe........[b]the government answer,,,deal with the pain, or get FUSED and lose mobility and still have pain
Well if you have Tricare - you have very good insurance at an affordable price - a government run health care system, I might add. What are you whining about
No doubt the FDA is a pain in the ass but that can be overhauled as well.
They had been doing disc replacement in Europe for 20 years - you say. Guess what else they have in Europe -
Universal Health Care
How did I know this was going to be crying about military spending, just by reading the thread title and its author? Because I know liberal progressives.
The one thing the federal government is tasked with spending taxpayer money on, the armed forces and national defense, is always the one place liberals want to cut spending on.
BTW, [/i]$323 billion would create one hell of a lot of jobs, much more then the money spent for the stimulus bill. This kind of spending is exactly what FDR spent money on during WWII, which you people keep telling us was what got us out of the depression. So which is it?
I'm not a liberal progressive. This isn't World War II.
The federal government has over extended its bounds
in spending for National defense. There are those that
aren't happy, unless this country is involved in one war or
another. What, let's start World War III to stimulate our economy Always an excuse
If you were truly fiscally conservative - you would want to reduce spending ACROSS the Board, not just pick and choose your poison
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