Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
41,936 posts, read 37,033,395 times
Reputation: 40635
Advertisements
Quote:
Originally Posted by Euskalherria
Who said anything about 'false pretenses'??? Speaking for myself, I don't date for sex - I date to make a connection... sex, for me, occurs in the context of a committed relationship, which may or may not happen as a result of dating. And it has nothing to do with 'morality' - I am probably the least 'religious' person you would ever know... lol. And, yes, some people 'pay to play'. Where I'm from, the word is 'prostitution'.
By making assumptions about me, you may be actually revealing more about yourself... because, to be frank, I think my post hit a little close to home for you.
Who said anything about false pretenses? Really. You didn't read. I was responding directly to someone who promoted using false pretenses to get sex.
I didn't make "assumptions" about you. I responded based on the conversation. By dismissing those who have healthy consensual honest sexual relationships, you were in fact tacitly endorsing the methods of who I was responding to who was promoting the notion that men date to primarily to get sex.
I dont know anything about prostitution. Maybe in your world it's done a lot. But it wasn't what I was talking about, and you know it.
(Oh and, I said moralistic, I said nothing about religious. They are in no way synonymous.)
Last edited by timberline742; 10-01-2021 at 07:57 AM..
Wow, this thread blew up...if woman asked me in response "would sex be involved"? I'd be like "Too soon to tell, we'll cross that bridge should we get to it....so are you on for dinner? ;-)"...I think that would be an appropriate enough answer.
Though, how do you turn someone down by asking that question? Why not turn someone down by saying, "sorry, not interested' and leave it at that?
Already responded to the above.
Quote:
EDITED:
Though, there is a point to be made about getting to know someone over time to see if you'd want to go out with them. I've had situations like this where I thought there was great banter and chemistry between us...that we actually go to know each other. Even got her digits, etc etc. When I finally asked her out...it was if she wasn't expecting it. She'd be like "Oh...um..." it becomes awkward.
I think that's part of the overall problem. Seems that a lot of people depend on 'chemistry'. But the problem is, that although *you* might be 'feelin' it', SHE may not be. Yes, the banter can be very nice and all, but in *her* mind, it's just friendly chit-chat.
Quote:
I remember asking a woman I met at a meetup out, she agreed to the date...then like 5 mins later, she calls me back and asked me, "Did you mean for this to be a date?" and I was thinking "Um, she's joking right...she should know better" I said, "Well...yeah" (DUH, I was thinking)
SHe goes, Um..sorry, just not interested in you that way.
Lesson to yourself: If asking a woman out on a date, specify that it's a date!
Quote:
I knew of a guy that carpooled to a camping group outing. He had a camper he was hauling behind him. He was into her. She was someone we all knew as a group for a while, but he was trying to ramp things up with her. She tended to be a "man's woman" which she isn't girly, not afraid to get dirty, gets along with men in general. No drama. I think a lot of men in the group were attracted to her FOR that reason.
Anyways, she's had to contend with men that were "going out with her as friends" with her trying to cross boundaries when out at social gatherings, like calling her "honey" in front of their friends, making it look to others that they were a couple...or touching her on the small of her back while together. (They come together to these events) making her uncomfortable.
Going back to the trailer guy, they actually shared sleeping quarters with teach other in the camper. Though they didn't sleep "together" they slept in different parts of the camper. When they broke camp and were driving home, he asked her to be his girlfriend...and let's just say...it didn't go over well...esp. with all that time invested.
I criticized her for even making those kinds of sleeping arrangements with him. It's like she was naive to men liking her or something.
Wow...he asked her to his girlfriend while driving home? Bad on HIM!
As for the sleeping arrangements, I don't think it's that terrible...IF both parties are in agreement ahead of time that this is just sleeping. Again, lesson learned. For BOTH of them.
Quote:
I know of some women have expressed experiencing the above, all of which turned sour grapes to complete stop agreeing to such arrangements anymore.
When I first moved to California, I got a job quickly. After being at work for about a month, one of the women invited me to go on a camping trip with her, her husband and another couple. Kind of like a "Welcome to California" thing for me. We all shared the same tent. Our sleeping bags were smooshed together. I was wedged in between the woman and the other woman's husband.
In the middle of the night, I felt this arm come across me. I remember feeling to scared to move. Morning came. The arm was gone. I emerged from the tent, probably looking like I had sunburn...I was so embarrassed! They all laughed, as I apologized profusely. The woman explained that it was probably 'natural' for him to do that, since she usually slept on the same side of her husband that I was on!
That trip was the talk of the office for the next week...
"But hey, if you're more in favor of people putting up the pretense of dating in order to just have sex, that's your business. There is nothing honorable about false pretenses in my world."
Hmmm... who is the 'you' you are referring to again???
"By dismissing those who have healthy consensual honest sexual relationships, you were in fact tacitly endorsing the methods of who I was responding to who was promoting the notion that men date to primarily to get sex."
How so? Never did I say that - and, btw, I do not agree with that poster. That is not why I date, may be helpful for you to read what I posted about that, thanks in advance.
"I don't know anything about prostitution." I don't 'know' anything about prostitution as in I have never experienced it and never will. Cheap... and I don't 'do cheap', sorry to disappoint.
"Maybe in your world it's done a lot." LOL... what a sad and pathetic attempt at a 'dig'. I don't require that something 'be in my world' to know about it and know that it happens... lol.
"But it wasn't what I was talking about, and you know it.
No, I don't know that. But I DO know that prostitution - not from actual personal experience AGAIN, thank you very much - IS an avenue for 'easy sex' if the 'buyer' has the $$$$$... and surely you are not that obtuse to not know that.
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
41,936 posts, read 37,033,395 times
Reputation: 40635
Quote:
Originally Posted by Euskalherria
Hmmm... who is the 'you' you are referring to again???.
You. And I did read that's not why you date. It's not why I date either (which I also said, and you glossed over). Which makes it irrelevant to the conversation. I was addressing someone who said it is why men date. And since you're trying to create and argument with me, when when we are in agreement on that, I'm guess you an alternative motive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Euskalherria
No, I don't know that. But I DO know that prostitution - not from actual personal experience AGAIN, thank you very much - IS an avenue for 'easy sex' if the 'buyer' has the $$$$$... and surely you are not that obtuse to not know that.
I really don't know it. I don't know anything about prostitution. It's not part of my world. I would have no idea how to go about it even if I was interested, which I am not. You seem to know know more about that than I do.
Tracking down someone who would accept money for sex (ick), seems a whole lot harder (I would think) than just being a normal adult that has options for sex, if that's what they want. Added bonus of no ick and not needing money.
Just to step in here between Euskalherria and Timberline for a moment...
There ARE women out there who are willing to have sex with no expectation of 'payment'...or, even a relationship.
A Friend's-With-Benefits arrangement comes to mind... (obviously, not the ONLY kind of 'arrangement')
So, I think the point of the other poster was that men don't necessarily have to 'date' in order to get sex. Sex is readily available for many men, even WITHOUT resorting to prostitution.
While some of us may not approve of an FWB arrangement, the parties in it seem to have no problem with it.
You. And I did read that's not why you date. It's not why I date either (which I also said, and you glossed over). Which makes it irrelevant to the conversation. I was addressing someone who said it is why men date. And since you're trying to create and argument with me, when when we are in agreement on that, I'm guess you an alternative motive.
I really don't know it. I don't know anything about prostitution. It's not part of my world. I would have no idea how to go about it even if I was interested, which I am not. You seem to know know more about that than I do.
Tracking down someone who would accept money for sex (ick), seems a whole lot harder (I would think) than just being a normal adult that has options for sex, if that's what they want. Added bonus of no ick and not needing money.
Like I said, I have no personal experience with prostitution - yes, to me, it is 'icky', not my 'thing' at all. But it is a way for someone to have 'easy sex' if that's what they want... oh well, I will never go there so all good.
What is also 'ick' to me is sex without commitment. Naked grappling and what-not with zero intimacy and love. Mere mechanics - why I also am not into porn. Cheap.
Some people like to meet someone at bars/clubs/whatever, chat over drinks for an hour or two, and then off come the clothes, the bed creaking, and the next-morning 'disappearing'. Others prefer to meet, date, connect, fall in love, commit to one another, and then do the 'wild thing' - well, in MY WORLD, 'make love'.
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
41,936 posts, read 37,033,395 times
Reputation: 40635
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mink57
Just to step in here between Euskalherria and Timberline for a moment...
There ARE women out there who are willing to have sex with no expectation of 'payment'...or, even a relationship.
A Friend's-With-Benefits arrangement comes to mind... (obviously, not the ONLY kind of 'arrangement')
So, I think the point of the other poster was that men don't necessarily have to 'date' in order to get sex. Sex is readily available for many men, even WITHOUT resorting to prostitution.
While some of us may not approve of an FWB arrangement, the parties in it seem to have no problem with it.
And, in that case, who are WE to judge?
There are loads of them. As I said, sex is easy to find if that's what you want. Healthy relationships with love are difficult to find.
What I wrote was crystal clear. Not ambiguous in the least.
But some, ahem, posters like to create arguments for the sake of it.
There are loads of them. As I said, sex is easy to find if that's what you want. Healthy relationships with love are difficult to find.
What I wrote was crystal clear. Not ambiguous in the least.
But some, ahem, posters like to create arguments for the sake of it.
K, gonna wrap this up and I'm out - the kind of 'sex' that I am seeking is very much NOT 'easy to find'. At all. I would never stoop to any 'FWB' or any other 'arrangement', again TO ME, cheap.
Someone who comes on here and makes a blanket statement that "sex is easy to find" discounts those who do not reckon life in the same - or similar - manner and is dismissive and frankly narrow-minded.
There are loads of them. As I said, sex is easy to find if that's what you want. Healthy relationships with love are difficult to find.
What I wrote was crystal clear. Not ambiguous in the least.
But some, ahem, posters like to create arguments for the sake of it.
I don't think he's trying to create an argument so much as presenting another facet.
Some people take sex more seriously than others, and see it as part of a relationship...and not necessarily the "end all BE all" of a relationship.
But I digress...
I agree with you. Healthy relationships are hard to find, IF that's what you want. But if you lead with sex, chances are, that the relationship is going to be based on sex. So, you may not find the love that you want. YMMV.
To bring this thread full circle (so it doesn't get shut down...hopefully)
There are women out there who want to get to know someone FIRST BEFORE having sex with them. If a woman goes out with a man "as friends", it doesn't necessarily mean that sex is OFF the table.
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
41,936 posts, read 37,033,395 times
Reputation: 40635
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mink57
There are women out there who want to get to know someone FIRST BEFORE having sex with them. If a woman goes out with a man "as friends", it doesn't necessarily mean that sex is OFF the table.
Then they should. And there are guys that feel that way. They should.
I don't see anyone saying people shouldn't do what is right for them.
Lots of false dichotomies being pushed around though.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Bad on HIM! 
