Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
it's been a while since i've read anything on the downtown condo market in raleigh and durham. i can't gauge if sales are increasing or decreasing.
seems with the tax credit expired it would slow...but there are some good developments in downtown like the amphitheater opening up soon...and i heard they are actually allowing people to move into the Bloomsbury. not sure what is going on with the Hue yet.
at the same time prices still seem kind of high...$200K-$250K for a 1BR, $250K and up for 2BR. At RBC plaza, it's even much more.
seems these condo prices are higher than Charlotte and Atlanta. maybe these latter cities have more supply than demand? who knows....
i have some friends interested but not sure what I would recommend to them. any thoughts?
Considering that many of the last condo projects to be completed in downtown Raleigh were built during the building boom period when construction and material costs were out of this world, my guess is that the developers really can't afford to drop the prices much more without suffering a loss on their investment.
I went on the Downtown Raleigh Home Tour last weekend. There are still units available even in buildings such as West, 222, and RBC that have not been lived in. I think the prices are a bit cost prohibitive to the people who would want to live in these buildings considering the current job market and economic climate.
My guess is that cities such as Charlotte and Atlanta probably do have a surplus of condos available. Same is true in Miami, where in some cases they are practically begging people to buy so that a few owners aren't stuck with shouldering the association fees by themselves.
If they are serious about buying, I would definitely think buying into a building that already has a substantial number of residents would be a safer bet.
i have friends who "reserved" a condo at the hue & were intending to move into it this spring. i say "reserved" because they were not required to sign a commitment letter & it was therefore not binding. which was to their advantage when things were starting to tank last fall. after getting lots of run-around from the hue's sales teams on simple questions (like when they could move in, which unit they could select, when they should obtain financing), they backed out.
the biggest issue was that the hue couldn't sell its condos & most lenders will not lend (especially in these markets) unless the condo building was 75% occupied. they also heard through the grapevine that there was some concern over the hue builder not responding because of a possible bankruptcy, but i did research that a bit for them & came up with nothing.
at any rate, they wanted to purchase before the taxbuyer credit expired so they went elsewhere but with much disappointment as they wanted a hue condo. now every time i drive past it, i see it still looks vacant but they do at least have sales signs up now.
back on the general topic -- i think there's simply a glutton of condos on the market. in general, the high prices & slowing development of downtown are probably contributing to some of the lag in those condos selling. the condos i've seen at the corner of boylan / peace are really beautiful but not worth the price to me. i haven't visited other buildings to know what's offered, but would be curious to see them.
we should start our own city-data Downtown Raleigh and Durham Condo Tour since I missed the one this past Saturday in downtown Raleigh !!
miamiblue - any thoughts/likes/dislikes on the condos you toured in Raleigh? the miami condo market is crazy....one would think now would be a good time to buy, after all it's Miami!
loopdeloop - i think the one on boylan / peace is the Bloomsbury Estates.....i thought they were going bankrupt too and i KNOW they definitely have not reached the FHA minimum for lending so I'm wondering how people are starting to move in there, but not Hue........where did your friends end up buying?
loopdeloop - i think the one on boylan / peace is the Bloomsbury Estates.....
i had to look it up & realized it was 712 tucker. nice, but not worth it for me personally though i know some that it's totally their bag.
as for my friends, they ended up putting their money into the house they were in to upgrade it & wait out the market. they bought another house as a rental property, as well.
i had to look it up & realized it was 712 tucker. nice, but not worth it for me personally though i know some that it's totally their bag.
as for my friends, they ended up putting their money into the house they were in to upgrade it & wait out the market. they bought another house as a rental property, as well.
712 is apartments, not condos.
Regarding what something is worth to you is not necessarily what it's worth to someone else.
Frankly, you couldn't pay me to spend 300K on a cookier cutter home with vinyl siding in the burbs. But, to others, that's the perfect place to put their money. To each his/her own.
I don't think the issue is necessarily just finding buyers for the condos. The lending has to loosen up and come into the game. Without their participation, projects like the Hue can cut their prices all they want and nobody is going to be able to buy. Frankly, I think they should just go rental and convert when things are more stable. That's what 712 did and they are full. People do want to live DT.
we should start our own city-data Downtown Raleigh and Durham Condo Tour since I missed the one this past Saturday in downtown Raleigh !!
miamiblue - any thoughts/likes/dislikes on the condos you toured in Raleigh? the miami condo market is crazy....one would think now would be a good time to buy, after all it's Miami!
loopdeloop - i think the one on boylan / peace is the Bloomsbury Estates.....i thought they were going bankrupt too and i KNOW they definitely have not reached the FHA minimum for lending so I'm wondering how people are starting to move in there, but not Hue........where did your friends end up buying?
Well, I didn't make it to Cotton Mill, Paramount, Hue, West, 222 or Bloomsbury. I did see RBC, Hudson, Palladium and Quorum.
After being in some of these condos, I really came to the conclusion that condo life is just not for me. While waiting for an elevator I started to think about how much of my life I would spend waiting for an elevator if I lived there - especially if I had a dog.
IMHO, the one that I liked the most was Palladium, mainly because they have somewhat of a variety of units, such as townhouse/loft units on the ground floor and flats on the upper floors. The two flats that I saw on the tour this year (I had been there on the tour last year and also crashed a couple parties there once ) were good examples of how decorating can really change the tone of the unit. One was more eclectic/traditional, the other was much more modern/industrial. Yet they both had the same exposed ventilation ducts, concrete details, etc.
RBC and Quorum had great views. RBC had far too much wasted space in two of the "2br" units I saw, which really just had one proper bedroom and one weird windowless and doorless small room that they deemed a bedroom. The corner unit was nicer (obviously), but still odd wasted space persisted. This really bothered me, as I like to use space in the most practical way possible. If you have a random 3" wide by 14" deep slot between your bedroom wall and the window , that is just odd and it would drive me crazy every time I saw it. Also, the balcony of the corner unit (I think) butted up against the neighbor's floor-to-ceiling living room windows. I would think that kind of renders that window pretty much useless for the neighbor if they have any desire for privacy.
Quorum, while clearly well built and finished with some nice quality touches, just seemed much too bland for me. Maybe it was just because the two units I saw were unfurnished. And there are no balconies - I like having at least a little of my own outdoor space. The common areas reminded me far too much of an office building. One of the units I saw at Quorum also had a very awkward space, but it was given a door and turned into the worlds shallowest closet - good for a broom or ironing board I suppose.
Hudson just has too much of an institutional feel to it for my taste. The hallways make me feel like I'm trapped in some kind of underground bunker, and not by choice. The units are nice enough if you like a very stark, modern style. Lots of windows, but only the units on the patio level have any kind of outdoor space.
I would have liked to go to Cotton Mill, Paramount, Hue, West and Bloomsbury (next year!), but after doing all of the east part of downtown we were exhausted. I live around the corner from 222, and for some reason I've never felt very compelled to check out the inside.
To me, the renovated houses in the east part of downtown (Hunter-Thompson neighborhood) ended up being far more interesting to me as realistic housing options in downtown.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoopDeLoop
i had to look it up & realized it was 712 tucker. nice, but not worth it for me personally though i know some that it's totally their bag.
as for my friends, they ended up putting their money into the house they were in to upgrade it & wait out the market. they bought another house as a rental property, as well.
712 Tucker started out as a condo project, but the developer saw the light and changed it to rental apartments before construction even started. I agree, they are pretty pricey, but you are paying for the luxury finish in a great location.
From personal experience, waiting for an elevator in The Paramount is not an issue at all. Miamiblue, I'll be happy to take you on a tour of the building if you like. Just let me know.
712 is apartments, not condos.
Regarding what something is worth to you is not necessarily what it's worth to someone else.
Frankly, you couldn't pay me to spend 300K on a cookier cutter home with vinyl siding in the burbs. But, to others, that's the perfect place to put their money. To each his/her own.
so i'm getting a somewhat snarky tone when reading this post that i somehow was not allowing for others to have this be there thing. which is why i was careful to advise it was not MY type of thing, hopefully implying that others could (& most likely would!) differ. i thought that was pretty clear that i was sharing my opinion & leaving it open for others to share there's.
i'm a little cranky this morning so perhaps i read into that but just wanted to set the record straight.
as for 712 tucker, i thought they were converted later to a mix of condos/apartments after initial purchases? also, my assumption is that we're defining condos as owned & apartments as rented. but maybe we're talking a different language here. i haven't been there in about 3-4 years & then it was to visit a friend of a friend. i understood that he originally bought into it with the assumption that they were not allowed to sublease the condos, thus avoiding the college student conversion of the building to a glorified dorm. but i heard through the grapevine that this changed & he moved elsewhere when he was tired of the never-ending student parties since he was no longer into that sort of thing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by miamiblue
712 Tucker started out as a condo project, but the developer saw the light and changed it to rental apartments before construction even started. I agree, they are pretty pricey, but you are paying for the luxury finish in a great location.
well, that may answer my question above. i am confused then on why he bought in if they changed this before construction started. they were pricey, but definitely nice. since i'm not really into the condo-thing, it's just not my thing but i understand the appeal to those who are into that.
do report back if you make any more condo-visits. i have friends moving into the area occasionally who do ask about downtown condo spaces & having more info to report is nice.
712 was initially offered as a condo project but found that the competition was too strong at that time and wisely changed to Apartments. I looked at their plans in the initial stages and am not sure how much interest they had in sales before making their switch. None of the units closed as condos. I am not even sure if they even went to contract or just to the "reservation" stage that typically precedes condo sales. Developers typically have to have a certain number of reservations in their pockets before going to contract. My guess is that they never went to contract.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
) were good examples of how decorating can really change the tone of the unit. One was more eclectic/traditional, the other was much more modern/industrial. Yet they both had the same exposed ventilation ducts, concrete details, etc.
, that is just odd and it would drive me crazy every time I saw it. Also, the balcony of the corner unit (I think) butted up against the neighbor's floor-to-ceiling living room windows. I would think that kind of renders that window pretty much useless for the neighbor if they have any desire for privacy.
