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You need to ask around and get signatures from the other tenants. If you present them with a petition that has, say, a hundred signatures, they can't say you're the only one complaining and will be more inclined to fix it. Everyone else might be as equally annoyed, but just haven't said anything yet.
This thinking drives me nuts. Do you think businesses really believe this, or do you think they use this to justify not fixing the problem?
The apt building I live in, put in an electronic door system last year, where our keys to the building were taken away, and we were issued electronic key fobs.
This system malfunctions regularly. When it does, we can use an emergency regular key to a door that is in a really inconvenient location. I can only guess they did this, so people wouldn't just use the regular key instead of the fob, which tracks us when we use it to get into the building.
The system is getting worse instead of better and I am fed up, so I started complaining. I'm being told that nobody else is complaining, and that they fix it within a reasonable amount of time (which can be several days waiting for the security system guy), and since everyone has a key to get in when it doesn't work - then too bad, so sad.
Does this make any sense to you? If only one person is bold enough to start complaining to management, that that means it can't be that bad?
Never believe a landlord or building manager when they say no one else is complaining. They tell you that to shut you up so they don't have to fix anything. Chances are if it annoys you, it annoys other people. You're better off asking your neighbors if they've noticed any trouble with it. You might be surprised to hear that it drives them nuts and they've said something to management about it, too. Then you can all decide to do something about it together.
Regardless, I am often in the position of being the first to notice something is wrong, and not just with systems and things, but with people, too. This means that I'm also in the position of initially being branded a negative nellie, a complainer, a cage-rattler, etc., but then later I'm considered insightful, wise, and perceptive because I am almost never wrong about whatever or whoever it is that sets off my Spidey Sense. It's a pain in the neck, to be honest, and I can't stand the kind of thinking you describe.
It's probably a matter of you're the only one who's had enough courage to speak up. Other people are probably fuming silently over the same issue.
This is exactly what I wrote to the housing authority today. I took photos of the last sign that was put up on all doors inside and out, that explains how we're supposed to try every 20 seconds to use our electronic fobs, then if they still don't work, to go use the "emergency key" door, and that the repair man is supposed to be here tomorrow, but not to prop the door open because it's damaging the door and if you do that, you could be held responsible for damaging the door.
The management told the housing authority that I'm the only one complaining, that the doors don't break down very often, and that they can't give us keys to the back door because the door is substantially different than the "emergency key" door.
Which is all baloney.
But, the housing authority had told me they can't do anything because they talked to management who told them the above.
So, I sent another nice letter and said, I know you consider this matter closed, but I wanted you to just have some additional info along with the photos I'm enclosing that show that what management is telling you is questionable. That if management is posting signs on all doors inside and out, that the point must be to stem the tide of tenants going to the office complaining about the doors.
And my photos show the doors are not substantially different.
And I said that I hear other tenants complaining all the time, but it's possible that other low-income seniors will suffer in silence, are too sick or afraid or uneducated to advocate for themselves, and even if they complain verbally, they don't complain in writing. But just because "only" one tenant does so, doesn't mean there isn't a problem, and that a picture is worth a thousand words, so I'm sending you photos.
And I realize you're really busy and I appreciate that you can't do anything about this. But, just a head's up, I'm escalating my complaint to the Fair Housing Dept of the state of CA.
I really appreciate the validation here. I think you are all right. This is a standard blow-off that businesses do to try and make you go away. If I'm the only one complaining, why would they put signs on all doors in and out, telling tenants how to try to get in, and that a repair man is coming the next day, unless they were being slammed with complaints?
Management actually told me their decision is final and they want me to be happy and feel safe, so if I don't like their decision, I'm welcome to look for housing elsewhere.
No kidding.
I sure hope fair housing nails their butts to the wall with a huge fine.
At any rate, when I got the "our decision is final" email, I completely ignored that and sent them another email telling them about how I just tried to get into the building and wasn't able to, until I tried 3 times with my key fob, and that I'll be letting them know every time that happens, because maybe they aren't aware of how often the system malfunctions.
The good news here is, I'm on Section 8 in this senior building, and they can't kick me out without cause. So, I don't have to worry about them not renewing my lease or raising my rent. As much as I hate the situation, I realized I can bug them daily if I want to, and they can't kick me out.
I had a similar situation in the last senior building I lived in, where there was a wine bar under our senior apartments, and the wine bar changed their live music to really loud rock bands that played until the wee hours of the morning. This was not what any of us signed up for. I tried a petition, but seniors don't want to get involved. They'd rather suffer in silence. Drives me nuts, but I wouldn't want to try that here, as I don't think many, if any, other tenants would sign it. They're all afraid of authority figures. So, trying that could actually backfire for me, if management found out, and they could say, "Hey, there's no problem! No other tenants would sign your petition!"
I may end up moving, if I can't get things improved, but in the meantime, I will not go quietly into the night.
Thanks for the feedback everyone! It's really helpful.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zennia
Never believe a landlord or building manager when they say no one else is complaining. They tell you that to shut you up so they don't have to fix anything. Chances are if it annoys you, it annoys other people. You're better off asking your neighbors if they've noticed any trouble with it. You might be surprised to hear that it drives them nuts and they've said something to management about it, too. Then you can all decide to do something about it together.
Regardless, I am often in the position of being the first to notice something is wrong, and not just with systems and things, but with people, too. This means that I'm also in the position of initially being branded a negative nellie, a complainer, a cage-rattler, etc., but then later I'm considered insightful, wise, and perceptive because I am almost never wrong about whatever or whoever it is that sets off my Spidey Sense. It's a pain in the neck, to be honest, and I can't stand the kind of thinking you describe.
This is exactly what I wrote to the housing authority today. I took photos of the last sign that was put up on all doors inside and out, that explains how we're supposed to try every 20 seconds to use our electronic fobs, then if they still don't work, to go use the "emergency key" door, and that the repair man is supposed to be here tomorrow, but not to prop the door open because it's damaging the door and if you do that, you could be held responsible for damaging the door.
The management told the housing authority that I'm the only one complaining, that the doors don't break down very often, and that they can't give us keys to the back door because the door is substantially different than the "emergency key" door.
Which is all baloney.
But, the housing authority had told me they can't do anything because they talked to management who told them the above.
So, I sent another nice letter and said, I know you consider this matter closed, but I wanted you to just have some additional info along with the photos I'm enclosing that show that what management is telling you is questionable. That if management is posting signs on all doors inside and out, that the point must be to stem the tide of tenants going to the office complaining about the doors.
And my photos show the doors are not substantially different.
And I said that I hear other tenants complaining all the time, but it's possible that other low-income seniors will suffer in silence, are too sick or afraid or uneducated to advocate for themselves, and even if they complain verbally, they don't complain in writing. But just because "only" one tenant does so, doesn't mean there isn't a problem, and that a picture is worth a thousand words, so I'm sending you photos.
And I realize you're really busy and I appreciate that you can't do anything about this. But, just a head's up, I'm escalating my complaint to the Fair Housing Dept of the state of CA.
I really appreciate the validation here. I think you are all right. This is a standard blow-off that businesses do to try and make you go away. If I'm the only one complaining, why would they put signs on all doors in and out, telling tenants how to try to get in, and that a repair man is coming the next day, unless they were being slammed with complaints?
Management actually told me their decision is final and they want me to be happy and feel safe, so if I don't like their decision, I'm welcome to look for housing elsewhere.
No kidding.
I sure hope fair housing nails their butts to the wall with a huge fine.
At any rate, when I got the "our decision is final" email, I completely ignored that and sent them another email telling them about how I just tried to get into the building and wasn't able to, until I tried 3 times with my key fob, and that I'll be letting them know every time that happens, because maybe they aren't aware of how often the system malfunctions.
The good news here is, I'm on Section 8 in this senior building, and they can't kick me out without cause. So, I don't have to worry about them not renewing my lease or raising my rent. As much as I hate the situation, I realized I can bug them daily if I want to, and they can't kick me out.
I had a similar situation in the last senior building I lived in, where there was a wine bar under our senior apartments, and the wine bar changed their live music to really loud rock bands that played until the wee hours of the morning. This was not what any of us signed up for. I tried a petition, but seniors don't want to get involved. They'd rather suffer in silence. Drives me nuts, but I wouldn't want to try that here, as I don't think many, if any, other tenants would sign it. They're all afraid of authority figures. So, trying that could actually backfire for me, if management found out, and they could say, "Hey, there's no problem! No other tenants would sign your petition!"
I may end up moving, if I can't get things improved, but in the meantime, I will not go quietly into the night.
Thanks for the feedback everyone! It's really helpful.
Section 8? Could they be trying to get rid of you on purpose? Maybe they have plans to go condo or they want to increase rent or something and need everyone out.
The apt building I live in, put in an electronic door system last year, where our keys to the building were taken away, and we were issued electronic key fobs.
The system is getting worse instead of better and I am fed up, so I started complaining. I'm being told that nobody else is complaining, and that they fix it within a reasonable amount of time (which can be several days waiting for the security system guy), and since everyone has a key to get in when it doesn't work - then too bad, so sad.
^^^We had those in our last apartment and they were a constant problem. Depending on the
weather (hot, cold, damp, etc...) it would take several attempts for the fob to do it's simple job -
to lock or unlock the door. Everyone we knew hated them and complained but there were put
there to stay.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mnseca
Very often businesses say that and it's a complete lie. You're the only one who complained, no one ever complained before, and so on. It's just to shut you up. Usually there are plenty of other complaints.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zennia
Never believe a landlord or building manager when they say no one else is complaining. They tell you that to shut you up so they don't have to fix anything. Chances are if it annoys you, it annoys other people. You're better off asking your neighbors if they've noticed any trouble with it. You might be surprised to hear that it drives them nuts and they've said something to management about it, too. Then you can all decide to do something about it together.
Regardless, I am often in the position of being the first to notice something is wrong, and not just with systems and things, but with people, too. This means that I'm also in the position of initially being branded a negative nellie, a complainer, a cage-rattler, etc., but then later I'm considered insightful, wise, and perceptive because I am almost never wrong about whatever or whoever it is that sets off my Spidey Sense. It's a pain in the neck, to be honest, and I can't stand the kind of thinking you describe.
^^reps. It takes something serious for me to complain and before I do, I research. Then comes the
process which Mnseca and Zennia mentioned. The blaming process and excuses begin:
First response: We've never heard of that before and/or no one else has complained.
Second response: It may be your device or the information we received is incorrect, yada, yada, yada
I understand that the representatives of the business or company have a script and most of the time
try to do what they can but they can only do so much. However, these are services which people
are paying for and should be reliable. Unfortunately, as someone else mentioned (Tia )many people
assume that someone else will call or complain and/or they might be afraid to do it thinking there
might be some negative consequences.
Were my complaints valid? Yes they were and people thanked me later.
btw, our internet is on the fritz again (access is erratic) and I asked the other residents who say the same, so guess what I have to do?
I'm impressed OP you took it so far, mad props to ya.
My landlord owes me over 10 years of interest on my security deposit - a state law that is to go to escrow. Some owners dont do that but follow the calculation model when returning said deposit. It is a LAW. I asked the owner about it - she said she has never heard of this law and I signed a lease that didnt mention this "promise" so I have no right to interest. The lease signing supersedes law per her. So....If I steal but signed a contract that it is ok to steal I cant be prosecuted, right?
Anyway, the dwelling has been in her family running it for over 50 years. NEVER heard of this LAW??? After hundreds of people moving in and out? I can't believe it.
Anyway, it takes effort to fight this but the OP motivates me. If it were say like $40 I would likely not pursue but it is over $700 right now (interest compounds).
Everyone's stories really give me strength to carry on the good fight. Thanks!
And magpiehere - I am a retired apt manager, and I also have helped people get their deposits back, etc. In CA landlords don't have to pay interest, which is scandalous, but they either know they're full of it, or they don't, but the law always wins in court. And if there's anything in the lease that's contrary to law, the law wins.
Unless you're in TX LOL. In TX they can put anything in a lease and it's legal pretty much.
But, I'd even fight them over $40. Because when I win, they also have to pay my court costs. Sometimes it's our job to be someone's consequence, I think. Us brave ones. And even though it's irritating as heck, when I am successful in rendering a consequence, it feels soooooo gooooooood!
And I always lay it all out for them to give them every opportunity to do the right thing to stay out of court. I show them the law, explain they'll have to pay my court costs when they'll lose, and if they insist on going to court, oh well. I think sometimes they honestly believe that because they've been getting away with stuff for a long time, that that fact alone makes them immune. I love to burst that bubble :-)
To the person who asked if they want to get rid of the Section 8 seniors - no. The owner bought this property with government subsidies that require him/her/them to rent to low income seniors, including Section 8 recipients. They are just cheap jerks. This is not a large non-profit corporation, like many subsidized places are owned. This is a private owner, who probably thought he'd get easy government money - without government intervention.
And I think they're determined to make this key system stay, since they invested in it - even if it is a failure.
Last edited by NoMoreSnowForMe; 10-01-2015 at 04:55 PM..
I've never heard of landlords paying interest on security deposits.
While I had one apartment where I was told 'their policy' was they never return security deposits under any circumstances, I've only lived in one apartment where I did get my deposit back- although places I've lived were left neat, clean, and without any needed repairs.
This thinking drives me nuts. Do you think businesses really believe this, or do you think they use this to justify not fixing the problem?
The apt building I live in, put in an electronic door system last year, where our keys to the building were taken away, and we were issued electronic key fobs.
This system malfunctions regularly. When it does, we can use an emergency regular key to a door that is in a really inconvenient location. I can only guess they did this, so people wouldn't just use the regular key instead of the fob, which tracks us when we use it to get into the building.
The system is getting worse instead of better and I am fed up, so I started complaining. I'm being told that nobody else is complaining, and that they fix it within a reasonable amount of time (which can be several days waiting for the security system guy), and since everyone has a key to get in when it doesn't work - then too bad, so sad.
Does this make any sense to you? If only one person is bold enough to start complaining to management, that that means it can't be that bad?
That is what they say when they dont want to hear any more of your legitimate complaining - to make you feel bad for pointing out something that they should have fixed. it is to make you feel bad so that you would go away and they wont have to do their job. Truth is truth, even if 100 people make a lie, the truth is the truth. the other people might be too timid to speak up, or maybe they are willing to put up with crap treatment. so their silence does not validate them and make it true.
In my first job, my boss overheard me on the phone with a customer. I was saying, "Yes, you aren't the only one who has had that complaint - we will definitely try to get to the bottom of it." I was lectured extensively about never admitting liability, blah blah blah... that was a defining moment for me.
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