Creation was godless says Hawking (mythology, Adam and Eve, layman, children)

[nimchimpsky]

of course, but i'm also not a christian.

hmm...the last time i had a girlfriend who was jealous out of love, she ended up beating on me cause she thought i was cheating on her when i wasn't. i definitely wouldn't want to worship a god with that kind of 'love' because if my ex could deliver a few punches, i don't even want to know what the biblical god does or has done in the name of 'jealousy from love.' it really just sounds smothering and oppressive to me, not healthy.

[tigetmax24]

Originally Posted by nimchimpsky

of course, but i'm also not a christian.

hmm...the last time i had a girlfriend who was jealous out of love, she ended up beating on me cause she thought i was cheating on her when i wasn't. i definitely wouldn't want to worship a god with that kind of 'love' because if my ex could deliver a few punches, i don't even want to know what the biblical god does or has done in the name of 'jealousy from love.' it really just sounds smothering and oppressive to me, not healthy.

I haven't denied that jealousy can be unhealthy or sinful - it obviously can.

Again, is jealousy always unhealthy or sinful?

[MrMinkowski]

First of all you have to look at the odds of the universe coming together, and if you try and stand behind the wall that says "there are an infinite number of universes so obviously we will appear in the one that will sustain life.", but, try looking up a video on youtube called
Hilbert's Hotel and Infinity. thus proving the theory of an infinite universes wrong. back to the thing about odds of are universe coming into existence. the video Evidence of God: physics goes into the argument of "fine tuning". so Hawkings say there are an infinite number of universes and then it is proven that there cannot be that would mean the odds still stand. Hawkings has been wrong before and is sure to be wrong again, he is not that smartest man on the planet. people seem to give him way too much credit and just believe instead of questioning.

[Melvin.George]

Originally Posted by juj

there are people who accept science and religion. They are not mutually exclusive.

Yep...folks who were brainwashed as infants and continued through universities and saw that science is real. At that point they maneuvered and manipulated the ancient writings to some individual interpretation. Virgin birth, healing by touching, walking on water, resurrection and walking streets paved with gold don't come easy. When someone claims that a man was hung on a cross, slowly bled to death then showed up in top physical condition two days later that's strong...too strong for 98% of scientists.

The Jesus story complete with virgin birth, wise men the trinity and resurrection was all told in ancient Egypt 3000 years before the Jews told it. That ol' Gawd was called Horus.

[tgnostic]

But Christ had a real 'Vorstelungen' of acculturated imaginative people. What went on in Egypt was witchcraft with mindless humans (mind you, humans) meditating and drawing symbols.

[nimchimpsky]

Originally Posted by tigetmax24

I haven't denied that jealousy can be unhealthy or sinful - it obviously can.

Again, is jealousy always unhealthy or sinful?

the examples of jealousy you gave were unhealthy. can you give any examples of jealousy that are analogous to the bible-god type and not to the sinful type?

[Pretzelogik]

Originally Posted by Sizzly Friddle

Professor Hawkings has written a new book discussing how the laws of nature are adequate to explain how the universe came into existence.

I don't expect this to change anyone's mind. It just affirms what many already believe, and this won't convince anyone who doesn't accept science.

BBC News - Stephen Hawking: God did not create Universe

This is philosophy not quantum mechanics...why does he have anymore insight into this matter than you, me, or the guy behind the tree?

[nimchimpsky]

Originally Posted by Arthur2ShedsJackson

I hate to say this but to paraphrase Thomas Dolby,I think Mr Hawkings has blinded you with….SCIENCE!!

Originally Posted by MrMinkowski

Hawkings has been wrong before and is sure to be wrong again, he is not that smartest man on the planet. people seem to give him way too much credit and just believe instead of questioning.

for starters, the thread title is misleading because hawking never said creation was godless. he said, m-theory does not require a creator. and that there may or may not be a god. in his larry king interview he emphasized that he was not actually claiming the presence or absence of a god, he was just talking about m-theory. everything he said is according to m-theory. when asked if there is a god or if he believed in a god, he specifically said that's irrelevant. because it's not about what you or i or hawking believe, it's about m-theory and if future evidence supports it or not.

if people think science is akin to brainwashing, then they don't get how science works. the second a 'scientist' starts treating science as doctrine, they are no longer a scientist. science by definition works by coming up with hypotheses and testing them. a hypothesis can gain more and more evidence with time, but the second there is any evidence disproving that hypothesis, it's no longer valid. science is self-examining and as a result, self-changing. science cannot be indoctrination, because as soon as there's an unwillingness to question, examine, and perhaps let go of a belief, then that belief falls out of the domain of science and into the domain of doctrine.

[Melvin.George]

Originally Posted by tgnostic

But Christ had a real 'Vorstelungen' of acculturated imaginative people..

Yeah Right!! These are the same people who allegedly told of his coming:

Old Testament Death Penalty Sins


Murder - Gen. 9:6; Ex. 21:12-14,20,23; Lev. 24:17,21; Num. 35:16-34; Deut. 19.
Failing to circumcise - Gen. 17:14; Ex. 4:24,25.
Eating leavened bread during feast of unleavened bread - Ex. 2:15,19.
Smiting Parents- Ex. 21:15.
Kidnapping - Ex. 21:16; Deut. 24:7.
Cursing Parents - Ex. 21:17; Lev. 20:9.
Negligence with animals that kill - Ex. 21:28-32.
Witchcraft - Ex. 22:18.
Bestiality - Ex. 22:19; Lev. 18:23-29; 20:15,16.
Idolatry - Ex. 22:20.
Making holy anointing oil - Ex. 30:33.
Putting holy anointing oil on strangers - Ex. 30:33.
Making the holy perfume - Ex. 30:38.
Defiling the Sabbath - Ex. 31:14.
Working on the Sabbath - Ex. 35:2.
Eating the flesh of the peace offerings in
uncleanness - Lev. 7:20,21.
Eating the fat of sacrifices - Lev. 7:25.
Killing sacrifices other than at the door of the tabernacle - Lev. 17:1-9.
Eating blood - Lev. 17:10-14.
Incest - Lev. 18:6-29; 20:11-22.
Eating sacrifices at the wrong time - Lev. 19:5-8.
Consecration of children to idols - Lev. 20:1-5.
Spiritualism - Lev. 20:6,27.
Adultery - Lev. 20:10; Deut. 22:22-30.
Sodomy/Homosexuality - Lev. 20:13.
Relationship with a menstruous woman - Lev. 20:18.
Whoredom - Lev. 21:9; Deut. 22:21,22.
Sacrilege - Lev. 22:3.
Refusing to fast on day of atonement - Lev. 23:29.
Working on atonement - Lev. 23:30.
Blasphemy - Lev. 24:11-16.
Failure to keep the Passover - Num. 9:13.
Presumptuous - Num. 15:30,31.
Gathering firewood on the Sabbath - Num. 15:32,36.
Failure to purify self before worship - Num. 19:13,20.
False prophecy - Deut. 13:1-18; 18:20.
Leading men away from God - Deut. 13:6-18.
Stubbornness and rebelliousness - Deut. 21:18-23.
Gluttony - Deut. 21:20-23.
Drunkenness - Deut. 21:20-23.
Backbiting - Deut. 17:2-7.
False dreams and visions - Deut. 13:1-18.

[tigetmax24]

Originally Posted by nimchimpsky

the examples of jealousy you gave were unhealthy. can you give any examples of jealousy that are analogous to the bible-god type and not to the sinful type?

Okay, I think I can see where this is going. If you lack the intellectual honesty to admit the obvious then there's not much I can do.

Quite obviously, you're negatively predisposed towards the Bible and, while you're certainly entitled to your view, to find fault (your post #78) with those having found the Bible to be trustworthy comes off as pure hypocrisy. While being dogmatic in your rejection of the Bible, you decry those having found it perfectly reasonable to accept it at face value.