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I always hear both men and women complain about the opposite sex's view on sex. I actually think that when it comes to relations between men and women that the opposing views on sex are actually the easiest part to understand. Here is my take as to why men and women have different attitudes on sex.
1) Men have a higher sex drive than women:
Let's get the obvious out of the way.
Now I know some women will chime in and say, "Oh, we enjoy sex as much if not more than men". That may very well be true. Women are capable of multiple orgasm and they certainly are longer and seem more intense than a man's orgasm, but I am not talking about sexual enjoyment, I'm talking about sex drive.
Men are programmed to have a lot of sex with as many willing partners as possible. We are always thinking about it and anytime we see a woman we automatically size her up. I've had serious conversations about important matters with other guys that will be interrupted by the appearance of an attractive jogger without a bra. And women have no idea what it is really like. Women will say, "I have some dirty thoughts. I can be a bit of a pervert too" but as Louis CK said in response, "You GET to have those thoughts. Men HAVE to have those thoughts".
I've seen a lot of conservatives say that gay men are promiscuous because they are gay. That's not true, they are promiscuous because they are men. Think about it, they are men who are seeking out sex with men who are also seeking out sex with men. That's about as close a sure thing as you're gonna get. A couple years back I was visiting Sydney, Australia and my hotel was on one of the main strips for nightlife in the city. What I didn't know at the time was that my hotel was located in the gay village part of the strip and to go to the bars and clubs catering to heterosexuals I had to pass a few blocks of gay bars and clubs. I'm not particularly homophobic and I am secure in my sexuality, so it really didn't bother me. However, in my 15 minute walk I would get hit on or even blatantly offered sex by gay men at least twice a night. The men ranged for looking the winners of the Danny DeVito look-a-like contest to looking like Calvin Klein models. As a matter of fact, a guy who looked like a male model started a conversation and offered sex in pretty explicit terms (he said he was both a "top and bottom") within two minutes. Now, I have NEVER had a woman come up to me and offer sex like that. Especially one that would be comparably attractive woman and if such an event did occur it would be at a hotel bar and it would cost me $500 for 20 minutes.
If you want to put it in drug terms. Sex to women is like Ecstasy. It's intense, fun, and thrilling and can even be a pivotal moment in their life, but it is not exactly addicting and even though they want to do it again, it will be at a place of their own time and choosing. Sex to men is like heroin. It gives us enjoyment quite like nothing else, but at the expense of making us a slave and constantly seeking the next fix and futile attempts top the rush we felt during the first couple of times we did it. We'll do it in a bar bathroom stall, in a back alley, on a park bench, in a car, and wherever we can get it. If we don't get it, we can rely on methadone (masturbation), but it just isn't the same and we mostly do it to keep us functional in the meantime.
2) Women are more selective than men:
a) Women are pickier than men. Women are more careful about who they sleep with and tend to stick with their type a lot more strictly than men. Now, all women are different. Some like bad boys, some like nice guys, some professionals, some like blue-collar men, some like muscular guys, some like skinny guys, and so on. But they tend to stick with those types of guys and like those type of guys. I have heard quite a few women completely rule out a hypothetical tryst with a male celebrity almost universally considered attractive based on a relatively minor thing. "Brad Pitt? Ewww! I don't like guys with stubble." You'll never hear a guy say, "Megan Fox?! No! Her lips are too thin."
I used to know a guy who would have sex with literally any woman willing to have sex with him. He was actually a reasonably good looking guy (he looked like Jason Biggs with a shaved head) and he was one of few guys I knew with actual game (in that he could actually focus on and charm a woman who wasn't interested as opposed to merely using a numbers game), but he also gladly slept with with some of the worst looking women on the planet as well and was proud of it. His reasons were that all women have something attractive about them if you look hard enough (which is actually kind of sweet) and his other was that p---y has no face (which is significantly less sweet). I've meet a couple other guys like him, but no women like him.
Why are women pickier? Well, simple biology. A woman would have to carry the offspring of her sexual partner if she were to get pregnant. Now, with birth control and abortion this isn't the same problem as it used to be, but the deep seated instinct is still there. Modern birth control and the legalization of abortion have all occurred during the last 100 years, but that's against several hundred million years of evolution. In all species the females are more selective than the males. A guy can impregnate hundreds or thousands of women (he is only limited by his options in the physical sense), but realistically a woman can get pregnant and successfully carry a baby to term only a few times in her life and it takes a lot of work and resources to do so. Biologically it is within her best interest to be careful who she sleeps with. I mean she might find a guy physically attractive enough that she wouldn't be fighting back vomit during sex, but her subconscious mind is remind her of the man's googly eye and stubby legs and is telling her, "Do you really want to carry his children?"
b) Women have more options than men. While there is a lot of overlap with the previous statements, this one is more cultural than biological. Women grow up being offered sex and relationships all the time. I was reading a post on this very forum where a woman who claimed she was unattractive, but was constantly being offered sex by men. You will never see an ugly man complaining about all the women who want to use him for sex. That ugly man is happy if a woman (never mind one that is more attractive than him) shows him any interest. He probably reads that post and says to himself, "I wish I had your problems, lady". Such is one of the advantages of being a woman.
Chris Rock once touched on this. He said that, "It's easy for you to turn down sex. It ain't no thing for y'all to turn down sex. Because ever since you were 13 every guy you've met has been trying to f--k you." It's true. Women are always being offered sex in one form or another and have been since their early teens.
You see, if you view sex like as a resource, you will realize its value is like any other. Supply and demand. For women, penis is a nearly inexhaustible resource that is easily obtained like air. For most men, vagina is a precious commodity that usually requires more time and labor to acquire in comparison to penis.
Don't believe me? Get an equal number of men and women together of roughly average looks, arrange them into teams of Men versus Women, and take them to a singles bar. The winning team will be the one where the most participants have successfully had a one-night stand. Put up some type of cash prize as an incentive of course. The women will always beat the men because they can could find a guy willing to sleep with them in 20 minutes while the guys will be out there all night throwing drunken sex pitches.
Hell, the women could stand on a table and shout out, "Who wants to f--k us?" and they can just pick out the best looking volunteers and end the night in ten minutes.
3) There is a societal double standard towards sex for men and women:
Men with a lot of sexual partners are praised and women with a lot of sexual partners are condemned. If I went out to a bar and took home a group of six women I found at the bar and sex with all of them, I would be legendary among some people I know. I know women who would give me a high five for such an amazing display of sexual prowess. If a women went out and found a group of six guys and had sex with all of them (and like I said before, most women could do so quite easily), she would be called a skank. Everyone would either be laughing at the girl who's idea of a good time is a gangbang or there would be people who were convinced it must have been rape because why would any sane woman want to do that.
I think that is one of the messed up aspects of our culture. Is that men are praised for causal sex, but women are judged for it. I know a woman in her late 20s who encourages her male friends to engage in as many sexual conquests as possible (including myself), but is judgmental of her female friends doing the same thing. Which makes me wonder, if women are supposed to be chaste and men are supposed to be promiscuous, who are men supposed to have sex with? I guess she implicitly supports the system in Ancient Greece where men would have sex with each other until they got married.
Even if society's attitudes towards female sexuality were far less hypocritical, I still believe women would still be more choosy about who they slept with than men for the above reasons, but at least we could all be more adult about adult issues.
Mod comment: Note that this old thread was resurrected on 07/07/2019, at post 120.
I give you a lot of credit for approaching this often contentious subject in a dignified and academic way. Usually it is the voice of frustration that leads to threads like this, but that does not seem to be the case here. Still threads of this nature tend to get out of hand quickly because we can't seem to be "adult about adult issues."
I think sex is a need for both men and women, but generally agree that it is more of a driving force in a man's life than a woman's. For example, there is not a day pass I don't think of it. Multiple times. My wife, not so much. My wife once told me "I'm a slow cooker, not a microwave." I have to get her used to the idea of having sex whereas if she just looked up from her book and said, "let's go" I would drop what I was doing and go. Back in the worst of my man whoring days I would occasionally meet women who boasted having a sex drive stronger than any man they'd ever met. Without exception these women's sex drives were laughable compared to my own. I'm not entirely convinced I have a sex drive that much stronger than the average man, so I am forced to conclude she was either over-estimating herself, lying outright, or had slept with a bunch of low-drive men in her time.
Is this disparity natural? I think so. And while it does lead to frustration and sometimes even an "us vs them" mentality I think it is important to recognize we're all in it together. This is also why I believe monogamy is more a natural human instinct than a lot of people realize. Growing sexually with a person often enhances the experience. In a healthy relationship, quality will overcome quantity where one person's sex drive is significantly lower than the other.
I'm sorry, but you need to get out more if you think that women aren't able to be addicted to sex and to want it all the time. Some women I've been with were insatiable. You are right that they will have sex "at a place of their own time and choosing", they will hunt you down and jump you. Gotta watch your back.
The difference with women I'd say is that they tend to do that in relationships with one person, a smaller percentage go about it with many different partners.
I'm sorry, but you need to get out more if you think that women aren't able to be addicted to sex and to want it all the time. Some women I've been with were insatiable. You are right that they will have sex "at a place of their own time and choosing", they will hunt you down and jump you. Gotta watch your back.
The difference with women I'd say is that they tend to do that in relationships with one person, a smaller percentage go about it with many different partners.
These are just generalities and obviously don't apply to everyone. Are there some hypersexual women out there? Yeah, but far less than men. Are there some women who will have sex with anybody? Yeah, but most of them are either at the bottom of the barrel when it comes to looks or work in the sex industry.
Every woman I've been with has been rather, um, "extroverted"* and I've only had casual flings. A lot of what I said doesn't apply to them, but they are the outliers.
*The first girl I was with told me that she wanted to "break [me] in".
1. You claim that men have a higher sex drive than women, but what do you cite as evidence for that? A conversation with men that gets interrupted when an attractive woman passes by. How do you know women don't have the same reaction when a hot guy walks by? Maybe they're thinking the same thing. Just because they don't suddenly turn their heads and let their jaws hit the floor doesn't mean they haven't noticed the guy passing by. You also mention how gay guys would come up to you and offer sex but no women have. Maybe the reason those men were so aggressive is because they were competing with all the other gay men nearby. And maybe the reason women don't come up to you and offer sex is because they have so many other men to choose from. You can't measure the strength of someone's drive for something just on how aggressive they are in pursuing it without also taking into account how readily available that something is. You talked about supply and demand. Well, the Earth has a pretty big supply of oxygen. Does the fact that I'm not out aggressively chasing after oxygen prove that I don't have a strong desire for it? Of course not.
2. If women are more selective than men, it's because women have more to lose. You brought up the issue of pregnancy. A guy can sleep with a woman, get her pregnant, and then leave her stuck with raising the child. The woman, on the other hand, has to be more careful. But let's take that risk out of the equation. Next you have the stigma attached to women who sleep around. But that's in decline. It's still there, but not quite as bad as it was in the past. More and more, society is getting used to the idea of a woman having a sexual appetite. So if we take these two, risk of pregnancy and risk of being called promiscuous, out of the picture, would women still be pickier than men? Probably, but only if they can afford to be. A person's pickiness is based on their options. If they think they have lots of options, they'll be picky. If they think they have few options, then they'll probably be less choosy. I find the examples you gave amusing though. You say that you'll never hear a guy say that Megan Fox has lips that are too thin. But I've heard plenty of guys say they're turned off by all her tattoos. Likewise, a lot of guys will turn down sex with a hot girl if they discover that she smokes. You say you know a guy who'll have sex with any woman, but you've never met a woman like that. Well, they do exist. They're called sex addicts.
The first three erroneous beliefs that jump out at me:
1) Men have higher sex drives. This has been covered on this forum thoroughly. The conclusion was that men feel their drive more intensely when it's up for them, but it's sporadic. Once they get that release, it's over for them until next time. The general consensus among the guys was that twice/week was enough. This, from 20-something guys. Women, on the other hand, have a much more constant drive when they're in a relationship. (i.e. when there's actually the prospect of satisfying their drive). Some women need sex daily, even multiple times daily. Men's vs. women's drives are completely different. So much for "the obvious".
2) Women are pickier than men due to the risk of pregnancy. That's not why women are pickier. They're pickier because they have to make sure the guy they're with is invested enough in them emotionally that he'll be a thoughtful, considerate lover, and make sure the woman gets her "O". Many men with no investment in the woman they're with (as with ONS) don't bother. Some posters here have even fessed up to that.
3) Women have more options than men. So wrong. The top 20-30% of women may have more options. The rest get bubkus, with rare exceptions.
Back to the drawing board. :-/
Last edited by Ruth4Truth; 06-22-2014 at 08:12 AM..
The first three erroneous beliefs that jump out at me:
1) Men have higher sex drives. This has been covered on this forum thoroughly. The conclusion was that men feel their drive more intensely when it's up for them, but it's sporadic. Once they get that release, it's over for them until next time. The general consensus among the guys was that twice/week was enough. This, from 20-something guys. Women, on the other hand, have a much more constant drive when they're in a relationship. (i.e. when there's actually the prospect of satisfying their drive). Some women need sex daily, even multiple times daily. Men's vs. women's drives are completely different. So much for "the obvious".
2) Women are pickier than men due to the risk of pregnancy. That's not why women are pickier. They're pickier because they have to make sure the guy they're with is invested enough in them emotionally that he'll be a thoughtful, considerate lover, and make sure the woman gets her "O". Many men with no investment in the woman they're with (as with ONS) don't bother. Some posters here have even fessed up to that.
3) Women have more options than men. So wrong. The top 20-30% of women may have more options. The rest get bubkus, with rare exceptions.
Back to the drawing board. :-/
Great points from Ruth, and ESPECIALLY the bolded part! Amen, sister. I will add that speaking for myself (and probably most women) we want more out of sex than JUST your thrusting, we need erotic kissing, stroking, massage and other types of extended foreplay to become fully aroused and have our orgasm. Too many men don't want to bother with any of that, so you can't blame us women for being picky/careful about who we have sex with.
At any rate, I find this an extremely interesting thread, I enjoyed your post, OP, and hope the discussion can continue and have this thread stay open.
Great points from Ruth, and ESPECIALLY the bolded part! Amen, sister. I will add that speaking for myself (and probably most women) we want more out of sex than JUST your thrusting, we need erotic kissing, stroking, massage and other types of extended foreplay to become fully aroused and have our orgasm. Too many men don't want to bother with any of that, so you can't blame us women for being picky/careful about who we have sex with.
At any rate, I find this an extremely interesting thread, I enjoyed your post, OP, and hope the discussion can continue and have this thread stay open.
Agreed. That was my whole argument in the Women hiring escorts thread. A woman can't just pick up any guy off the street, because he's just gonna wanna get in, thrust, get off, and be done afterward. A guy you just pick up anyplace has higher chances of not caring enough to give foreplay. That's why a woman could pay instead of, as most guys suggested "get a friend, or any guy off the street to do it." Women pay to possibly get the extra that just any ol guy won't care enough to give.
I am like that. If I get with a guy, and it seems like he's not gonna put extra effort in, I am going to stop in the middle and leave lol I don't do quickie. Unless I am tired lol
And some guys watch alot of porn, so they think women care about big packages and how hard he can bring it. That's ok, but porn is all fake. And in real life, many women want more than that. And in reality, many women aren't as hung up on size for a man, because it takes more than a big rod to make a good lover. And sometimes if it's over a certain size, it hurts women more than feeling good.
So, sometimes it's not about women having a low drive, or not liking sex as much, but it's tons of other things they are considering, whereas a guy's main concern is that she's hot, and doesn't just lay on her back during. lol
Last edited by HappyRain; 06-22-2014 at 09:27 AM..
Agreed. That was my whole argument in the Women hiring escorts thread. A woman can't just pick up any guy off the street, because he's just gonna wanna get in, thrust, get off, and be done afterward. A guy you just pick up anyplace has higher chances of not caring enough to give foreplay. That's why a woman could pay instead of, as most guys suggested "get a friend, or any guy off the street to do it." Women pay to possibly get the extra that just any ol guy won't care enough to give.
I'm surprised that point still didn't get across on that thread. I don't know why so many guys just don't get it. It's fundamental, for women. It's almost scary how out of touch men are with women's sexuality. I don't know how that's possible.
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So if we take these two, risk of pregnancy and risk of being called promiscuous, out of the picture, would women still be pickier than men? Probably, but only if they can afford to be. A person's pickiness is based on their options. If they think they have lots of options, they'll be picky. If they think they have few options, then they'll probably be less choosy. I find the examples you gave amusing though. You say that you'll never hear a guy say that Megan Fox has lips that are too thin. But I've heard plenty of guys say they're turned off by all her tattoos. Likewise, a lot of guys will turn down sex with a hot girl if they discover that she smokes. You say you know a guy who'll have sex with any woman, but you've never met a woman like that. Well, they do exist. They're called sex addicts.
I will add that speaking for myself (and probably most women) we want more out of sex than JUST your thrusting, we need erotic kissing, stroking, massage and other types of extended foreplay to become fully aroused and have our orgasm. Too many men don't want to bother with any of that, so you can't blame us women for being picky/careful about who we have sex with.
