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Losing weight might be hard, no doubt. Aside from that though, do you think that make up, makeovers, different hairstyles, etc. could improve a woman’s appearance to a significant degree?
Probably not to a "significant" degree. I am someone who never had a date in high school and didn't have much luck in the way of attracting men during the rest of my life, either, although I did manage to marry (an alcoholic/gambler, they aren't as picky about looks if you have a good job and codependent tendencies) and have one child, who is bizarrely prettier than average. People actually have always and occasionally still say to me, "That's YOUR daughter?"
New hairstyles, makeup, etc., made some improvements for me so that I was able to elevate myself to "presentable" and "don't need a bag over my head", but those things did not change my basic facial features--I look like my father if he were wearing a long wig--or the condition of my skin or the texture of my hair or the fact that I was six feet tall. I saved all my money from my first job at 16 to get contact lenses, my mother took me to several dermatologists, which helped very little in controlling the godawful acne I had well into my 20s (at 64, the scars are still visible on my face), I burned out several hair dryers trying to control my too-thick, unruly hair. It was WORK just to get to "presentable". I was very thin back then, which came along with flat-chested.
But something that I don't see addressed often in conversations about unattractive women is that even when we get to presentable, we are still behind. Normal girls go through the stages in their teens of learning HOW to date, having a boy hold their hand, having a first kiss behind the school, learning how to flirt in a way that gets responses. The women who missed out on all that are in uncharted waters when they finally get a chance to dip their toes into the waves.
I was in my forties before a man held my hand, and I was divorced after a sixteen year relationship/marriage at that point. The same man held my chair for me at dinner. We only dated a few months before it ended amicably because his pre-teen son was coming to live with him and he was not going to be able to maintain a real relationship, and I had a kid of my own near that age to raise. It was more than twenty years ago. I looked him up on the Internet a few years back and learned that he had died. But I will always remember him, because he was the first man who held my hand like a real boyfriend.
I did end up in a good, though too-short relationship late in life that ended with his death, but we began our relationship through our words, sight unseen, and fell in love before we knew what each other looked like. In the interim, the only real approaches I ever received were from married men, mostly coworkers, who sought something something on the side. It didn't matter to them what I looked like, because they weren't going to be seen in public with me anyway. I chose to throw myself into my work instead and gave up looking until the last one fell into my life from nowhere.
But no one in my entire life has ever said, "Gee, Mighty Queen looks good to me. I think I'll ask her out." And I am not alone, not by a long shot. There are many like me out there, invisible to the world.
Well, I and many of us here have seen your photo. "Mighty Queen looks good to me", and others have said the same!!
Ha, thanks, but that was seven years ago and cleverly taken by my daughter from ABOVE me. (That is in the stairway of the 12-century Sainte-Chappelle in Paris, by the way.)
Also, I am old now. Time has a way of shortening the gap between beauty and homeliness when one reaches a certain age range.
A lot of people out there think a woman has an easier time finding a romantic partner regardless of looks and the answer is no. There is a lot of gas lighting of women who find ourselves unattractive too, we are told we don't look as bad as we think. The reality is that life is not fair and some women get a ridiculously bad hand when it comes to appearance.
(venting here)
I've long accepted my looks (even though it was hard) but by the age of 14 I knew I was going to never find a romantic partner. By that age I was 210 pounds and covered in cystic acne, my facial features were awful with a large nose, long face, no chin and an enormous forehead. I had a very difficult hair type too- very coarse and could not really be tamed. At that age people were already starting to couple up in eighth grade so the pain of romantic rejection had just started for me.
The older I got the worse my looks became, my acne got worse, I couldn't lose weight, I grew facial hair and some how manged to get even uglier facially. My acne persisted until age 30 and I was left with bad scars on the my face and body. I developed a parotid gland tumor in my face and the removal of it left me with minor facial paralysis at 24. Even in my adult years people still tried to mock me for my appearance - especially strangers.
I've lost weight but will never be thin. My body has never been '''nice'' - it's just bad all around, weight loss or no weight loss and of course I'm still ugly. Bad teeth too despite years of dental intervention. Hair is still horrible - I've always had that hair type that can break brushes in half. At 33 I've never been on a date, never been kissed never any romantic opportunities. But as I said, I have reached a point of acceptance of that. I do wish society had more acceptance, belief and empathy for unattractive women. We do exist and sometimes no amount of ''glow ups'' will help us our genetics are such a way that improvement is hopeless. We're not all victims of self hatred and low self esteem either. Some of just want to have our story heard. Is it so hard to believe?
For the record OP I disagree with the poster who said you had a low self esteem and were looking for a pity party. Your post was simply straightforward, honest and really quite brave.
My Dad always said that a person who is born unattractive already has a a huge strike against them. The poster who mentioned that it's particularly difficult for unattractive woman is so right. Harder to get a job, earn as much money etc etc. Look at some of the announcers on the financial news networks? They are nowhere near where the woman are in looks and many are well below average. And yet they have no difficulty getting hired and reporting on finances. One of these gentlemen even has a voice that sounds so strained it's like he's being strangled. I kid you not. And they are much older than the woman (who mostly look like supermodels or are older but you can tell they are aging beauties) I don't get it.
What you wrote are facts not ploys for sympathy. I did not get that from your post at all. You may not realize it OP but your post will help a lot of people who will follow your thread.
I asked for empathy, not sympathy (those are different things). What I am tired of is the ''disbelief'' about the experiences ugly women. A lot of people don't even want to admit ugly women exist at all. The gas lighting thing is the belief that it all must stem from low self esteem as opposed to physicality.
The reality is ugly women do exist and so do ugly men. But folks have never heard our side - they hear about the male incels but never us. Few ugly women choose bitterness overall. Some do but not as many as the men as ugly males arguably use the incel communities as a coping mechanism over their looks.
A broader conversation needs to be had about looks in general. Society definitely over values it.
Well, if you make an issue of the difference between empathy and sympathy, then you know that not everyone is going to be able to give you empathy. Gorgeous women won't. Men won't.
I would beg to differ on less attractive women not having communities to turn to as a coping mechanism. There are so many online communities and influencer pages for that. There is the body acceptance community, the silver disobedience movement (because heaven forbid women have gray hair or are over 50), different influencers who are quite homely who have huge followings where women talk among themselves, acne-positive influencers, etc.
The difference from what I see is that these women (and the men who support them) seek to build one another up, instead of wallowing in anger, self-pity, blaming, and hatred of other people the way incels do in their communities. The incel groups online are toxic as all hecc and not something to be admired or used as any kind of model of anything healthy.
As for looks being overvalued, yes, sure. Many would agree with you. But physical beauty will always confer certain advantages, and there is nothing you or anyone else can do to change that. Beautiful people will attract more potential mates. Beautiful people are often thought to be smarter and kinder than they really are. Beautiful people are thought to be more physically or mentally healthy than others. That is just human reaction. The only way around it is people getting to know one another, and you can't do that in the split-second it takes to form a first impression. It is what it is.
But as I said, I have reached a point of acceptance of that. I do wish society had more acceptance, belief and empathy for unattractive women. We do exist and sometimes no amount of ''glow ups'' will help us our genetics are such a way that improvement is hopeless. We're not all victims of self hatred and low self esteem either. Some of just want to have our story heard. Is it so hard to believe?
Yeah, I suppose a lot of us would like it if society had more empathy and compassion for people. A lot of us probably wish that people and society would change for the better but, like you said, sometimes it takes acceptance. In my humble understanding, acceptance is more than just realizing that something is true. A person can realize that something is true and still be very upset about it and not come to grips with it. But I think acceptance is finally getting to a point where a person is not so angry or bitter about things anymore. To where things about it don’t really hurt them anymore.
And with that, I guess people need the acceptance that life isn’t fair and that people are dealt different hands. One thing I can say is that though people have different obstacles and challenges to overcome in life, one might could look at life as a long game of poker or something. Even if the first hand or two that they are dealt were bad, if they consistently play their hands well to the best of their ability (or, in life, make the best choices based on the options they are given and work as well as they can with what they have), they might be able to end up fairly well, even if they started behind.
Losing weight might be hard, no doubt. Aside from that though, do you think that make up, makeovers, different hairstyles, etc. could improve a woman’s appearance to a significant degree?
Absolutely yes. My whole face changes depending on where I part my hair, how my hair is cut, and what color it is. Using the wrong tones with make-up can make a perfectly fine-looking person look sick and washed-out. Using the right tones can brighten a face and bring out one's best features. Eyebrow shape matters, too. And there are other tricks. One of my eyes is noticeably bigger than the other, but I've learned some tricks with eyeliner to balance them out.
Unflattering clothes are, well, unflattering. I'm an apple shape. Never have I ever or would I ever bare my midriff. It's the wrong part of me to call attention to. The wrong waistline on me matters, too--I look great in A-line and empire waists. Pencil skirts, not so much. My best features are my chest and my legs, so that's what I dress around. The wrong neckline is also awful. Turtlenecks give me a double-chin. V-necks and scoopnecks are va-va-voom on me.
There are a ton of tutorials on YouTube for how to apply make-up and dress right that show you what to do and what not to do. Some of the make-up tutorials even do one side of the face right and one side of the face wrong to show what a difference it makes.
A lot of people out there think a woman has an easier time finding a romantic partner regardless of looks and the answer is no. There is a lot of gas lighting of women who find ourselves unattractive too, we are told we don't look as bad as we think. The reality is that life is not fair and some women get a ridiculously bad hand when it comes to appearance.
(venting here)
I've long accepted my looks (even though it was hard) but by the age of 14 I knew I was going to never find a romantic partner. By that age I was 210 pounds and covered in cystic acne, my facial features were awful with a large nose, long face, no chin and an enormous forehead. I had a very difficult hair type too- very coarse and could not really be tamed. At that age people were already starting to couple up in eighth grade so the pain of romantic rejection had just started for me.
The older I got the worse my looks became, my acne got worse, I couldn't lose weight, I grew facial hair and some how manged to get even uglier facially. My acne persisted until age 30 and I was left with bad scars on the my face and body. I developed a parotid gland tumor in my face and the removal of it left me with minor facial paralysis at 24. Even in my adult years people still tried to mock me for my appearance - especially strangers.
I've lost weight but will never be thin. My body has never been '''nice'' - it's just bad all around, weight loss or no weight loss and of course I'm still ugly. Bad teeth too despite years of dental intervention. Hair is still horrible - I've always had that hair type that can break brushes in half. At 33 I've never been on a date, never been kissed never any romantic opportunities. But as I said, I have reached a point of acceptance of that. I do wish society had more acceptance, belief and empathy for unattractive women. We do exist and sometimes no amount of ''glow ups'' will help us our genetics are such a way that improvement is hopeless. We're not all victims of self hatred and low self esteem either. Some of just want to have our story heard. Is it so hard to believe?
something you don't expect to happen to a woman, normally you expect cases like this to be male-dominated, and more than likely they are male-dominated, should be cruelly obvious as to why nature and reality is cruel like that.
A lot of people out there think a woman has an easier time finding a romantic partner regardless of looks and the answer is no. There is a lot of gas lighting of women who find ourselves unattractive too, we are told we don't look as bad as we think. The reality is that life is not fair and some women get a ridiculously bad hand when it comes to appearance.
(venting here)
I've long accepted my looks (even though it was hard) but by the age of 14 I knew I was going to never find a romantic partner. By that age I was 210 pounds and covered in cystic acne, my facial features were awful with a large nose, long face, no chin and an enormous forehead. I had a very difficult hair type too- very coarse and could not really be tamed. At that age people were already starting to couple up in eighth grade so the pain of romantic rejection had just started for me.
The older I got the worse my looks became, my acne got worse, I couldn't lose weight, I grew facial hair and some how manged to get even uglier facially. My acne persisted until age 30 and I was left with bad scars on the my face and body. I developed a parotid gland tumor in my face and the removal of it left me with minor facial paralysis at 24. Even in my adult years people still tried to mock me for my appearance - especially strangers.
I've lost weight but will never be thin. My body has never been '''nice'' - it's just bad all around, weight loss or no weight loss and of course I'm still ugly. Bad teeth too despite years of dental intervention. Hair is still horrible - I've always had that hair type that can break brushes in half. At 33 I've never been on a date, never been kissed never any romantic opportunities. But as I said, I have reached a point of acceptance of that. I do wish society had more acceptance, belief and empathy for unattractive women. We do exist and sometimes no amount of ''glow ups'' will help us our genetics are such a way that improvement is hopeless. We're not all victims of self hatred and low self esteem either. Some of just want to have our story heard. Is it so hard to believe?
You are pointing to an important truth about how insensitive comments can be about this type of topic. In fairness, I think when people talk about how easier it is for women to meet someone, they talk about opportunities for getting a date or for sexual conquest, not so much for getting into a fulfilling relationship. Very attractive women (or men, I should say) tend to have their own lots of problems when it comes to making a relationship work on the long term: having so much opportunity creates problem of its own.
The trope isn't completely a myth, though. As far as I know, studies and data analysis from online dating ranking behavior have rather convincingly demonstrated that men and women rank each other's attractiveness according to resolutely different statistical distributions. I.e. men feel sexually attracted by a much larger fraction of the opposite sex population than women.
But yes, this leads to a discourse about dating experiences that may leave a lot of people, tens of millions of people just in north america, realistically, feeling like they are not part of the discussion.
You are pointing to an important truth about how insensitive comments can be about this type of topic. In fairness, I think when people talk about how easier it is for women to meet someone, they talk about opportunities for getting a date or for sexual conquest, not so much for getting into a fulfilling relationship. Very attractive women (or men, I should say) tend to have their own lots of problems when it comes to making a relationship work on the long term: having so much opportunity creates problem of its own.
The trope isn't completely a myth, though. As far as I know, studies and data analysis from online dating ranking behavior have rather convincingly demonstrated that men and women rank each other's attractiveness according to resolutely different statistical distributions. I.e. men feel sexually attracted by a much larger fraction of the opposite sex population than women.
But yes, this leads to a discourse about dating experiences that may leave a lot of people, tens of millions of people just in north america, realistically, feeling like they are not part of the discussion.
probably because the gender dynamic thats been in place for all time, men being expected to make the first move and court women, do the pursuing, be the initiators, is why a lot of people think women on average, have an easier time getting opportunities for dates and relationships than men do. Why do i get the feeling that one-sided gender dynamic will never change, hence why there will always be more male wizards than female wizards.
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