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How is God your savior? What did he do to save you?
By lifting the condemnation that was upon me. How did he do this ?,by demonstrating his amazing love for me by being crucified by the hands of wicked men(which also lifted all the misconceptions i had of God being tyrant from taking heed to the handed down doctrines of men)leaving me in no doubt that nothing stood between myself and God and by this knowledge i am at peace with God.
There is therefore now no condemnation for those that are in Christ. This does not mean a physical place for all where christians are assembled in Christ( for most christians i know still live under condemnation of their own sin and thus are not in Christ)but a state of being for all who are spiritually minded enough to know they are at peace with God.
By lifting the condemnation that was upon me. How did he do this ?,by demonstrating his amazing love for me by being crucified by the hands of wicked men(which also lifted all the misconceptions i had of God being tyrant from taking heed to the handed down doctrines of men)leaving me in no doubt that nothing stood between myself and God and by this knowledge i am at peace with God.
Why do you believe him being crucified accomplish that?
Why do you believe him being crucified accomplish that?
This is off topic, but just for you.
Because he laid down his life to demonstrate the depth of the love of God .......it was not taken from him. I have said it before and i will say it again, God did not suddenly decide to love us 2000 years ago, 2000 years ago through Jesus Christ he demonstrated that he did. Jesus Christ is the same yesterday( before 2000 years ago)and to-day--yes, and to the ages to come.
By lifting the condemnation that was upon me. How did he do this ?,by demonstrating his amazing love for me by being crucified by the hands of wicked men(which also lifted all the misconceptions i had of God being tyrant from taking heed to the handed down doctrines of men)leaving me in no doubt that nothing stood between myself and God and by this knowledge i am at peace with God.
There is therefore now no condemnation for those that are in Christ. This does not mean a physical place for all where christians are assembled in Christ( for most christians i know still live under condemnation of their own sin and thus are not in Christ)but a state of being for all who are spiritually minded enough to know they are at peace with God.
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Originally Posted by Vizio
Why do you believe him being crucified accomplish that?
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Originally Posted by pcamps
This is off topic, but just for you.
Because he laid down his life to demonstrate the depth of the love of God .......it was not taken from him. I have said it before and i will say it again, God did not suddenly decide to love us 2000 years ago, 2000 years ago through Jesus Christ he demonstrated that he did. Jesus Christ is the same yesterday( before 2000 years ago)and to-day--yes, and to the ages to come.
The perception of Trinity is much more complex than that, but it is not a doctrine that is a requirement. Such beliefs about God are at best secondary, and what is really important to believe is His love for us. With that in mind, Trinitarians would probably tell you that Jesus limited Himself to become human and that no human could encompass all the knowledge of God. Also, the mystery that can't be explained at least in human terms is that there are two "persons" but one spirit that is God. No, it doesn't make a certain kind of sense and if you don't feel comfortable with the idea, just drop it.
ok sure, but first, the Trinity is the main doctrine in Christianity now, right? how can we drop the main doctrine?
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Originally Posted by pneuma
1. Jesus is not God, so you start from a wrong idea.
2. God knows everything because He searches the riegns of our hearts, not because He knows our hearts from eternity past.
i don't believe that Jesus is God, i was talking about who Christians think he is, do you mean to tell me that Christians do not worship Jesus as the Son of God?
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Originally Posted by pcamps
I do not see where Jesus said "i don't even know". He did say "if you have seen me you have seen the Father, and before Abraham was I Am.
The jewish man with the beard and long hair was not God. God was in the jewish man with the beard and long hair.
he said My Father only, this means neither the Son nor the Holy Spirit know of that day. Jesus, whom the Christians worship as the son of God, didn't know of that day.
there are alot other verses in the Bible that say he couldn't do anything without his father, and others that say he prayed to his father. these attributes are not for God.
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Originally Posted by the_human_being
I really can't answer the question. It is above my pay-grade. I have read however that the word "eloheim" is a plural word. We also have "We will make a man" and the Christ speaking of being with the Father before His first earthly appearance. We alson have John saying that the Word was "with" God and that the Word "was" God. In fact, I have read that the word "eloheim" denotes a "God family". Again, I really don't know.
the "we" in the Bible is a plural of Majesty, in Semitic Languages, which are Hebrew, Aramaic and Arabic, We is used as a plural of Majesty when God is speaking, in the Qur'an for example, God uses the word "us" and "we" too when he is speaking, yet no Muslim would understand that there are more than one God.
The Queen of England used to say that too.
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Originally Posted by Vizio
Philippians 2 states that although he is God, he did not hold on to it, but became a man. He has a human and a divine nature -- he is fully human, fully God. He chose not to know some things.
Can the finite and the infinite be one? To be "full God" means freedom from finite forms and from helplessness, and to be "full man" means the absence of divinity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio
Christians don't claim that they are the same person. We claim they are the same God. There are 3 distinct persons, but one and only one God. There are not 3 manifestations of God, which is modalism, but 3 actual persons existing all within the same essence of God.
The nature of God is something that the cults so often don't get right.
why would God need three personalities? God isn't Afraid of any one, sending Prophets for example is a good solution, which has been used by God, why would he change his mind? some Christians would argue that he stopped sending prophets because they could not do the Job, but isn't he all-knowing? he could've known that from the beginning.
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Originally Posted by 101c
GINOLJC,
addressing the OP only,
the question, "The Lord Jesus don’t know his return date". this question have been asked, and answered countless of times. Oh well........
One of of the Major question concerning our Lord's Deity, is his omniscient. "How come our Lord Jesus don't know his return date?". only the father knows. again the beauty of "diversity". the answer is in the "will" of God. God have a "will", a plan. and it is clearly seen in this case in the Godly principle of Matthew 6:3. listen, "But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth". how can one do something themselves without knowing about it. your right hand, and left hand is a part of you, you knows exactly what each hand is doing. the answer is an act of the “WILL”. well lets see how God do it. scripture, Jeremiah 31:34 "And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more". did one see that?, "and I (will) remember their sin no more". HOLD IT, how can almighty, all knowing God not remember?. answer, it's an act of the will. he wills "not" to remember. just as he said in Matthew 6:3b "let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth", "let" is an act of the will. now, how do all of this relates to our Lord's not knowing his return date. answer, Revelation chapter 5. our Lord is sitting on the throne. what happens?, the Spirit, (the Father), comes and takes the book out of his hand, right, now which hand did he take the book out of?, answer the right hand, remember, Matthew 6:3 "But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth". so by taking the book out of this "RIGHT" hand he now wills, which is an act, not to KNOW his return DATE, the Symbolism here is for us to understand this. because the book contain all the information of what's to come, even the return date. so, only the Father, (the Spirit, without flesh, and bone), knows because the father took the book out of his "RIGHT". by our Lord being in flesh and bone, as the diversity, and as mediator, he fulfills the DAVIDIC PROPHECY, Psalms 110:1 "A Psalm of David. The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool". until, is an unspecified time. and that time was written in the book that was in the Lord's right hand. by the removal of the book from the hand is the same as God saying "I will remember your sins no more". so, no one knows only he who took the book, (the act of the will). again the beauty of the “diversity” of God.
be blessed.
PS humans have the same capabilities. for a many of time, people have come to me in confidentiality about something. and by my own "will", I chose not to remember it, so that it want come up in any of my other conversation. only when the person remind me, will I remember the conversation, as to what was said.
so the Son willed not to know of the time of his coming while the Father willed?
if Jesus was God, then he will surely know everthing, but Mark 24: 32-36 tells us that Jesus wasn't all-knowing:
"Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh: So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only"
So how come he is God?
Another thing is that, Christians say the Father, The Son, and the Holy Spirit are three characters in one person. who is God.
but this verse also proves they were not one person, as Jesus didn't know, and the Father did know.
so what's the Christian argument for this?
note, i'm sorry if this came as offending or rude, this is not the Goal of this thread.
What you post ^ above ^ is a teaching of Christendom [ so-called Christianity ], and Not the first-century teachings of Christ.
Jesus knew who he was according to John 10 v 36. Jesus taught he is the Son of God, Not God.
Gospel writer Luke wrote at Acts 20 vs 29,30 that false shepherds would fleece the flock of God.
Jesus also forewarned that fake ' weed/tares ' Christians would grow together over the centuries with the genuine ' wheat ' Christians until the ' harvest time ', or the coming ' time of separation ' of Matthew 25 vs 31,32.
Please remember that Almighty God gifted Adam [ mankind ] with free-will choices meaning Adam as a free moral agent could think and choose and decide for himself if he wanted to obey God or not. In other words, God does Not program anyone to follow him. That is our own free-will choice to make without God interfering with our thinking. God does know and tells us the outcome for the earth: The humble meek people will inherit the earth [ Psalm 37 vs 11, 29 ], but as to who will make up that humble meek group is un-numbered. The violent and wicked will be destroyed forever - Psalms 92 v 7; 11 v 5
Philippians 2 states that although he is God, he did not hold on to it, but became a man. He has a human and a divine nature -- he is fully human, fully God. He chose not to know some things.
I agree that Philippians 2:6-8, Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:But made himself of no reputation, and took on him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient to death, even the death of the cross, probably answers the OP's question better than anything I've read over the years.
This making himself of no reputation means as Ellicott explains means to empty or strip oneself. This emptying or stripping away of his divinity was necessary for the full impact of his death on the cross.
I agree that Philippians 2:6-8, This emptying or stripping away of his divinity was necessary for the full impact of his death on the cross.
Jesus was divine because Jesus was sent by God from his rightful home in heaven to earth.
Jesus, like Adam, could have chosen sin. God can't choose sin. God can Not strip off his divinity. God can Not die. Jesus proved beyond doubt that Adam, as a perfect human, could have remained sinless, and perfectly sinless Jesus chose to remain sinless despite what Satan threw at him.
Adam's rightful home was earth. After Adam, all who died before Jesus [ John 3 v 13; Matthew 23 v 35 ] could also have earth as their rightful home starting with Jesus' 1000-year kingdom reign over earth when death will be no more - Rev. 21 vs 4,5; Romans 6 v 7 - because the effects of the Genesis ' tree of life ' will once again be on earth - Rev. 22 v 2. No more death means No more sin affecting righteous mankind.
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