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Sure - if the basement is clean. If it's got years of accumulated junk in it, or if there's insufficient light, it can be extremely hard to see a sump pump or a French drain. I just saw a house last week that had a French drain in the far cluttered corner of a head-banger basement.
Your agent doesn't carry a high powered flashlight in their car? Shoot even the iPhone has a decent flashlight on it.
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Originally Posted by Lilac Farm
It's S.O.P. for the Northeast. In my particular state it's also one of the disclosures required by state law.
Interesting. I learned something new today.
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Originally Posted by Lilac Farm
I've never had a buyer's agent that went hunting for any of this information, particularly BEFORE an offer is made. They rely on the disclosure, although the good ones do of course double-check the info while touring the house with the buyer. The buyer also must perform their own due diligence and inspections, etc.
We do it before the offer is made. Many of our records are online and it isn't hard to pull them for the buyer.
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Originally Posted by Lilac Farm
Sadly, people don't always just "forget" to disclose things. Just look at the horror stories here on City-Data.
No of course not. There are some significant deceptions that happen, but most cases are people that just forget, think something was repaired when it was done shoddily, or just aren't aware of an issue. If someone is going to be deceptive, the disclosure forms are worthless anyway.
So in case the inspector find out something wrong with the house after buyer made an offer, and the seller doesn't want to fix nor share the cost for repairing, is it possible that the buyer lost his deposit? Please advise.
Most contracts will allow for an inspection period and some states have repair clauses built into their contracts. Buyers typically get their earnest money back, but it really depends on what the contract says.
Please tell me that you aren't in the middle of buying a house right now, but rather are just trying to learn the process for when you do?
How many realtors don't supply a signed property disclosure to prospective buyers until an offer is made? Just wondering how prevalent this practice is.
I attach mine to my listings, which can be downloaded without asking me to provide it.
Last edited by Tish Thompson; 08-24-2011 at 04:51 PM..
Reason: clarification
Most contracts will allow for an inspection period and some states have repair clauses built into their contracts. Buyers typically get their earnest money back, but it really depends on what the contract says.
Please tell me that you aren't in the middle of buying a house right now, but rather are just trying to learn the process for when you do?
We're looking to buy a house, but so far none meets our criteria (some close are too expensive with the high property tax, the other are pretty far so we have to commute more ...) that's why I asked a lot to learn more
[quote=Silverfall;20593223]Your agent doesn't carry a high powered flashlight in their car? Shoot even the iPhone has a decent flashlight on it.[ /quote]
Are you suggesting that the agent is responsible for bringing a flashlight that can spot a sump pump or French drain behind household or building materials stacked in a basement, or behind bricks in a crawlspace? Or more importantly, a structural problem which the seller might have attempted to disguise, which should be on the disclosure form?
Some people may disdain the notion of disclosures because they're not standard practice in their area, but things are different elsewhere and presumably for good reason.
From my point of view, anything that can help a buyer eliminate properties from consideration that will not suit them, is a good thing. If a proper disclosure saves me from writing an offer and spending the money on inspections, it's all good.
Sellers tend to think twice about lying on a disclosure when they a) know certain items are required by law and b) know that while the buyer must perform due diligence, outright lying on the disclosure form could lead to unpleasant consequences. Just my opinion.
We are in the initial process of an "as is" sale of a fixer house about 3/4 through a gut remodel, that has many positives and a few negatives that need to be addressed. I wrote a fairly radical disclosure that erred on the side of too much information. I want it to go to folks that come in for a second look. People need to know what they are possibly buying and I don't want to waste anyone's time in the looking, offering or inspection phases to have it all go south on something that we knew in advance. If it doesn't sell, so what. It will be an inconvenience to us but we will continue to work on the house, change some plans and perhaps rent it when it is done.
Having been on the "lied to" end of things in buying real estate that normal, non-destructive inspections won't find, I go way to the other side when it comes to disclosures. Our realtor agrees with us, in that it is what it is, and hopefully we have put in enough discount into the price to make it a win-win situation for the buyer and us. I'd ten times rather take away less money on a sale than to get into post sale legal wrangling that could in the end eat up years and more money than imagined by omissions or outright fabrication.
Are you suggesting that the agent is responsible for bringing a flashlight that can spot a sump pump or French drain behind household or building materials stacked in a basement, or behind bricks in a crawlspace? Or more importantly, a structural problem which the seller might have attempted to disguise, which should be on the disclosure form?
I'm suggesting a good agent carries a flashlight for those basements where there is insufficient light. You said you might not be able to see one due to insufficient light. That is an issue easily remedied by being prepared for showings. You don't need a disclosure form for that.
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Originally Posted by Lilac Farm
Some people may disdain the notion of disclosures because they're not standard practice in their area, but things are different elsewhere and presumably for good reason.
They are standard here and required by law. I just think buyers put too much faith in them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilac Farm
From my point of view, anything that can help a buyer eliminate properties from consideration that will not suit them, is a good thing. If a proper disclosure saves me from writing an offer and spending the money on inspections, it's all good.
A buyer is always welcome to ask for them before they write an offer. It is new to many MLS's to allow them to be uploaded and attached to the listings. This will become standard practice as the MLS's upgrade themselves, IMO.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilac Farm
Sellers tend to think twice about lying on a disclosure when they a) know certain items are required by law and b) know that while the buyer must perform due diligence, outright lying on the disclosure form could lead to unpleasant consequences. Just my opinion.
I think the kind of seller that is going to lie on the form doesn't care about consequences. Most people fill them out honestly, in their minds. Whether or not a buyer agrees they are being honest is a matter of debate.
True story...I had a young couple with two small kids selling their home. I was the listing agent. The buyer did a home inspection and found that the toilet was leaking under the house. The seller's didn't mark this on their disclosure form. The buyers wrote a scathing letter to my sellers stating that they had to be lying about not knowing about the leak. It had to be one of the rudest letters I have seen. Yes, if they crawled in their crawlspace on a regular basis they would have seen that it was leaking. Since they were a young couple with two small children and working, crawling under the house on a regular basis wasn't one of their hobbies.
Disclosures are only so good. People can't disclose what they don't know.
I'm suggesting a good agent carries a flashlight for those basements where there is insufficient light. You said you might not be able to see one due to insufficient light. That is an issue easily remedied by being prepared for showings. You don't need a disclosure form for that. .
And a REALLY prepared agent carries an extra flashlight or two for clients.
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Originally Posted by Silverfall
Disclosures are only so good. People can't disclose what they don't know.
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