Biblical Hygiene (abortion, Commandments, contradiction, Christians)

[Starlady01]

Originally Posted by LogicIsYourFriend

I was in a church today because I'm part of a choir that rehearses there, and I noticed that near the front door there are posts with bottles of hand sanitizer, for everyone who walks in to kill germs.

And I thought..

If only the bible had information on how to kill and avoid germs, how much more beneficial and useful that would be to civilization. Instead we just get a bunch of outlandish stories and contradictory morals that are impossible to follow.

I already knew this but had to look it up just the same to make sure I didn't miss qoute.

Encyclopedia Britannica documents that in 1845, a young doctor in Vienna named Dr. Ignaz Semmelweis was horrified at the terrible death rate of women who gave birth in hospitals. As many as 30 percent died after giving birth. Semmelweis noted that doctors would examine the bodies of patients who died, then, without washing their hands, go straight to the next ward and examine expectant mothers. This was their normal practice, because the presence of microscopic diseases was unknown. Semmelweis insisted that doctors wash their hands before examinations, and the death rate immediately dropped to 2 percent. Look at the specific instructions God gave His people for when they ((encounter disease)) "And when he that has an issue is cleansed of his issue; then he shall number to himself even days for his cleansing, and wash his clothes, and bathe his flesh in running water, and shall be clean" (Leviticus 15:13). Until recent years, doctors washed their hands in a bowl of water, leaving invisible germs on their hands. However, the Bible says specifically to wash hands under "running water."

[Starlady01]

Originally Posted by Starlady01

Encyclopedia Britannica documents that in 1845, a young doctor in Vienna named Dr. Ignaz Semmelweis was horrified at the terrible death rate of women who gave birth in hospitals. As many as 30 percent died after giving birth. Semmelweis noted that doctors would examine the bodies of patients who died, then, without washing their hands, go straight to the next ward and examine expectant mothers. This was their normal practice, because the presence of microscopic diseases was unknown. Semmelweis insisted that doctors wash their hands before examinations, and the death rate immediately dropped to 2 percent. Look at the specific instructions God gave His people for when they ((encounter disease)) "And when he that has an issue is cleansed of his issue; then he shall number to himself even days for his cleansing, and wash his clothes, and bathe his flesh in running water, and shall be clean" (Leviticus 15:13). Until recent years, doctors washed their hands in a bowl of water, leaving invisible germs on their hands. However, the Bible says specifically to wash hands under "running water."

More food for thought:

Scientific Facts in the Bible
1. Only in recent years has science discovered that everything we see is composed of invisible atoms. Here, Scripture tells us that the "things which are seen were not made of things which do appear."
2. Medical science has only recently discovered that blood-clotting in a newborn reaches its peak on the eighth day, then drops. The Bible consistently says that a baby must be circumcised on the eighth day.
3. At a time when it was believed that the earth sat on a large animal or a giant (1500 B.C.), the Bible spoke of the earth’s free float in space: "He...hangs the earth upon nothing" (Job 26:7).
4. The prophet Isaiah also tells us that the earth is round: "It is he that sits upon the circle of the earth" (Isaiah 40:22). This is not a reference to a flat disk, as some skeptic maintain, but to a sphere. Secular man discovered this 2,400 years later. At a time when science believed that the earth was flat, is was the Scriptures that inspired Christopher Columbus to sail around the world (see Proverbs 3:6 footnote).
5. God told Job in 1500 B.C.: "Can you send lightnings, that they may go, and say to you, Here we are?" (Job 38:35). The Bible here is making what appears to be a scientifically ludicrous statement—that light can be sent, and then manifest itself in speech. But did you know that radio waves travel at the speed of light? This is why you can have instantaneous wireless communication with someone on the other side of the earth. Science didn’t discover this until 1864 when "British scientist James Clerk Maxwell suggested that electricity and light waves were two forms of the same thing" (Modern Century Illustrated Encyclopedia).
6. Job 38:19 asks, "Where is the way where light dwells?" Modern man has only recently discovered that light (electromagnetic radiation) has a "way," traveling at 186,000 miles per second.
7. Science has discovered that stars emit radio waves, which are received on earth as a high pitch. God mentioned this in Job 38:7: "When the morning stars sang together..."
8. "Most cosmologists (scientists who study the structures and evolution of the universe) agree that the Genesis account of creation, in imagining an initial void, may be uncannily close to the truth" (Time, Dec. 1976).
9. Solomon described a "cycle" of air currents two thousand years before scientists "discovered" them. "The wind goes toward the south, and turns about unto the north; it whirls about continually, and the wind returns again according to his circuits" (Ecclesiastes 1:6).
10. Science expresses the universe in five terms: time, space, matter, power, and motion. Genesis 1:1,2 revealed such truths to the Hebrews in 1450 B.C.: "In the beginning [time] God created [power] the heaven [space] and the earth [matter] . . . And the Spirit of God moved [motion] upon the face of the waters." The first thing God tells man is that He controls of all aspects of the universe.
11. The great biological truth concerning the importance of blood in our body’s mechanism has been fully comprehended only in recent years. Up until 120 years ago, sick people were "bled," and many died because of the practice. If you lose your blood, you lose your life. Yet Leviticus 17:11, written 3,000 years ago, declared that blood is the source of life: "For the life of the flesh is in the blood."
12. All things were made by Him (see John 1:3), including dinosaurs. Why then did the dinosaur disappear? The answer may be in Job 40:15–24. In this passage, God speaks about a great creature called "behemoth." Some commentators think this was a hippopotamus. However, the hippo’s tail isn’t like a large tree, but a small twig. Following are the characteristics of this huge animal: It was the largest of all the creatures God made; was plant-eating (herbivorous); had its strength in its hips and a tail like a large tree. It had very strong bones, lived among the trees, drank massive amounts of water, and was not disturbed by a raging river. He appears impervious to attack because his nose could pierce through snares, but Scripture says, "He that made him can make his sword to approach unto him." In other words, God caused this, the largest of all the creatures He had made, to become extinct.
13. Encyclopedia Britannica documents that in 1845, a young doctor in Vienna named Dr. Ignaz Semmelweis was horrified at the terrible death rate of women who gave birth in hospitals. As many as 30 percent died after giving birth. Semmelweis noted that doctors would examine the bodies of patients who died, then, without washing their hands, go straight to the next ward and examine expectant mothers. This was their normal practice, because the presence of microscopic diseases was unknown. Semmelweis insisted that doctors wash their hands before examinations, and the death rate immediately dropped to 2 percent. Look at the specific instructions God gave His people for when they encounter disease: "And when he that has an issue is cleansed of his issue; then he shall number to himself even days for his cleansing, and wash his clothes, and bathe his flesh in running water, and shall be clean" (Leviticus 15:13). Until recent years, doctors washed their hands in a bowl of water, leaving invisible germs on their hands. However, the Bible says specifically to wash hands under "running water."
14. Luke 17:34–36 says the Second Coming of Jesus Christ will occur while some are asleep at night and others are working at daytime activities in the field. This is a clear indication of a revolving earth, with day and night at the same time.
15. "During the devastating Black Death of the fourteenth century, patients who were sick or dead were kept in the same rooms as the rest of the family. People often wondered why the disease was affecting so many people at one time. They attributed these epidemics to ‘bad air’ or ‘evil spirits.’ However, careful attention to the medical commands of God as revealed in Leviticus would have saved untold millions of lives. Arturo Castiglione wrote about the overwhelming importance of this biblical medical law: ‘The laws against leprosyin Leviticus 13 may be regarded as the first model of sanitary legislation’ (A History of Medicine)." Grant R. Jeffery, The Signature of God With all these truths revealed in Scripture,how could a thinking person deny that the Bible is supernatural in origin? There is no other book in any of the world’s religions (Vedas, Bhagavad-Gita, Koran, Book of Mormon, etc.) that contains scientific truth. In fact, they contain statements that are clearly unscientific. Hank Hanegraaff said, "Faith in Christ is not some blind leap into a dark chasm, but a faith based on established evidence." (11:3 continued)

[Fred314X]

...Which goes to show that people weren't necessarily stupid two thousand years ago. They just didn't know from plastics or the internet!

[BergenCountyJohnny]

I wish logic were your friend, too.

[LogicIsYourFriend]

Originally Posted by Starlady01

I already knew this but had to look it up just the same to make sure I didn't miss qoute.

Encyclopedia Britannica documents that in 1845, a young doctor in Vienna named Dr. Ignaz Semmelweis was horrified at the terrible death rate of women who gave birth in hospitals. As many as 30 percent died after giving birth. Semmelweis noted that doctors would examine the bodies of patients who died, then, without washing their hands, go straight to the next ward and examine expectant mothers. This was their normal practice, because the presence of microscopic diseases was unknown. Semmelweis insisted that doctors wash their hands before examinations, and the death rate immediately dropped to 2 percent. Look at the specific instructions God gave His people for when they ((encounter disease)) "And when he that has an issue is cleansed of his issue; then he shall number to himself even days for his cleansing, and wash his clothes, and bathe his flesh in running water, and shall be clean" (Leviticus 15:13). Until recent years, doctors washed their hands in a bowl of water, leaving invisible germs on their hands. However, the Bible says specifically to wash hands under "running water."

Those "specific instructions" say nothing about soap. There is nothing in the bible about making soap and using it every day. And it's funny that you use Leviticus to prove this point, when I can bet you will easily dismiss other parts of Leviticus as irrelevant.

Yes, running water helps, but it left out a key fact: USE SOAP. It doesn't even mention how to make soap. This is my point, and I keep getting bible-defenders trying to deflect from that idea by telling me about the few things the bible does have about hygiene. If we followed the bible's tips on hygiene, we would be doing a lot of useless rituals like sprinkling blood on each other and quarantining women on their period, and maybe we might catch the idea buried in there to use running water, even though most verses that talk about washing don't say anything about running water, (and again, nothing about soap period). Woopie, some end-all book on living clean..

[rifleman]

=

[rifleman]

I picked out just this one thought-provoker, Starlady:

7. Science has discovered that stars emit radio waves, which are received on earth as a high pitch. God mentioned this in Job 38:7: "When the morning stars sang together..."

"Singing stars" in chorus PROVES the biblical authors knew of stars emitting radio waves? Quite a stretch. The ones that do, radio pulsars, are NOT visible in the heavens, and require radio telescopes such as Arecibo.

The 305 meter telescope

BTW, in addition, most of the detected signals at Arecibo came from stars over a 100 million years old. Opppseee on the YEC timeline, huh?

Your very VERY ambiguous annotation is typical of all the others here as well. Very creative reading into things is typical of the fundamentalist approach to criticizing or dismissing true scientific investigation, and only proves the vast levels of scientific illiteracy out there. People are very easily convinced of anything they want to believe. Stands to reason.

The bible's simply not specific enough, and it's wildly over-credited with far too many things. Like the statements of some about leviathans proving dinosaurs co-existed with man, etc. Folks saddling up Tommy the T-Rex.

This entire post is simply a "cut and paste" from Living Waters | Living Waters or Answers in Genesis. no independent thought required, just rote re-pastes of the same tired old nonsense stuff, uber-ambiguous and with no supporting numbers, referencs or evidence. Just very wishful thinking.

Riggghhhttt...

All stupifyingly ambiguous and infantile. sorry; FAIL.

[BergenCountyJohnny]

Originally Posted by LogicIsYourFriend

Those "specific instructions" say nothing about soap. There is nothing in the bible about making soap and using it every day. And it's funny that you use Leviticus to prove this point, when I can bet you will easily dismiss other parts of Leviticus as irrelevant.

Yes, running water helps, but it left out a key fact: USE SOAP. It doesn't even mention how to make soap. This is my point, and I keep getting bible-defenders trying to deflect from that idea by telling me about the few things the bible does have about hygiene. If we followed the bible's tips on hygiene, we would be doing a lot of useless rituals like sprinkling blood on each other and quarantining women on their period, and maybe we might catch the idea buried in there to use running water, even though most verses that talk about washing don't say anything about running water, (and again, nothing about soap period). Woopie, some end-all book on living clean..

Yep. The Bible obviously is worthless because it doesn't mention soap. Another good example, it never tells you what to do if you're sick. Paul says something about drinking a little wine if your stomach hurts, but that's it.

Drink a little wine? Why doesn't the Bible say to go to an emergency room and see a doctor? And if anyone tries to say "well there were no emergency rooms back then", well then the obvious question is why didn't the Bible give instructions on how to build an emergency room, plus all the instructions and curricula needed to train and educate doctors??? Why doesn't the Bible say that when someone breaks a bone they should use an x-ray to see how it is broken, and also why doesn't the Bible teach what an x-ray is and how to build an x-ray machine?

Also, why doesn't the Bible say what to do if you are in a car accident? And why doesn't the bible explain what a car is and how to make one???

Obviously the Bible is a fraud, it never once mentions soap, cars, emergency rooms, video games, or a lot of other stuffs.

[rifleman]

But, BCJ, we've been recently advised, it DID fully understand and anticipate radio frequency emissions from 100 million year-old stars.

Well of course it did!

You know, after I easily Googled and found the source of that list of supposed biblical scientific facts, I tried the same approach myself. I simply checked on "biblical contradictions".

There's a LOT of lists! The following is only a partial very short list of what's out there. I didn't want to take up too much of your folks' time, but the following 12 items shows what unthinking, non-critical cut-and-posting can accomplish. I'm awfully impressed with myself!

Contradictions in the bible

1. God is satisfied with his works
Gen 1:31
God is dissatisfied with his works.
Gen 6:6
2. God dwells in chosen temples
2 Chron 7:12,16
God dwells not in temples
Acts 7:48
3. God dwells in light
Tim 6:16
God dwells in darkness
1 Kings 8:12/ Ps 18:11/ Ps 97:2
4. God is seen and heard
Ex 33:23/ Ex 33:11/ Gen 3:9,10/ Gen 32:30/ Is 6:1/
Ex 24:9-11
God is invisible and cannot be heard
John 1:18/ John 5:37/ Ex 33:20/ 1 Tim 6:16
5. God is tired and rests
Ex 31:17
God is never tired and never rests
Is 40:28
6. God is everywhere present, sees and knows all things
Prov 15:3/ Ps 139:7-10/ Job 34:22,21
God is not everywhere present, neither sees nor knows all
things
Gen 11:5/ Gen 18:20,21/ Gen 3:8
7. God knows the hearts of men
Acts 1:24/ Ps 139:2,3
God tries men to find out what is in their heart
Deut 13:3/ Deut 8:2/ Gen 22:12
8. God is all powerful
Jer 32:27/ Matt 19:26
God is not all powerful
Judg 1:19
9. God is unchangeable
James 1:17/ Mal 3:6/ Ezek 24:14/ Num 23:19
God is changeable
Gen 6:6/ Jonah 3:10/ 1 Sam 2:30,31/ 2 Kings 20:1,4,5,6/
Ex 33:1,3,17,14
10. God is just and impartial
Ps 92:15/ Gen 18:25/ Deut 32:4/ Rom 2:11/ Ezek 18:25
God is unjust and partial
Gen 9:25/ Ex 20:5/ Rom 9:11-13/ Matt 13:12
11. God is the author of evil
Lam 3:38/ Jer 18:11/ Is 45:7/ Amos 3:6/ Ezek 20:25
God is not the author of evil
1 Cor 14:33/ Deut 32:4/ James 1:13
12. God gives freely to those who ask
James 1:5/ Luke 11:10
God withholds his blessings and prevents men from receiving
them
John 12:40/ Josh 11:20/ Is 63:17

So... next time I encounter a Wall of Cut'n'Posts as "proof" of anything, I know exactly how to answer. I"ll just let my fingers do the walking and leave my brain disengaged.

After all, if Christians think this sort of an "intellectual" approach is convincing to us atheists, why not "back at'cha!"?

[rifleman]

Originally Posted by Starlady01

I already knew this but had to look it up just the same to make sure I didn't miss qoute.

(I then found and snipped the quick cut & paste from:

The Evidence Bible,

...which is a hog-twaddle-full account lacking anything scientifically valid.

Their dismissals are all, categorically and to a one, faulty on their face, without even a cursory examination.

Example:

9. Solomon described a "cycle" of air currents two thousand years before scientists "discovered" them. "The wind goes toward the south, and turns about unto the north; it whirls about continually, and the wind returns again according to his circuits" (Ecclesiastes 1:6).

Turn with me now to that passage:

But the earth abides forever.
5 The sun also rises, and the sun goes down,
And hastens to the place where it arose.
6 The wind goes toward the south,
And turns around to the north;
The wind whirls about continually,
And comes again on its circuit.

And this proves what again, in terms of ancient understandings of the Earth's wind and solar-energy driven cycles? The point was?

"But... but... teacher.... what happens when the wind goes towards the north, as it tends to do over Asia, and turns around the south, as it does in New Zealand?"

Science 's "discovery" of complex planetary wind patterns exceeds by a considerable margin the simplistic (and, BTW, erroneous) understandings of this biblical author.

What point is made here?

Answer? ZIP. It's an ambiguous bit of meandering double-speak, with no understanding beneath it. I'm quite sure that the rest of the prophet's writings had some greater, philosophical intent.

----------------------------------------------

Here's one for you:

"Let not your mind be overwhelmed by biased internet sites preaching of a false God, by using confusing metaphors to fool you with false knowledge!"