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I think a major difference between the three most recent working generations (Baby Boomers, Gen-X, and Millennial) are the complaints, blame, and finger pointing. BB and Gen-X certainly had their gripes about what they went through compared to their parents generation, but they simply sucked it up and found a way to make the world for for them. I am solid Gen-X, and I was from the era where we weren't making anything close what our parents were, no job market stability, no pensions, and zero corporate loyalty - but we put our heads down and carved out a great life seeking out success and happiness wherever we could find it.
I don't want to pile on Millennials because there is enough of that. I think their technological savviness, and lack of seeing traditional boundaries will do wonders for the world. However, too often they fall into the "I want it now" and "Give it to me for free" groups that drowns out the many positives.
I think a major difference between the three most recent working generations (Baby Boomers, Gen-X, and Millennial) are the complaints, blame, and finger pointing. BB and Gen-X certainly had their gripes about what they went through compared to their parents generation, but they simply sucked it up and found a way to make the world for for them. I am solid Gen-X, and I was from the era where we weren't making anything close what our parents were, no job market stability, no pensions, and zero corporate loyalty - but we put our heads down and carved out a great life seeking out success and happiness wherever we could find it.
I don't want to pile on Millennials because there is enough of that. I think their technological savviness, and lack of seeing traditional boundaries will do wonders for the world. However, too often they fall into the "I want it now" and "Give it to me for free" groups that drowns out the many positives.
i find it tone deaf when we have examples here of boomers talking about buying housing outright with a high school diploma vs millenials unable to own a home into their 30s.
How much do millenials have to fall behind their precedent generations in life milestones like marriage, having children, and home ownership before you would acknowledge its a structural problem.
Like imagine a generation saying they're struggling and all the get told us to stop being selfish by a generation that by all objective measures has more structural wealth. Geez no wonder they hate boomers.
i find it tone deaf when we have examples here of boomers talking about buying housing outright with a high school diploma vs millenials unable to own a home into their 30s.
How much do millenials have to fall behind their precedent generations in life milestones like marriage, having children, and home ownership before you would acknowledge its a structural problem.
Like imagine a generation saying they're struggling and all the get told us to stop being selfish by a generation that by all objective measures has more structural wealth. Geez no wonder they hate boomers.
You may have a small point with housing, but millennials wouldn't be comfortable in the homes boomers were buying. You can absolutely find affordable housing nearly anywhere (with notable exceptions in major metropolitan areas), but you have to be willing to accept that housing. Boomers did.
Also, lifestyle choices are shifting away from having children, getting married, etc. Those are choices for a myriad of reason - the least of which is the fault of baby boomers.
You seem to forget that every single generation struggled when starting out. The previous generations would have been told the same thing you are, but the difference is that they didn't complain the same constant and never-ending way.
There are plenty of older generations willing to help if you are willing to help yourself.
I think a major difference between the three most recent working generations (Baby Boomers, Gen-X, and Millennial) are the complaints, blame, and finger pointing. BB and Gen-X certainly had their gripes about what they went through compared to their parents generation, but they simply sucked it up and found a way to make the world for for them. I am solid Gen-X, and I was from the era where we weren't making anything close what our parents were, no job market stability, no pensions, and zero corporate loyalty - but we put our heads down and carved out a great life seeking out success and happiness wherever we could find it.
I don't want to pile on Millennials because there is enough of that. I think their technological savviness, and lack of seeing traditional boundaries will do wonders for the world. However, too often they fall into the "I want it now" and "Give it to me for free" groups that drowns out the many positives.
Going by Federal Reserve data Gen X has actually been the best performing demographic. It makes sense because they grew up in households mostly during the golden age of prosperity, and during their younger years generally avoided the stagflation that was present. They graduated into a post Reagan tax cut and dollar standard boom with higher than normal stock market returns (the 1990-2000 return was the highest returning decade in history IIRC) and as they hit the workforce saw one of the best economies in US history...ever. The WTO and automation hits that starting really gutting manufacturing jobs were still not in place allowing the less educated access to well paying middle class jobs that bolstered small cities across the nation.
The post 9/11 recession was tough but most were already established in their jobs by then, but most importantly inflation from college to housing was benign. Many were homeowners before housing really took off (twice!).
Millennials who had the foresight to invest when they were coming into the job market and who got lucky with housing purchases during the downturn have come out swinging as well. My wife and I never made good money until very recently but poured every cent we had into the market.
Moving forward by far the biggest concerns I have big picture wise is job automation. My job in transportation will surely be automated as will many millions more to go along with it. My wife herself will most likely age out of the work force in five years or so into her early 40s. Just as lower tier jobs such as paper boy have gone away, so will the next level up McJobs that give people the start they need in life to propel themselves upward. Next in ten to fifteen years or so you will start to see more white collar jobs going away.
Not everyone can be employed in IT security or robotics engineering. There are going to be massive job losses. The folks who own the land and factories will be OK, the new modern day version of feudalism. I truly am not jealous of Gen Z coming behind us. Some of them will be very well off and paid well, but most will struggle to find meaningful employment. Elysium was ahead of its time...
You may have a small point with housing, but millennials wouldn't be comfortable in the homes boomers were buying. You can absolutely find affordable housing nearly anywhere (with notable exceptions in major metropolitan areas), but you have to be willing to accept that housing. Boomers did.
Also, lifestyle choices are shifting away from having children, getting married, etc. Those are choices for a myriad of reason - the least of which is the fault of baby boomers.
You seem to forget that every single generation struggled when starting out. The previous generations would have been told the same thing you are, but the difference is that they didn't complain the same constant and never-ending way.
There are plenty of older generations willing to help if you are willing to help yourself.
So yes it's true there is affordable housing across the US. Many small towns and cities have very low housing costs. Some are located not very far from here. But their local economies are so terrible they warrant those costs. Unless you work for government, the available jobs are mostly service oriented and pay low hourly wages.
Boomers didn't have to accept low end housing and jobs. I remember reading an article about a chemical engineer who graduated in the 70's...he found better employment working on a plant floor as a janitor than he did as an engineer. Those jobs were everywhere back then. Today they are either in China or automated. Remember when all the blue chip companies had offices and plants around the US? Seeing smaller cities and towns get gutted over time has been a real eye opener for me as I travel around the country.
Lifestyle choices shifting away from having kids...yes...because people in general have to feed themselves first. Studies have shown a direct correlation to student loan debt and marriage/childbirth rates.
As far as complaining goes, is it worse or just more visible? I vote the latter, with the prevalence of social media and always on around the clock TV.
Anecdotal and observational, but still ... I believe one of the reasons younger adults often don't own homes is because of their refusal to accept anything less than luxury. It's way more comfortable to live at home with Mom & Dad than it is to do all the things that my generation did when we were young adults -- live with roommates, in crappy apartments, driving crappy cars, and saving up for years so we could buy something. And when we bought, it was a small home that wasn't brand new. In short, we settled, something this generation seems unwilling to do. The house has got to have expensive countertops and hardwoods and a big footprint. So instead of buying a simple house, they rent luxury apartments downtown and complain about not being able to afford a house. Delayed gratification is too hard. They want right now what Mom & Dad took decades to afford.
So yes it's true there is affordable housing across the US. Many small towns and cities have very low housing costs. Some are located not very far from here. But their local economies are so terrible they warrant those costs. Unless you work for government, the available jobs are mostly service oriented and pay low hourly wages.
Boomers didn't have to accept low end housing and jobs. I remember reading an article about a chemical engineer who graduated in the 70's...he found better employment working on a plant floor as a janitor than he did as an engineer. Those jobs were everywhere back then. Today they are either in China or automated. Remember when all the blue chip companies had offices and plants around the US? Seeing smaller cities and towns get gutted over time has been a real eye opener for me as I travel around the country.
Lifestyle choices shifting away from having kids...yes...because people in general have to feed themselves first. Studies have shown a direct correlation to student loan debt and marriage/childbirth rates.
As far as complaining goes, is it worse or just more visible? I vote the latter, with the prevalence of social media and always on around the clock TV.
I appreciate your well thought out response, but there are several points where I think we may fail to see eye to eye. I also travel around the country, and I get excited to see these same cities and towns being revitalized and re-purposed. Even the small town I grew up in which, despite its size, had a major pharmaceutical company in town. When the pharm company moved the town crashed, but rebuilt itself as a haven for entrepreneurs, artists, and musicians.
Additionally, the job market is historically strong, and there are 7.2 million skilled positions open and unfilled right now due to a lack of candidates.
As far as having kids, there have been numerous studies where Millennials are choosing to have kids later so they can focus on themselves (travel, fun, self-love, etc.). Recent survey's show that they are 94% likely to be influenced by social media to travel, document, and share their experiences as a way of fitting in. Previous generations started families earlier as it was expected that you put your family before yourself - that was supposed to happen in retirement. Speaking of which boomers and gen-x'rs are having to push their retirement back further and further due to massive COL changes.
Median HS graduate salary is $27,000...using standard mortgage metrics that gives you roughly $100k mortgage at most.
I'd like you to identify homes anywhere in our area for that amount. Thanks!
You missed her point. She is saying that they didn't buy houses immediately, the scrimped and saved for years to be able to do that - and even then it was an inexpensive starter home in a less desirable part of town. Then you rinse, washed, and repeated the process while moving up.
Nothing was instant.
Also just realized that we have gone way off target. My bad, and I am happy to step away from my portion.
You missed her point. She is saying that they didn't buy houses immediately, the scrimped and saved for years to be able to do that - and even then it was an inexpensive starter home in a less desirable part of town. Then you rinse, washed, and repeated the process while moving up.
Nothing was instant.
I accidentally deleted my post instead of adding a picture.
No I didn't miss the point. Yes you can scrimp and save for years and come up with some down payment money. I know all about scrimping and saving, trust me.
But you didn't address my question. In previous generations it was entirely possible for a HS graduate to raise a family working an honest job. Those honest jobs are *mostly* gone. The life that pitroad lived is not even close to applicable any more.
It was close to that in 2010-2012 as housing prices bottomed out. Unfortunately the economy was absolutely horrible. Imagine housing prices of 2010-2012 combined with the economy of the late 90's. That was pitroad's experience, which they think still exists today. Lol. I know.
So I'll ask again but this time with a picture....which of the eight homes (SFH, townhome, or condo) do you recommend to the thousands of HS grads currently living in apartments? Do you feel a habitable interior would be a requirement? Because that means there are now six to choose from. (Edit***, it's actually four if I'm reading it correctly, as two additional are auctions over >$180k.)
I appreciate your well thought out response, but there are several points where I think we may fail to see eye to eye. I also travel around the country, and I get excited to see these same cities and towns being revitalized and re-purposed. Even the small town I grew up in which, despite its size, had a major pharmaceutical company in town. When the pharm company moved the town crashed, but rebuilt itself as a haven for entrepreneurs, artists, and musicians.
Additionally, the job market is historically strong, and there are 7.2 million skilled positions open and unfilled right now due to a lack of candidates.
As far as having kids, there have been numerous studies where Millennials are choosing to have kids later so they can focus on themselves (travel, fun, self-love, etc.). Recent survey's show that they are 94% likely to be influenced by social media to travel, document, and share their experiences as a way of fitting in. Previous generations started families earlier as it was expected that you put your family before yourself - that was supposed to happen in retirement. Speaking of which boomers and gen-x'rs are having to push their retirement back further and further due to massive COL changes.
I think someone would be delusional to think that the towns and cities of yesteryear are even remotely coming back to where they once were.
I'm not sure why you think one generation is any different than the last. I mean really...millennials are the first generation to focus on themselves? Wow definitely news to the Gen X's lol.
From a Time cover story on Gen X as 20-somethings:
Quote:
“They have few heroes, no anthems, no style to call their own,” wrote Time magazine in a 1990 cover story called “20-something” that marked our debut, as a class, on the national stage. “They crave entertainment, but their attention span is as short as one zap of a TV dial. They hate yuppies, hippies and druggies. They postpone marriage because they dread divorce. They sneer at Range Rovers, Rolexes and red suspenders.”
What's funny about quotes like that is you can find them about every previous generation talking about the next, back thousands of years.
Here is one from 1600 years ago.
Quote:
“Children now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority, disrespect their elders, and love talking instead of exercise.”
Here is one from only 800 years ago:
Quote:
“The young people of today think of nothing but themselves. They have no reverence for parents or old age.”
But, you're probably right. Millennials definitely are the first group who are "keeping up with the Jones's" and trying to fit in within the community. *eyeroll*
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