Evolution question of the day (Jerusalem, Israel, Jewish, believing)
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How long are you going to cling to a theory that has no basis in truth?
Every day archaeology verifies many Biblical claims. For years and years they doubted the existence of the Hittites...until their capital city was discovered.
Mount Olympus exists. Athens exists. Many other places in Greek mythology actually exist too. Therefore, by your logic that makes all the Greek myths "Truth".
The Cambrian Explosion most certainly does not go against the theory of evolution. One solid hypothesis poses the following:
At the advent of the Cambrian period, which led to most of the major groups of animals still around today, the fossil record suddenly (well, suddenly in geologic terms lol!) shows a whole plethora of new critters with claws and shells and complex eyes and other interesting features. These defining features all have to do with survival versus other organisms. All of a sudden, in order to merely survive, creatures have to move and see and defend themselves effectively -- to escape other critters that want to eat them, and to find critters that they can themselves eat.
Such variation cannot begin or exist without selective pressure.
Last edited by ZugZub; 03-06-2009 at 12:42 PM..
Reason: Typo
Mount Olympus exists. Athens exists. Many other places in Greek mythology actually exist too. Therefore, by your logic that makes all the Greek myths "Truth".
All hail Zeus!
And I found Delos a truly mesmerizing place, even in ruins. No wonder it's the birthplace of Apollo. I guess that's further scientific proof that Greek mythology is THE truth.
And I found Delos a truly mesmerizing place, even in ruins. No wonder it's the birthplace of Apollo. I guess that's further scientific proof that Greek mythology is THE truth.
Personally, the Greek gods are much more interesting to me than the Judeo-Christian one. At least the Greek gods know how to party.
Uhhh...It wasn't an actual explosion kd, but happened over a period of more than 50 million years...No evidence against evolution, but a lot of evidence for during that period...Got anything else?
The Cambrian Explosion most certainly does not go against the theory of evolution. One solid hypothesis poses the following:
At the advent of the Cambrian period, which led to most of the major groups of animals still around today, the fossil record suddenly (well, suddenly in geologic terms lol!) shows a whole plethora of new critters with claws and shells and complex eyes and other interesting features. These defining features all have to do with survival versus other organisms. All of a sudden, in order to merely survive, creatures have to move and see and defend themselves effectively -- to escape other critters that want to eat them, and to find critters that they can themselves eat.
Such variation cannot begin or exist without selective pressure.
It's an inordinate amount of fossils appearing suddenly in the record. It just doesn't line up. There is no way to explain it. You tried to tell me why they'd need variation...but there is no way of explaining huge numbers appearing suddenly.
I'm waiting now for that proof of evolution that I was promised.
It's an inordinate amount of fossils appearing suddenly in the record. It just doesn't line up. There is no way to explain it. You tried to tell me why they'd need variation...but there is no way of explaining huge numbers appearing suddenly.
I'm waiting now for that proof of evolution that I was promised.
You realize that "suddenly" in geologic terms isn't a particularly short period of time...or perhaps you don't. We're talking something like 50million or so years. In any case, selective pressure was the cause, and rapid evolution was the effect. Pretty simple, really. Then again, I'm an uneducated fool, so maybe one of the real scientists here can explain it better than I can.
But, we'll wait for you to ignore our plain answers yet again, and for your inevitable response that evolution is a crock of shyte and that nobody can prove it and that means your god did everything.
See boys, here's the trouble with your approach. But first I must add, C34, that you da$mn-well know that way back, we've posted the all links that show the very well-documented transitional fossil humanoid forms. You just dismiss them all and think that some faker made 'em up in his lab late one night out of Plaster of Paris and Plasticene. There's no convicinig the intransigent, now is there?
What has been PROVEN is the absolute mechanism by which evolution takes place. Which part of the following do you dispute? This time, answerr me or abandon the thread. Or acknowledge that you're way over your head in terms of understanding this, and you're just letting others who are scientifically illiterate tell you how it is. Simple.
Here they are. Dispute away.
1. DNA absolutely records mutations within its unique structure. A mutation occurs during DNA/RNA transcription and it is thus encoded into the subsequent alleles & genotype, and thus affects all future phenotypes.
You getting this? You even understand it? If you actually don't (which I'm betting on, BTW), how the heck can you deny it? It'd be like you saying to a bunch of NASA engineers: "There's absoutely NO WAY you can land a Rover on Mars! Too complex! It doesn't matter that I have absolutely NO KNOWLEDGE about such things, IT CAN'T BE DONE! There. I've made such a strong argument! I'm SO PROUD of myself!"
But I digress... sorry folks. My emotions got me for a moment. Perhaps I don't have the endless patience to instruct the very young...
3. We have and can observe those important mutations. Proved. Observed. Documented.
4. Most of these mutations in DNA sequences are lethal, but not all. Some mean nothing, and a very few are positive. This is just logical, since they are, after all, by chance. But enough of them happen (Dr. Lenski OBSERVED this, in bacteria, our progenitors, over just a sample 10 a day period in his population, and it was a micro-nano-mini-sliver of the population that would have been "mutating" even in a little backwater slime pond back in the early primordial days). He saw about 10 potentially positive mutations a day, ignoring the lethal ones!
Imagine then the populations and mutatin' going on in the entire world's oceans back in the primordial days! Even today! Quadzillions! Bah-zillions! Per hour! Over billions and billions of years! Too complex? Too improbable? Hah!
BTW, for your general education, a "mutation" means, by definition, a simple alteration in the sequence of amino acids in the DNA. Say, instead of accurately replicating the existing string of DNA: AGCTTTAACAATCA, the RNA misreads it and commands the replacement duplicate string to be AGCTTTAGAATCA. A simple little error, right? but it affects whatever protein that string was supposed to make. The result? Arthritis, sickle-cell anemia, down's Syndrome, blonde hair instead of red, the ability to climb a tree slightly faster, etc. etc. Possibly lethal, but then that resulting organism dies quickly and doesn't reach sexual maturity and the bad gene doesn't get passed on.
BTW, C34, can you tell me, without going to the net, what, exactly, ACGT means? What's the other uncommon additional letter? Which ones does each other link to? Indeed, show us what you know sir! What knowledge you use to critically review the "Theory of Evolution". We'll know if you had to look it up; to learn this stuff in genetics takes more than 15 minutes!
See how utterly un-complex this is, C34? It's not so complex, now is it?
5. When the DNA of an organism creates such occasional positive changes, they may very well confir a real advantage to that organism, and it thus takes advantage of that change (wouldn't you), and it's particular lineage is promoted at the possible expense of it's bretheren, or it simply moves into an entirely different niche. Simple & observed. You have proof otherwise?
6. When enough of these changes have occurred (and they do, and are, every day in our world) the original organism starts to look different, and laymen around the world proclaim it's a different species. Giraffe versus nanteater or coyote or chimp or man). Vastly different "looks" are NOT, however, required to be called a new species. Other key elements may be in effect, but may not be visible. After all, neither you nor I can see the differences between a pertussis and an aureus bacterial species, now can we. But I assure you, they're VERY different, now aren't they? And they're very real, if you've ever contracted either one. You can't deny that they exist or that they're different. But still, you cant see them.
So, C34. Six (6) {VI} simple points that, to the rest of the world, are proven truths, and coincidentally are very logical. You seem to think otherwise, or, I'll grant you, perhaps you simply don't understand the genetic basics of it all. Well, there they are, above, in simple, easy to understand terms. All PROVABLE, BTW.
Take a moment and tell me, specifically, which of the points above you don't agree on. OR PERHAPS JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND. Because they, in total, constitute Evolution. No, it's NOT abiogenesis, it's Evolution! Let's not take our beliefs from some scientifically ignorant minister up front in Church trying to make fun of Evolution by saying "None of you has ever seen a cat turn into a dog have you? Evolution's (let's all chant together now) "Just A Theory!" "There. Great! You all got It! We Win!"
How banal. He DOES, however, win "The Flat Earth Believer's Society" Award.
I'll be back!
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Oh man... it just goes on and on.....
