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Who is "we", in this context? Does that include dogs, birds, spiders, etc?
"We" includes all sources of consciousness. There are levels of consciousness within our own bodies (unconscious, subconscious, autonomic, etc.) so why would there not be such within the God that we are merely a part of?
"We" includes all sources of consciousness. There are levels of consciousness within our own bodies (unconscious, subconscious, autonomic, etc.) so why would there not be such within the God that we are merely a part of?
There are different levels of electricity in a TV, so why would there not be such in the universal TV that we are merely a part of? Well, mainly because there's no reason to think that just because parts of the universe contain TVs that demonstrates that the entire universe is. Same problem with consciousness.
There are different levels of electricity in a TV, so why would there not be such in the universal TV that we are merely a part of? Well, mainly because there's no reason to think that just because parts of the universe contain TVs that demonstrates that the entire universe is. Same problem with consciousness.
Watching the discussion again. Seeing the nub of the matter arising.
Not calling everything "God" and then declaring that God exists - nobody is going to be fooled by that - but the link between matter and the human consciousness that is the evidence for "God" (the caveat quotes is Mystic's trademark for his god -claim). That link is animal consciousness. Mystic is, or so I recall, a bit evasive about that.
To be fair, I have to flag up the idea of wangling ideas and meanings as well as semantics.
Mystic, I think, does (or did) argue that consciousness exists throughout the universe (indeed it is the universe - which is why he calls it "God"). Human conscious is obviously of a different order or "God" would be spiritually educating the earthworms and mealybugs, too. So, consciousness concentrates, like a crowd of gnats under a shady tree, in humans to provide a more powerful bunch of Consciousness that puts ours apart from animal consciousness and indeed the mere physical reactions of matter that we in our ignorant concrete mode of thinking fail to perceive as Obviously "God".
And blow me, if in describing Mystic's hypothesis, I haven't debunked it. Or maybe not - what do you geniuses think?
Last edited by TRANSPONDER; 07-01-2016 at 06:20 AM..
Similarly, the wrong order of the creation and specifically the sun an moon made after the light they produced had been made had to be explained in various ingenious ways. Nobody is more ingenious than our pal Eusebius (2), and the belated creation of sun an moon is explained by their being there already when the light appeared but Moses couldn't see them because of the cloud -cover (rummage through Psalms, Job or Isaiah to find a reference to the clouds that float above the earth, just as they do today, to "Prove" this theory) and God, while showing Moses the vision (as man hadn't been made yet) didn't explain to him that they were really there but he couldn't see them because of the clouds.
There is no wrong order to creation.
When God said "Let there be light", He didn't say "let the sun and moon give forth their light." He brought about light just as He will in the final eon and light is in the New City Jerusalem and there will be no need of the sun or moon for light. That is what it says.
There is no wrong order to creation.
When God said "Let there be light", He didn't say "let the sun and moon give forth their light." He brought about light just as He will in the final eon and light is in the New City Jerusalem and there will be no need of the sun or moon for light. That is what it says.
Eusebius old chum, we have done that long since. I am NOT going to do it again. If anyone out there is interested in hearing the case for Genesis order of Creation is wrong, including refutation of the 'Cloud cover' excuse, I am willing, but they can better look up geological ages and compare it with Genesis and draw their own conclusions. (though indeed my post covers it, and you have pointedly ignored it. Nuff sed, case closed). And I for one, find the First earth and Aeions obsession intensely uninteresting. I will leave you to anyone who is interested.
Eusebius old chum, we have done that long since. I am NOT going to do it again. If anyone out there is interested in hearing the case for Genesis order of Creation is wrong, including refutation of the 'Cloud cover' excuse, I am willing, but they can better look up geological ages and compare it with Genesis and draw their own conclusions. (though indeed my post covers it, and you have pointedly ignored it. Nuff sed, case closed). And I for one, find the First earth and Aeions obsession intensely uninteresting. I will leave you to anyone who is interested.
"We" includes all sources of consciousness. There are levels of consciousness within our own bodies (unconscious, subconscious, autonomic, etc.) so why would there not be such within the God that we are merely a part of?
Quote:
Originally Posted by KCfromNC
There are different levels of electricity in a TV, so why would there not be such in the universal TV that we are merely a part of? Well, mainly because there's no reason to think that just because parts of the universe contain TVs that demonstrates that the entire universe is. Same problem with consciousness.
Unlike you, KC, Martin gets the analogy. You simply refuse to or are incapable of it.
Unlike you, KC, Martin gets the analogy. You simply refuse to or are incapable of it.
Godophobia. Severe. Cure unknown. Very sad.
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Seeing the nub of the matter arising.
