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How did your father do that? Just curious, because I like to be honest with people. If they did something that was really damaging they should truly understand the gravity of it, the consequences and that they should make amends to the damaged party. It is not to humiliate.
Do you feel that you are fully over the defensiveness or could the old habits return if someone doesn't approach you in the right way?
Interesting to say that. I've found in general that if I need to get someone to truly understand the gravity and seriousness of a situation, they aren't likely to acknowledge being wrong in the first place. Those who acknowledge they made a mistake generally understand the importance and there is no need for more.
Is this just pure ego? If someone did something wrong, even not intentionally but made a mistake, this is part of life and it's how we learn. But if we don't admit that we made this error and instead deny it or get defensive or blame others we don't learn and will probably keep repeating the behavior.
Sometimes people make mistakes together. One person will admit their part and the other takes this as the other person is totally responsible and they are off the hook, or even a victim. It is like an opportunity to not only fail to take responsibility but to push it on someone else who is doing the right thing by admitting their part.
I guess I wanted to try to understand this behavior, and if people who think this way can change.
It's arrogance. Pride.
Some folks have the wrong view of themselves. The lack humility.
If a mistake occurs and the reaction is disrespectful, I don't apologize because the consequences were already given. My mistakes are no different from other people, yet I have seen cool heads when it happens.
How did your father do that? Just curious, because I like to be honest with people. If they did something that was really damaging they should truly understand the gravity of it, the consequences and that they should make amends to the damaged party. It is not to humiliate.
Do you feel that you are fully over the defensiveness or could the old habits return if someone doesn't approach you in the right way?
Without going into specifics, he would weaponize it. He would rub it in people’s faces, continue to tear them down after admitting wrong, and later refer back to the incident to attack a person’s credibility. Basically, the opposite of being magnanimous in victory.
Yes, at this state of my life I am over it. Life experience has taught me that his behavior was not normal or healthy. I am both okay with admitting wrong, and also make an effort to create a safe space for people to admit their wrongs, and my ego does not depend on being right.
Many people have a singular trait that defines them to themselves. It's who they are.
For example, some people are considered beautiful, and their beauty gives them confidence.
Some people are considered smart and being knowledgeable gives them confidence.
When either of these traits are diminished or proven false, an internal struggle ensues.
If the beautiful woman is suddenly disfigured, she feels that she has lost "who she was" and has no other positive identity. She may refuse to socialize or even leave her home.
If a person who is considered smart is proven to be wrong, she may feel that she has lost "who she was" and will insist she is right so as to regain her internal identity and confidence. After all, she is smart, so how can she be wrong? This results in cognitive dissonance in which her internal beliefs conflict with external reality.
As Pete "Maverick" Mitchell says: "Naval Aviator Is Not What I Am. It's Who I Am."
What happens when he is no longer a naval aviator?
Interesting to say that. I've found in general that if I need to get someone to truly understand the gravity and seriousness of a situation, they aren't likely to acknowledge being wrong in the first place. Those who acknowledge they made a mistake generally understand the importance and there is no need for more.
Then it seems like you have to just give up on these people.
I would at least spell it all out first just for clarity. If they keep justifying denying and deflecting then at least I tried.
Some people are in a kind of stubborn denial. Narcissists do this but I'm not talking about dealing with narcissists, but people who actually think they are doing the right things but are really causing problems for others that everyone but them can see.
Isn't it at all possible someone can be made to understand this and change the behavior?
I think some people can change particularly if they aren't character disordered. But because these kinds of things are imbedded in the subconscious it takes some kind of a shock, an interventional event, to call it to their attention.
It requires recognition of the fact, insight into how the behavior is hurting them and others and the ability to appreciate that. Then it takes instruction in how to alter the behavior in a way that protects or creates (rebuilds may be a better word) their sense of wholeness. Essentially the psychological healing process.
Is it pure ego?
Not exactly, unless you know that ego is the birthplace of shame, jealously, pride, fear, and the like.
When someone can't say they are wrong ..2 things both based in fear....they will be punished or they will be rejected.
(Stemming from the core fear of abandonment as a baby.)
A chapter could be written on this.
Feel empathy for their trauma and scars, usually always from childhood...even in the crib...terrible.
Is it pure ego?
Not exactly, unless you know that ego is the birthplace of shame, jealously, pride, fear, and the like.
When someone can't say they are wrong ..2 things both based in fear....they will be punished or they will be rejected.
(Stemming from the core fear of abandonment as a baby.)
A chapter could be written on this.
Feel empathy for their trauma and scars, usually always from childhood...even in the crib...terrible.
I disagree with you, it is plain and simple, PRIDE.
Pride and Arrogance rule the roost. Folks can't admit to anything, their main problem is very simple.
I think some people can change particularly if they aren't character disordered. But because these kinds of things are imbedded in the subconscious it takes some kind of a shock, an interventional event, to call it to their attention.
It requires recognition of the fact, insight into how the behavior is hurting them and others and the ability to appreciate that. Then it takes instruction in how to alter the behavior in a way that protects or creates (rebuilds may be a better word) their sense of wholeness. Essentially the psychological healing process.
It sounds like a lot of work and difficult for people like that to process. I doubt many would have the strength or will to complete it.
I'm thinking of all the broken families. Even after a divorce where one party did something particularly destructive often they don't acknowledge their part and will blame the spouse. If divorce doesn't shock a person into doing some serious introspection, not sure what would.
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