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The Abrahamic Religions collectively account for over half of the World Population...much of it heavily armed and willing to fight long and hard.
Religious belief is much lower in the liberal regions of America compared to the conservative regions.
I'm willing to bet that less than 50% of people in the northeast and west coast believe that Jesus is the Son of God, the Resurrection really happened or that Satan is real, for example.
Religious belief is much lower in the liberal regions of America compared to the conservative regions.
I'm willing to bet that less than 50% of people in the northeast and west coast believe that Jesus is the Son of God, the Resurrection really happened or that Satan is real, for example.
I said..."Abrahamic Religions collectively", and "World Population".
A response about just Christianity and then the U.S. only, addresses a small fraction of what I noted.
From a "Real World" perspective, and looking at it pragmatically taking "The Facts On The Ground" into consideration: For all of human history, MIGHT is what "makes right"...and "numbers make might, and thus rule and dominate". "Right" and "wrong" are not moral/ethical/logical issues...not in "The Grand Scheme of Things".
The Abrahamic Religions collectively account for over half of the World Population...much of it heavily armed and willing to fight long and hard. History has shown: Contest it at your sure peril/demise.
I'm smart and wise enough not to spit into strong winds and whack at the big hornets nest.
Read my favorite book, "Art of War" by Sun Tzu...that will give accurate insight.
The weak and/or the few in any equation such as this need to learn & know their role and their position.
Wanna dominate and rule...and establish/enforce your version of what is "right"?! Then get the numbers and the might, or get the numbers and might to back you up. Until then, know your place in the "pecking order" and the "food chain".
"Such councils will make the Enemy's victory certain indeed." (Gandalf - LoR/R.K)
As is, of course, your hope.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GldnRule
I said..."Abrahamic Religions collectively", and "World Population".
A response about just Christianity and then the U.S. only, addresses a small fraction of what I noted.
Even as Gandalf persuaded him that there was hope that Gondor would win this battle, Denethor retorted that they were losing to the Enemy everywhere else. If he had said: "Sod the odds, let's fight and hope". he would have seen unexpected victory. Instead the threw himself on a burning pyre.
"Such councils will make the Enemy's victory certain indeed." (Gandalf - LoR/R.K)
As is, of course, your hope.
Even as Gandalf persuaded him that there was hope that Gondor would win this battle, Denethor retorted that they were losing to the Enemy everywhere else. If he had said: "Sod the odds, let's fight and hope". he would have seen unexpected victory. Instead the threw himself on a burning pyre.
Don't let us keep you.
What does quotes from LOR (a fiction movie), and fictitious scenarios from it, have to do with my noting the way this world REALLY IS?
A response based in REALITY would be cool, though. Got one?
The issue is you, et al, viewing Religion as "the Enemy" that is "wrong"...and that you are "right", and should thus contest and defeat them.
While I may be of the opinion that this World would be better off without Organized Religion...I feel no need to try to divest the Religious of their chosen Beliefs/Faith/Traditions and have them think as I do.
"Right" and "wrong" are not necessarily objective concepts. I am able to tolerate and accept that others hold views on it that differ from mine.
I am wondering for how many of you it is important that you are "right" with the religious outlook (or lack thereof) that your are having and how often you consider that you might actually be WRONG?
I guess it depends what you mean. It is not important to me to always be right and never be wrong if that is what you mean. But it is important to me to strive TOWARDS being as right as I can be in all things, all of the time.
What I mean by that is that I am not emotionally invested in the things I believe to be true today being true. I AM emotionally invested in finding out what is "right" and "true" however. So if I am wrong about something today, I will be HAPPY to find that out and change it. Because then I will be more right tomorrow.
So I think it is important to strive towards being right. It is not important that you BE right at any one time. And in fact being shown where you are wrong, especially in debate or discourse, is a wonderful thing.
Too many people think entering a debate means your goal is to "win" it by being right. No the goal of debate and discourse..... especially rigourous debate and discourse..... is to find out where you are wrong.
And that makes you the real winner in a debate. Because a person who enters a debate "right" or even just thinking they are "right".... and leaves the same way.... has gained nothing. The person who enters a debate wrong and is corrected or learns something new...... leaves with more than they arrived with. So they are the true winner on the day.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliksder
How often does this cross your mind? Does it ever? If so, how does it affect you? Does it not bother you or do you simply finally always arrive (upon further invstigation) at the conclusion that you are right and that's that?
No I operate under the tacit assumption I am wrong all the time. And when I defend the things I THINK are right (which I do quite robustly and strongly) in debate and discourse I do so not to convince others of my point of view..... but to inspire others to find the holes in my arguments or ideas and correct me and educate me.
It happens less and less these days, especially in conversation with theists, but it still happens and I relish the goal and the attempts and the meeting of minds in "idea space".
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliksder
There might be others who concede without problem that there is no 100% certainty for anything but they follow their chosen path anyhow. Does the unncertainty bother you at all?
It does not bother me. It is foundationally built into my entire world view. It drives me. And it drives, for example, all of science. The unknown, the uncertainty, they are drives and core motivations, not hinderances or bothersome traits.
But many people are the opposite. Admission or existence of ignorance bothers them. And they prefer AN answer, no matter how bad or unsubstantiated, to NO answer. Which is why many have a passion about their religious narratives. Because it fills the gaps in knowledge and turns off the questing and questioning mind. If you do not know something..... make it up.
Correct. We need something more than personal opinion to arrive at sound conclusions. What (or which) method are we going to use?
"Sound conclusions" for what?
Research and development of technology? Or basic day to day living?
For everyday living...personal experience & opinion and basic knowledge is very sufficient. If it wasn't...mankind would not have survived for this long...nor would animals.
Even much of the world right now lives very simply, some even primitive. They exist just fine.
Most of the real meaningful things in life, we have no objective answers for at all...and probably never will. The claim we "need" or "must have" all the "right" answers is not only bogus...it is arrogant, IMO.
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