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Old 08-22-2015, 08:24 PM
 
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I apologize if this seems like a copy of a similar thread, but there is an area where I'm struggling with my faith. Aren't these so called "bad Christians" or "extremists" who oppose abortion and homosexuality or anything else, merely practicing their faith according to their bible?

 
Old 08-22-2015, 09:18 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostee View Post
I apologize if this seems like a copy of a similar thread, but there is an area where I'm struggling with my faith. Aren't these so called "bad Christians" or "extremists" who oppose abortion and homosexuality or anything else, merely practicing their faith according to their bible?
Oh sure, they can claim that in a country with freedom of religion. But if they live in a democracy, they are required to follow the laws of that country or accept the consequences.

It's not okay for them to use their religion as a reason to unlawfully discriminate against people. And if they continue to do so, then some of them should end up in jail. I'm thinking of a county clerk refusing to issue marriage licenses to same sex couples because it's against her religion. People who do that should be fired. Or, they should be ordered by a judge to issue the licenses and be held in contempt and thrown in jail if they continue to refuse.

It's not necessarily wrong to break a law you don't believe in, but you'd better be prepared to accept the consequences. The Civil Rights Movement has lots of examples of this. For example, "jail not bail" was done intentionally because it cost the cities that arrested the "law breakers" more to house them than release them. Filling up the jails with peaceful protestors caused other problems too.
 
Old 08-22-2015, 09:27 PM
 
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Abortion is a sin. You're killing children. Plain and simple.

Homosexuality is no different from any other kind of love. In this case, such Christians are out of line, as they are being unloving to people who simply love a different type of person than them.

In the first case, the sin is deplorable, but you should strive to love the person anyway. They're often in pain and regret, and don't need more judgment heaped on.

In the second case, there's something you should know. The word "homosexuality" didn't appear in the Bible until 1946. That is, we had a series of vague terms, that people revised to suit their agenda. Yes, as surely as homosexuals try to suit their agenda, the fundamentalists made the Bible say stuff like this to suit their bias.

Oh sure, there's a counter argument, that they were essentially saying the same thing. But were they? This is not a given.

Genesis 1-2 (Creation Account)
Genesis 19:1-9 (Sodom Account)
Leviticus 18:22, 20:13 (Holiness Code)
Romans 1:24-27 (Letter of Paul)
1 Corinthians 6:9 (Letter of Paul)
1 Timothy 1:10 (Letter of Paul)

In the Genesis story, we have a story indeed where we came from, male and female, but it is at no point a command to only love male and female. It's not written this way but rather as an assertion that marriage is an act of love.

In the case of Sodom, the actual crime was rape. It was not the simple act of being homosexual. It clearly said "let them come out so we may know them."

Leviticus says "You shall not lie down with a man as a woman." Let's talk about something. In Jewish culture there was a clear patriarchy, male was dominant and female was submissive. It does not directly say "You shall not lie down with another man as a man," it says that. That is, you are not to be a dominant partner with another man. They are talking about rape! The thing that people do in prison to other men, against their will holding them down and molesting them. This is what this law is about!

What about the Letters to Paul? Well, context, again is everything. They are talking in context of lust, orgies, prostitution, and adultery. Sexual immorality.

Even if homosexuality was the issue, a Christian should love sinner and hate the sin, as before with abortion. But as I pointed out, this isn't cut and dry.

I'm wary of such laws. For public employees, yes, but private citizens should be able to refuse services against their conscience. Otherwise, we live in an authoritarian culture, and I don't want that.
 
Old 08-22-2015, 11:00 PM
 
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Can you name anyone who is pro-life on abortion but pro-gay marriage? I can't think of many on the top of my head right now.
 
Old 08-22-2015, 11:21 PM
 
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There are 4 different translations to love in Greek ,
Romantic love , parental love , brotherly love or friendship , And God's love or a love for him .

Think about this . A man and his wife is the only way you can take these four words in Greek and merge them into one perfect relationship.
 
Old 08-22-2015, 11:28 PM
 
63,809 posts, read 40,077,272 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostee View Post
I apologize if this seems like a copy of a similar thread, but there is an area where I'm struggling with my faith. Aren't these so called "bad Christians" or "extremists" who oppose abortion and homosexuality or anything else, merely practicing their faith according to their bible?
Yes. They are following the benighted and ignorant views of our primitive ancestors and claiming it is a sign of faith in God. How anyone can think that the views of primitive savage barbarians from thousands of years ago could conceivably be a useful guide for modern civilized society is beyond me. If they actually followed the views of Christ, there would be no problem. But the merger of the ancient ignorance and superstitious beliefs of our savage and barbaric ancestors corrupted Christ's Gospel beyond recognition.
 
Old 08-22-2015, 11:31 PM
 
Location: Caverns measureless to man...
7,588 posts, read 6,627,628 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostee View Post
Can you name anyone who is pro-life on abortion but pro-gay marriage? I can't think of many on the top of my head right now.
That'd be me. :-)
 
Old 08-23-2015, 02:45 AM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
17,071 posts, read 10,918,865 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostee View Post
I apologize if this seems like a copy of a similar thread, but there is an area where I'm struggling with my faith. Aren't these so called "bad Christians" or "extremists" who oppose abortion and homosexuality or anything else, merely practicing their faith according to their bible?
They are practicing their faith according to their interpretation of their bible, that's a whole lotta differnce.
 
Old 08-23-2015, 02:59 AM
 
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Actually the problem is not that people oppose sin , it is the activism in protesting the issue which does not show the peace seeking Christians should be .... See Christians are called to judge themselves , and pray for others and the world , and if others and the world fall apart that this is still all they are required to do
 
Old 08-23-2015, 03:05 AM
 
Location: On the brink of WWIII
21,088 posts, read 29,219,613 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostee View Post
Can you name anyone who is pro-life on abortion but pro-gay marriage? I can't think of many on the top of my head right now.
I am "pro-life"in that I sincerely believe that ALL children are entitled to CARE, LOVE, EDUCATION and SHELTER after they are born and through out their lives.
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Aren't the so-called "false Christians" who oppose homosexuality merely following their religion?-prolife_prochild.jpg  
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