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“Often it does seem such a pity that Noah and his party did not miss the boat.”-Mark Twain
Given the unprecedented ignorance of the Bible in contemporary America, it is likely that more young Americans will only know the Noah of 'Noah.' We can only hope that the film offers even a fraction of the wisdom of the original. - Dennis Prager
The only problem is that Zoroaster had the Avesta "revealed" to him by Ashura Mazda as much a millennium before Buddha is said to have been born.
Also, Mithraism, as practiced by the Persians (note, the Roman Mithraism is similar, but not the same) likely came before Zoroaster, as he denounced the killing of the bull.
Of much more interest is that Darius was the one who promoted Zoroastrian during his reign. Almost like Constantine did Christianity. The importance of this is even reflected in the OT, and as such, it is clear the impact Zoroastrians had on the Jews.
A long, but well written article on Zoroastrian , Judaism and Christianity, is this one.
Thanks! I'll check it out. (I was just making assumption about the chronology based on the emergence of ideas of rhetorical sophistry and the fact that a Buddhist Empire was the first politic/religion to foster a University system).
From Codex Leningradis which is the oldest complete copy of the Old Testament (1008 CE):
6:4 The Nephilim were in the earth in those days and also after that when came in the sons of the Elohim unto the daughters of men and they bore to them the same mighty men who were men of old men of renown.
No matter what you do, you can't get around the fact that the text states the Nephilim were in the earth in the days before the flood and in the days after the flood.
Since you insist upon relying on the faulty KJV, you should know Erasmus compounded the error in the mistranslated Septuagint with the root of Nephilim as nepal instead of nepil, which indicates "monstrous births" or abortions or miscarriages (see Ptolemy), which is what led to "Giants".
2.That the sons of the nobles saw the daughters of man when they were beautifying themselves, and they took for themselves wives from whomever they chose.
Rashi's Commentary:
the sons of the nobles: Heb. בְּנֵי הָאֱלֹהִים, the sons of the princes (Targumim) and the judges (Gen. Rabbah 26:5). Another explanation: בְּנֵי הָאֱלֹהִים are the princes who go as messengers of the Omnipresent. They too mingled with them (Pirkei d’Rabbi Eliezer, ch. 22). Every אֱלֹהִים in Scripture is an expression of authority, and the following proves it (Exod. 4:16): “And you shall be to him as a lord (לֵאלֹהִים)”; (ibid. 7:1): “See, I have made you a lord (אֶלֹהִים).”
when they were beautifying themselves: Heb., טֹבֹת. Said Rabbi Judan: It is written טבת [i.e., instead of טובות. Thus it can be read טָבַת, meaning to beautify.] When they would beautify her, adorned to enter the nuptial canopy, a noble would enter and have relations with her first (Gen. Rabbah 26:5).
from whomever they chose: Even a married woman, even males and animals (Gen. Rabbah ad loc.).
4.The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of the nobles would come to the daughters of man, and they would bear for them; they are the mighty men, who were of old, the men of renown.
Rashi's Commentary:
The Nephilim: [They were called נְפִילִים because they fell (נָפְלוּ) and caused the world to fall (הִפִּילוּ) (Gen. Rabbah 26:7), and in the Hebrew language it means giants (Pirkei d’Rabbi Eliezer, ch. 22 and Targum Jonathan).
in those days: in the days of the generation of Enosh and the children of Cain.
and also afterward: Although they had seen the destruction of the generation of Enosh, when the ocean rose up and inundated a third of the world, the generation of the Flood did not humble themselves to learn from them. — [from Mechilta Yithro, Massechta Bachodesh 6; Sifrei Ekev 743]
when…would come: They [the mothers] would bear giants like them [the fathers]. — [from Gen. Rabbah 26:7]
mighty men: to rebel against the Omnipresent. — [Yelammednu, Batei Midrashoth, p. 148]
the men of renown: Heb. אַנְשֵׁי הַשֵּׁם Those who were called by name: Irad, Me****ael, Methushael, who were so named because of their destruction, for they were wiped out (מְחוּיָאֵל from נִמּוֹחוּ) and uprooted; (מְתוּשָׁאֵל from הֻתָּשׁוּ). Another explanation: men of desolation (שִׁמָּמוֹן), who made the world desolate. — [from Gen. Rabbah 26:7]
The bolded underlined has to be interpreted this way if it is to be understood as written:
"There were giants on the earth before the flood and also after the flood when, after the flood the sons of Elohim came unto the daughters of men and got the pregnant."
This would explain how the Sons of God (angels) raped human women all over again after the flood just like they did before the flood. This also begs the un assailable question NO Christian can answer:
Why, in heavens name did God bother to wipe out the human race via the flood in the first place to stop the Nephilim from polluting the seed of man from which Jesus would come if he intended to just allow the Nephilim to pollute the human race all over again after the flood? Or are the Nephilim equal in power to God and God couldn't stop them from impregnating women all over again?
No Christian dares touch this question because it lays bare just how rife with myth and legend this story really is.
This is what you get when you read a mistranslated version of the TaNaKh...Jews don't even believe that silliness that Christians believe...
I'm guessing you haven't read Humanus Genus. Well, to make a long papal bull short, you're going to Hell because you have the audacity to elect your rulers/leaders instead of letting the Church appoint them for you.
Well, then, JWs are safe...
Quote:
You do understand that Classical Biblical Hebrew doesn't use punctuation, so, it's sometimes difficult to discern clauses and parenthetical remarks (and I don't profess to be 100% proficient in CBH).
Not difficult...
Quote:
Again, it depends on how you determine the root. The KJV --- which apparently is not your favorite --- takes the root to be nepal, which implies some sort of monstrosity. I'm not certain, but I was inclined to believe that the Septuagint rendered it so, which is why I referenced Ptolemy, who uses the same verb to describe monstrous (deformed) births in his text on astronomy/astrology.
If you accept the root to be nepil, then there's still some confusion as to the type of verb, which makes a difference translating it as "those who are fallen" (or who fell) versus "those who were cast out."
the root is not Nepal/Nepil (which you forgot the "h" after the "p"), but "NPL" or "NUN-PEY-LAMED", so, yes, the root words are the same, it depends on the niqqudot that is employed which changes the meaning of the root word...PEY has a soft sound FEY, which would give "NUN-FEY-LAMED"...
In Hebrew the roots are usually three characters and from there many words are formed...Not necessarily all having a connection with each other...
You're entitled to your opinion. I will not call anyone a heretic for their understanding of this text in that way. The Christian faith is not based on the identity of the Nephilim.
Angels do not procreate. The giants were men who once walked with God, hence given the name Son's of God but became fallen from the Grace and took as many wife's as they wanted, contrary to God's original plan for them and so became part of the problem [another was violence by all, not just the giants] in polluting the world with sin. Even after the flood there were some giant men because the gene pool carried over but that does not make a giant person any more prone to sin then the rest. God simply likes variety and it is each type of people's responsibility to serve the Truth rather then selfless gain. One can not say that God made a mistake seeing that Grace has been always available.
Enoch walked with God and was taken by God to a far better place and in so doing left the witness that Grace has always been available.
BUT the book you base your faith on makes sure that Nephilim are included... twice. Obviously it was relevant to the story at the time, so now it is to be disregarded?
Why?
It is not part of the Law that supposedly Jesus fulfilled. Therefore, it was not cancelled or to be ignored. After all, your not ignoring a ton of stuff in Genesis otherwise. Apparently that other stuff is important and you base your faith on it, but all of a sudden, here comes an unexplained and difficult part, and oooops, the narrative becomes, "That part of the bible is not important, so let's pick, and choose, and ignore it".
Come to think of it, that IS very Christian of you.
I'm beginning to suspect that modern Christianity is the "***** of Babylon" that is spoken of in Revelation...I mean, it wasn't a small amount of folks in there, it was a large multitude...Wasn't it?...
The Nephilim weren't on the ark. They weren't a race of people or animals. They were not a half-breed of angels and man or gods and man. The Bible doesn't teach that.
I forgot about the Book of Giants in the Qumran Scrolls.
4Q203, 1Q23, 2Q26, 4Q530-532, 6Q8
Those are the text numbers for anyone who wants to look them up.
Also the Book of Enoch teaches it.
The only complete Book of Enoch is contained in the Ethiopic Missionary Text, but there are fragments of the Book of Enoch in the Qumran Scrolls.
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