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If god 'speaks' to you, it is taking place in your mind (is it not) which is exactly why proof is an impossibility (and is why the expectation of proof in order for someone to express their opinion or 'feelings' is illogical).
It is not because 'god is pretty particular about leaving no evidence'; but because proof (or an autograph) representative of your thoughts, i.e. what you perceive as god, is impossible.
true, so long as I perceive a deity as the only way to define god it will be impossible to experience it.
I wouldn't expect anyone to. But, it seems to me that some atheists can't abide other people sharing their experiences on a religious and spirituality forum without constantly interjecting their belief that sharing those experiences has no value to them. It's like they don't want to allow the rest of us to draw our own conclusions about what value we take away from it. That's how it comes off, at any rate. Me, I'd rather address the actual content of the experience, rather than insisting it can't have happened, and I honestly don't understand why that seems to be such a sore spot for some atheists.
its not you experience that is the sore spot plreoo. Their primary goal, as they have said, is to stop religion in the states. Trans and I went back and forth about assessing what the people claim and what they may actually be experiencing using science is different than basing the assessment of a belief on how one feels about religion. They went so as to tell me something a kin to a ... although valid, its not practical in stopping religion. We don't want to give theist anything to use and make atheism harder to sell.
So its not your experience that they have a problem with. Talking about your experience's validity, in terms of science, does not match their goal. Hence science and engineering is shunned. Also, they speak openly about NOT aligning a belief to what we know about the universe (the standard model) to the what spiritual people are claiming they feel.
Last edited by Arach Angle; 05-02-2020 at 04:24 PM..
That's because they don't, since they are not universal.
And because they're highly subjective, which means they exist for you and you alone and no one else.
Strange how your god is totally incapable of discerning between subjectivity and objectivity.
I'd be happy to teach your god the difference.
this is actually not true.
Yes, things are subjective but we have a method that lessens error and bias. Its not perfect, and it won't shun things just because you don't religion, but its the best we have.
They are not universal anymore than how fast we run is. They are happening all over the place so we have to look at why that may be.
thats funny, you teach pel. she is like a light year ahead of me, you in relation to me, not so much.
How do you know for certain that God has "let them down"?
There are plenty of blind, deaf, mentally retarded, amputees, comatose, vegetated and homeless people, even victims of crimes, who don't believe that "God let them down".
If *YOU* had any of those experiences, *YOU* may think that God let *YOU* down.
But you don't get to speak for ALL others in the same circumstances.
Would it surprise you to know that some of those "less fortunate" people do NOT see themselves as "less fortunate", but who actually THANK GOD for their disability?
This sounds like Mystic's 'radio- receiver brain gets garbled messages' argument. Which is of course explaining away the fact that the Mental Messages that are claimed to come from one source come through in different ways.
nipped for space ...
As usual, Occam's razor comes into play and for those who would dismiss the Principle of parsimony, the materialist default and the burden of proof, I'd say they can do that, but can never again honestly use the word 'Logic' in making their arguments.
How about instead of denying everything with convoluted logic we address how being in the system defines how we are reacting to the system? How about we look at a complex protein, so complex in fact, it senses its part of the system?
Oh right, my bad, if we do that theist might use it. And we wouldn't want something like facts to get in the way of atheism statement of belief about god.
you know .... because so long as we run away from facts we can use hear-say to fight blind faith dogma.
true, so long as I perceive a deity as the only way to define god it will be impossible to experience it.
One can't experience/perceive anything they haven't defined i.e. interpreted for themselves. Spirituality is perception; and our thoughts are our own (even people who believe in a god can't disagree with this).
One can't experience/perceive anything they haven't defined i.e. interpreted for themselves. Spirituality is perception; and our thoughts are our own (even people who believe in a god can't disagree with this).
True, but it shouldn't be used as a scape goat. we can look at a group of people behaving a certain way and assign that trait to the group. Even though not all members shows all the exact same habits. Then we have to look at the possible reasons.
True, but it shouldn't be used as a scape goat. we can look at a group of people behaving a certain way and assign that trait to the group. Even though not all members shows all the exact same habits. Then we have to look at the possible reasons.
Use what as a scapegoat - and by whom? It's simply physiology.
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