Visiting PDX right now (considering a move) and wondering what I'm missing (Portland: transplants, for sale)

[phxbelle]

So, I have been in Portland since Thursday and am generally having a good time. However, I'm out here on job interviews and when thinking about living here I see a couple drawbacks. I went out to the falls and saw a lot of the scenery and I must say I think Oregon is beautiful, but no one disputes that. Also, thus far I have been able to handle the rain, although I don't think it's rained as much here as it usually does. My biggest concerns come from a few things, one being some of the people I've bumped into. Most have been intelligent which I enjoyed, but it also seems like there are a lot of scenesters out here. People who say they're into something just because it's the thing to do and not necessarily because they are truly passionate about it, which I don't enjoy. Also, maybe I've bumped into the wrong folks but does everyone smoke here? I don't and it's annoying, and another thing...beer. I don't really drink, can I fully enjoy Portland if I'm not a beer fan or alcohol fan? I swear I was out with these guys who talked about craft beer for like 9 hours! I'm also considering the Twin Cities and have some interviews out there as well, so that is the city I will be comparing Portland to. So, am I missing something? Is there anything I should do to provide myself with a more accurate picture of Portland? Any of you from MN or have visited and are here now, do you think I will find things I like better there?

[Danny_CPhT/EMT]

I'm also considering a move to Portland. How did you line up the job interviews, that's what I'm havng trouble with.

[Isotope-C14]

I have the joy and pleasure of returning myself to Chicago within the next week as I accepted a position at a research hospital. I am not a fan of Portland or the Pacific North-West at all, that doesn't mean that you won't like it but your concerns are justified.

You mention that you've run into a bunch of "scenesters" and yes, they are plentiful. There is also a fairly high population of stoned people. I'd say that there are many more recreational drug users out here than you would find in the Midwest, medical licenses are plentiful here. Socially in general people are more introverted and it is a much more difficult environment for finding relationships, or even getting to know your neighbors. If you like to have strong social connections common to the MidWest, they aren't plentiful here. I've made friends here but they are generally over 40/45 (I'm 34). If you are the sort that is a home-body and you like to avoid interpersonal interactions I'd guess this would be a mecca.

Driving. Portland people have no clue how to drive. They drive under the speed limit in the far left lane no matter where they are going. It is most annoying if you have any kind of commute at all, I avoid driving at all costs. You can tell an out-of-towner by the fact that they use the right two lanes when not in a hurry.

Beer: There's tons of it, and many people hit the pubs. I drink beer, and got so absolutely sick of how boring the bars are I just stay home 99% of the time.

The rain is not fun, it didn't bother me at all at first, but as time passes you crave to see real lightning, snow and blue skies all in one week.

I have family from MN and friends there, I've only driven through Minneapolis but I would move there over Portland in a heartbeat. Sure it's cold, but I'm a fan of the classically Midwestern strong social networks.

Good luck with your interviews and do some more research on this town. It's certainly not for everyone.

[philwithbeard]

Phx Belle:

In a general way, NO, you don't have to consume craft beer to enjoy Portland. But the Beer is very good, for those of us who like beer. There is also great wines for sale in Portland, as well as most of the Pacific Time Zone. There are quite a few Portland residences who don't even know what IPA stand for.

Yes, there are a lot of people who do stuff, whatever is cool, trendy, or part of the In-Scene. It is my limited knowledge that this is also a very West Coast thing from Seattle to San Diego. There are lots and lots of mature people in Portland who are offended by excesses of what is going on in the Pearl District, but won't speak up because they know part is just youthful rebellion.

The homeless people do take a bit to get use to, however. There are a lot of them.

I think there is a lot less tobacco smoking going on in Portland than other large cities. I cannot talk about other leafy substances, as I don't know.

BTW: Portland only has a handful of days every January (NOAA data averaged) where the temperature LOW (minimum temperature) is below 32 degrees, and zero days where the high is below 32 degrees. Portland has about the same number of sunny days and Partly Cloudy days as Buffalo NY and Cleveland, OH (NOAA data.)

Minneapolis (again NOAA data) for the entire month of January 2009 had 30 out of 31 days below 32 degrees at all times. The 'Mean' temperature last January was 8.3 degrees (that's right-single digit!) and had 5 days where the temperature dropped below -10 degrees at night. This is serious winter. This is not for the faint of heart when it comes to snow & cold. Extra care must be taken to prevent the oil in your car from becoming so thick from the cold your car's oil pump cannot circulate the oil correctly.

But both cities are favorably voters for the Democratic Party by wide margins. In loose terms, I call this being "liberal" in both cities. Republicans are, IMHO, only politely and mildly tolerated by the majority of people in the city of Portland. Be aware there is a very long tradition in MN for the "Granger" populist political movement (way, way back in history) which is neither Republican nor Democratic, but anti-big business and hates big banks.
IMHO MN people are:
- traditionalist and not open to many new ideas.
- Some women are still fighting for the ERA amendment to the US constitution
- Pop / rock music stopped with Prince for many in St. Paul
- Speak, or mutter, as if their lower jaw was numb from the cold even in June. (Lower jaw don't move hardly at all.)
- Known for slamming down shots of whiskey with their beers. Very drunk -Very fast
- Can talk for hours on the art of snow shoveling to clear a path to get the car out of the driveway in January. (banks of snow on both side of driveway is taller than most people; so what to do when it snows again and you cannot physically lob the snow any higher on the sides of your driveway and you need to go to work?)

But do enjoy your job interview trips.

Phil

[Leisesturm]

This East Coast transplant appreciates the dispatch with which most Oregonians handle automobiles. Apparently there is wide agreement because Oregon consistently ranks in the top 5 of "best drivers" categories. Left lane cruisers are a universal curse on mankind and are probably transplants. Traveling East on 26 into Portland one morning (I am not a regular commuter) I was amazed to see the left lane open for miles but it was hardly neccessary to be there, the right lane was going ten over! That's 65mph in a 55mph zone. No one being cut off, no one riding their brakes, or the bumper of the car in front... driving in snow... that is an area in which Portland drivers do not excel. One out of ten... not too shabby.

H

P.S. Portland is the only city, where, as a cyclist, one can safely make left turns like God intended. Anywhere else you have to wait for two sets of traffic lights and ride with the pedestrians.

[Isotope-C14]

Also phxbelle, I didn't mention this in my above post since I was nearly certain that Leisesturm or some other portland apologist would chime in with something barely relevant but if you criticize anything about Portland publicly you should expect animosity. There is ample animosity if you aren't a "native" or "local" and if you are a recent transplant you should expect to be treated somewhat poorly but mainly by the "natives" who are the real problem in the state. The folks here generally are pretty insecure about people who have lived in real cities or in states that are not Oregon or Washington. Though you don't always run across them, there are MANY Portland apologists and they stick to the mantra of "Keep Portland Weird" and I'm not exactly sure how lots of homeless people and a generally dingy town is weird but I guess that Detroit is weird too.

If you are from Phoenix as I'm suspecting, one of my employees was from there. He has come to a similar conclusion regarding how unpleasant/boring it is to be in this state. Little diversity, insular group-think, xenophobia, common substance abuse, constant mist/clouds, only good thing is if you are a rock collector and have a car that can easily make regular trips to Prineville/Bend.

@Leisesturm So what coast is Chicago on again? I'm very curious if you've ever looked at a map, or for that sake lived anywhere else. Or is everything east of the cascades the east coast?

[phxbelle]

Thank you all for the responses and more are welcome if people would like to reply. Also, I don't want to start a fight on this thread between people who like/dislike certain aspects of the city. I'm just trying to make an informed decision. I'm not a cyclist nor am I REALLY into outdoorsy stuff, on a scale of 1 to 10 (1 being I never go outside and 10 being I'm always outdoors), I probably vacillate between a 3-5. I'm more looking for a city where I can indulge in arts and culture (I'm also a poet and looking to get back into that now that I have more time), and be in a progressive and accepting atmosphere. I also want to meet real people who I can develop relationships with. I'm not into beer or recreational drugs which I've seen a lot of since I've been here. But as I said there are positives, I am coming from PHX as Isotope guessed, and one of my chief complaints is that everything looks the same, too cookie cutter, and many of the people are shallow. I haven't found that here thus far. I know I'll always have complaints no matter where I live, it's just deciding if Portland or Twin Cities is more my style.

Danny, its an internship that I must complete to get my doctorate in psychology, so it's not a traditional job as I guess you would say. Also, my profession is not hit as hard as others, but I do know that that the unemployment rate in OR is WAY worse than MN, which is also going into my decision bank.

[philwithbeard]

Phx Belle:

Just asking, did you consider Madison, Wisconsin for your internship?
Specifically at the Mendota Mental Health Institute on the north side of Lake Mendota. Madison sits on between two small lakes, Mendota is just to the North of the U of Wisconsin. Mendota State is just west of the Madison Airport. Great place to do Internship.

Very great place. Just go over to the Wisconsin -- Madison sub forum and ask about doing Internship there. winters are hard, but not as brutal as the Twin cities. Close to Chicago (on the cost of Lake Michigan!!!), Milwaukee (on the coast of Lake Michigan) and the great people of Madison WI.

Really, don't take my word for it, post your question about Internship at Mendota State over on that forum.

[seain dublin]

Excuse me Isotope, what I wouldn't give for some of those Oregon drivers.

Have lived in four states and the Oregon drivers were the most courteous I have ever encountered.

Currently in Florida...scary.... never seen so many reckless and thoughtless drivers in my life. On a daily basis there is some occurance of stupidity and danger that you encounter.

On the ironic side we did have an old lady on a Sunday turn left in front of us illegally and hit our car in downtown Portland. She pulled over for a minute or two and then took off. She was from Vancover,WA.

Do you know 2 cars stopped and someone working in a store came out to see if we were ok. All of them got her license plate.

Here they would drive around you.

Besides the beauty of Oregon I really miss those considerate drivers.

[Isotope-C14]

Oh, so Vancouver WA is like a totally different place than Portland? Her license plate proves that she's not a native Portlander who moved to Vancouver for the tax breaks? So you got hit and the person drove off, in Portland? So this is the smoking gun that proves drivers here are courteous?

Why is it that almost all of the defenders of Portland take one example, the only one they can think of, and believe that the generalization is somehow disproven? Oh yeah, I drove on this one highway and one day two years ago the left lane was open, see, you are wrong. Is there a class in creating straw man arguments that is offered somewhere in the pearl district?

Why is it courteous to endanger motorists by driving below the speed limit in the left lane and thus encouraging passing on the right? Can you explain this one? Why is it courteous to block traffic by driving the same speed as the person(s) in the adjacent two lanes? Why is it that immediately "it must be the transplants" since nearly every time I see it happen it is a Pacific North-West plate?

PHXbelle: Check out Madison, it's a great town if you can get internships there. Madison is by far a superior city to Portland in nearly every way.