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Actually it is the buyer who wants pools, manicured yards, green spaces, tennis courts, fishing ponds and most importantly great schools and flock to master planned communities with HOA's
These amenities are the flypaper for newer subdivisions. However, the HOA is created for the purpose of enabling the developer to disenfranchise the residents and to extract money from them. Claiming that the buyers want these amenities is somewhat misleading. It is difficult for buyers to avoid purchasing HOA property.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakin
Many cities require developers to form HOA's. It's a way for the city to have nice features, keep property values higher, enforce code violations and hit you with an additional tax that's technically not a tax to maintain all these nice features.
No disagreement that local government seeks to take money from HOA-burdened property owners without providing services and in a manner designed to avoid constitutional scrutiny. The purpose of the HOA is to disenfranchise the owners for the benefit of everyone but the owner.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakin
If well planned master communities with HOA's were not in huge demand, there would be none.
Your previous statement illustrates why this is simply false. In the sunbelt states in particular, there is no feasible alternative for a huge percentage of the population because it is in the interest of local government, developers, and everyone EXCEPT the homeowner to force homeowners to be burdened with HOAs. You have confused numerosity with popularity. That's like claiming that people flock to Houston because they love cockroaches. Contrary to the myth promulgated by the HOA industry, numerosity does not equal popularity with cockroaches, deadly epidemics, or HOAs. Unlike cockroaches and deadly epidemics, however, HOAs are a manmade pestilence.
In the SW the walled yard and community is pretty much standard. At the present state of development that requires a landscaped border.
That landscaped border effectively requires an HOA.
The only way you could avoid it would be to build only onto dedicated streets with all backyard walls abutting. That is doable though it means effectively all streets go through and no quiet streets where children can play. Maybe in lower end housing...
In the SW the HOA is permanent and will pretty much be all encompassing.
If you don't like the way the are it is time to petition the legislature. Nothing else is going to do any good.
... it is time to petition the legislature. Nothing else is going to do any good.
Yup, the laws must be re-written to restore domestic tranquility.
Constitutional rights don't mean much - until they are gone.
The values we all agree to when we pledge allegiance to the flag are not the same values preached by HOA loyalists, I cannot swear allegiance to the form of governance granted in these CC&R contracts from hell.
I go to the legislature not to petition, but to participate in the editing of bills that will become LAW. I pray for peace thru good lawmaking in 2011.
The Texas legislature must end this occupation to avert certain calamities. When the next legislative session ends in June 2011, we'll know if a peaceful resolution to this hateful occupation is possible.
Either the laws will change or the tactics will change.
Maybe next year we'll see solar power take off when HOA power to restrict solar panels is outlawed?
There are more expedient methods to eradicate these liberty sucking parasites, but you're exactly right, it's the legislature that needs to change the laws if we're to do it without any trouble.
Rakin, you'd be surprised how many buyers put on their criteria for me, "NOT in an HOA neighborhood!" However, it is increasingly difficult to find affordable housing in non-HOA neighborhoods simply because those that are not in HOA's are most likely to be found, these days, in close-in older neighborhoods that are out of the price range of my clients seeking them. (Which is to say, those older non-HOA neighborhoods are so desirable that the price has gone way up, and you have to pay a premium to live in a non-HOA neighborhood. Go figure - something about that doesn't ring true to the "keeping up the property values", when you start thinking about it.
I'm perfectly happy to help a buyer find a home in an HOA neighborhood if that's their preference, or not in one if that's the case. However, it's harder to find the latter at an affordable price.
I agree, especially if a buyer has their heart set on new construction. I was one of those people who gave my realtor a few things I absolutely would not bend on: no pool, no backing up to or facing a major road, and no HOAs. Since I was focused on an older suburb, it was not all that difficult for her...but in the end I found my house myself. (That isn't to say she didn't do a spectacular job throughout the process; she did and I recommend her as a buyer's agent when people ask.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeJaquish
Right. Non-HOA neighborhoods are starting to command a price premium, since there are nearly no new neighborhoods here without HOAs.
That is certainly the case here. I was talking to my neighbors just the other day and that did come up. "We like that there's no HOA." They just painted the exterior brick of their house. I preferred it the way it was, but they chose a tasteful buttery cream color for their house and it does look very nice. It's just...once you paint brick you can't go back. But it's their house! If there was an HOA here they may not have been able to paint it, or would have had to clear their color choice with a foot-dragging architectural committee. They said they chose that color to reflect more sunlight and to make their home more energy-efficient. They also recently installed brand-new windows and a brand-new AC system and have plans to install solar panels. Some of those plans would be more difficult or even impossible to complete if this neighborhood had an HOA.
My neighborhood does not have brick walls around it but a lot of neighborhoods here do and I hear that there are plans to construct some as sound barriers. Lots of neighborhoods in the city do have those brick wall sound barriers and they are paid for via our taxes; the city does the work and they do a very good job. My neighborhood also has landscaped entrances with the name of our subdivision on them. Those were paid for through our taxes by the city. Our voluntary neighborhood association did buy the sign toppers which is why they aren't on every single sign. They are still raising money for them. Our city is also responsible for sidewalk, alley, and road maintenance which means some of these may need repairs for a longer period of time than they would in an HOA neighborhood, but the city does get to them in time. The city recently passed a bond issue that would fund these repairs. Apparently my street is slated to be resurfaced and slated to get sidewalk repairs. I'd rather vote in a bond issue that benefits the entire city (which ultimately benefits me as a homeowner because it makes the whole city nicer) rather than pay a potentially intrusive HOA to focus only on the subdivision and not caring about what happens outside the walls. To me that is more what being part of a community is about.
I agree, especially if a buyer has their heart set on new construction. I was one of those people who gave my realtor a few things I absolutely would not bend on: no pool, no backing up to or facing a major road, and no HOAs. Since I was focused on an older suburb, it was not all that difficult for her...but in the end I found my house myself. (That isn't to say she didn't do a spectacular job throughout the process; she did and I recommend her as a buyer's agent when people ask.)
That is certainly the case here. I was talking to my neighbors just the other day and that did come up. "We like that there's no HOA." They just painted the exterior brick of their house. I preferred it the way it was, but they chose a tasteful buttery cream color for their house and it does look very nice. It's just...once you paint brick you can't go back. But it's their house! If there was an HOA here they may not have been able to paint it, or would have had to clear their color choice with a foot-dragging architectural committee. They said they chose that color to reflect more sunlight and to make their home more energy-efficient. They also recently installed brand-new windows and a brand-new AC system and have plans to install solar panels. Some of those plans would be more difficult or even impossible to complete if this neighborhood had an HOA.
My neighborhood does not have brick walls around it but a lot of neighborhoods here do and I hear that there are plans to construct some as sound barriers. Lots of neighborhoods in the city do have those brick wall sound barriers and they are paid for via our taxes; the city does the work and they do a very good job. My neighborhood also has landscaped entrances with the name of our subdivision on them. Those were paid for through our taxes by the city. Our voluntary neighborhood association did buy the sign toppers which is why they aren't on every single sign. They are still raising money for them. Our city is also responsible for sidewalk, alley, and road maintenance which means some of these may need repairs for a longer period of time than they would in an HOA neighborhood, but the city does get to them in time. The city recently passed a bond issue that would fund these repairs. Apparently my street is slated to be resurfaced and slated to get sidewalk repairs. I'd rather vote in a bond issue that benefits the entire city (which ultimately benefits me as a homeowner because it makes the whole city nicer) rather than pay a potentially intrusive HOA to focus only on the subdivision and not caring about what happens outside the walls. To me that is more what being part of a community is about.
A prime example of why HOA's exist. Cities DO NOT/will not want to pay for this stuff if they can "convince" someone else to do it. For the most part HOA's give the city free pools, free parks, free roadside maint. Free basic property police services etc so why would they not try to shove 'em down your throat?
Our last HOA was a decent one with basic CC&R's and minimal dues for the road only which was not common area but a right of way we all owned.
Our current HOA (which btw is switching to homeowner control next month) has probably something close to a $750k + budget and many are vying for positions on the board promising everything under the sun... We'll see I guess.
A prime example of why HOA's exist. Cities DO NOT/will not want to pay for this stuff if they can "convince" someone else to do it. For the most part HOA's give the city free pools, free parks, free roadside maint. Free basic property police services etc so why would they not try to shove 'em down your throat?
Our last HOA was a decent one with basic CC&R's and minimal dues for the road only which was not common area but a right of way we all owned.
Our current HOA (which btw is switching to homeowner control next month) has probably something close to a $750k + budget and many are vying for positions on the board promising everything under the sun... We'll see I guess.
If a road is in very poor condition the city will repair it without having to pass a bond issue. My street is due to be resurfaced and it does not have potholes, it is just bumpy because of all the pothole repairs done in the past. It could probably go another 5-10 years with band-aid fixes but my city is very keen to pump up property values and it is harder to do so when the streets are not in great condition.
Also I am certain that if all of the residents on this street got together and agreed to split the cost, the city would assist us in finding the best deal in resurfacing the road. But why do that when we still get a better deal for our money through city taxes than we would with an HOA? Most if not all of the benefits with none of the drawbacks.
Question on HOA CCRs and Architectural Guidelines in Texas
Can anyone confirm the following? Many thanks in advance.
It is our understanding that in Texas, Architectural Guidelines (AGs) are subordinate documents to the deed restrictions (or CCRs). That is, if the CCRs do not specifically state that the Architectural Control Committee (ACC), which is established by the CCRs, has control over say roof material or design, the sections in the AGs covering roof material or design are merely suggestions (and not requirements) and thus are not legally enforceable by the HOA (meaning the ACC cannot force an owner to comply with the particular guideline). In essence, the CCRs lay out the rules to be enforced by the ACC and the specific areas over which the ACC has authority. We met with one of the top attorneys practicing in this area of law and this is what he explained to us. It intuitively makes sense to us because it takes a 75% vote of the owners to change our CCRs and only a few members of the ACC to change our AGs. As such, the CCRs need to be the controlling documents. The theory is that the AGs should not be used to override or expand the scope of restrictions as set forth in the CCRs.
Great topic.
We are currently looking hard for a Home in a Non HOA neighborhood.
every once in a while We get tempted by the bright shiny homes in the HOA neighborhood.
But we will never voluntarily put ourselves in a position where the neighborhood can foreclose on our home.
The Main issue is this
Most of the Short sales and forclosures in our area are in the HOA neighborhoods.
Hundreds of them.
Those people that are not making their mortgage payments are also not paying their HOA dues.
Causing the remaining bag holders who are current on mortgage and HOA dues to have to make up the difference.
These special assessments and extra fees can be budget busters.
And if they are not paid the HOA can and will foreclose on your home.
You loose.
Here is another observation.
While there are several very nice non HOA neighborhoods in the area.
The turnover is very low.
Virtually no short sales or foreclosures.
And another personal observation.
Most HOA fees are well over a hundred bucks a month.
As a buyer with a monthly payment budget.
We can spend up to fifty thousand dollars more on a home in a non HOA neighborhood and not increase our monthly payment.
In other words our budget is fifty thousand less if we look in the HOA neighborhood for the same monthly budget.
Granted some HOA's do offer services we will need to buy ourselves.
But those expenditures will be at our discretion and will never trigger a foreclosure.
In other words I will never get a special assessment to pay for my freeloading neighbors trash, cable, and internet.
And if you happen to be my neighbor someday.
And want to park your boat in the driveway or paint your house a special color. Go ahead. its your house and you paid for the privileged.
Location: Stuck on the East Coast, hoping to head West
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I both have and have served for my nieghborhood's HOA. I think HOAs are completely worthless and, worse, they have very few limits on their power. My thoughts:
1) we have annual inspections that are conducted by the management company that handles the administrative work for the HOA. They are paid by administrative stuff they do/walk-throughs they do. Guess how many homeowners get letters telling them work needs to be done? Virtually all of us. They even write us up for things that are NOT in violation of the convenant. I spend hours every single spring writing letters and quoting bylaws. I once got a letter because they said my bush was trimmed "incorrectly". FWIW, no they couldn't define how to correctly trim a bush. Incidentally, this same year my next-door neighbor had a toilet sitting outside of his house for months. That was lovely.
2) I served on the board. There are 5 members. 3 of them have been best buddies forever. They control the board and the rest of us know it. One happens to be a general contractor. He is great at finding repairs that need to be done and, what a coincidence, would be happy to do them for you.
3) The HOA passes the buck on the things that really matter. Neighbor has cats? Call the animal warden. Cars parked in the cul-de-sac where it is specifically prohibited? Call the fire department. Noise? Call the police. No matter what the problem, the HOA doesn't deal with it. This is despite the fact that there are bylaws and fines associated with these issues. The only fines I've ever seen the HOA levy are those associated with nonpayment of HOA fees or failure to complete required maintenance. Along those lines, I've seen them target specific families by writing up repair after repair after repair. All the while ignoring others. Inconsistencies abound.
4) Stupid fees. This winter they raised our fees and then used a portion of the proceeds as a prize for the best-decorated Christmas house. Give me a break.
God as my witness, I will never live in an HOA-controlled community ever again.
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If there was an HOA here they may not have been able to paint it, or would have had to clear their color choice with a foot-dragging architectural committee. They said they chose that color to reflect more sunlight and to make their home more energy-efficient. They also recently installed brand-new windows and a brand-new AC system and have plans to install solar panels. Some of those plans would be more difficult or even impossible to complete if this neighborhood had an HOA.
Question on HOA CCRs and Architectural Guidelines in Texas
