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its all a big mystery really-the Lord works in mysterious ways
there are things we know
there are thing we dont yet know but need to
and there are things we'll never know
God will always hold some sense of mystery to Him and that in-itself is one of His glorys
You have just encapsulated the main reason I lost my belief...The lord works in mysterious ways was the standard answer I got when I asked difficult questions.....Not good enough for me, so I did my own research, and that put the cap on my atheism.
A New Belief Paradigm. All Convenient and EVERYTHING!
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Originally Posted by Nikk
By definition the creator of all cannot be created.
God is called "who was and is and is to come". Meaning he has no beginning and no end.
He is not subject to the laws of nature since he is outside of nature and time itself. So, he does not weary, grow old or die. Nor is he subject to the limitations of his creation. What he does we often call "supernatural". He created the laws, but he can also superceed the laws. For example the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Dead people don't come back to life, but in Jesus' case, he rose from the dead.
Wow! How amazingly convenient! And.... He's all nicely rolled into one super-being! Anything comes up, He's there to fix it, 'cause he can do anything! (The bible didn't mention any of this; it's all conjecture added on since biblical times to explain His apparent and necessary omniscience, but hey; who's keeping track of the mythology...)
Yah gotta luv it!
(BTW, I'm officially abandoning logic in any further defense of science. It's time to assert the spiritual side of honest inquiry. From now on, anything that can't be absolutely proven by good research, or isn't believed because it ripples folks' stubborn belief paradigms right now will just be considered to have "always been", or to be "holistically, inherently correct" because, well, because it just is/was/will be. Oh, and also, because I WANT it to be. So there!!)
By definition the creator of all cannot be created.
Says whom, exactly?
Quote:
He is not subject to the laws of nature since he is outside of nature and time itself.
Yet, he does allegedly have a nature inherent to himself and a realm in which he resides. Therefore logically, HIS creator would be outside of that realm of reality, and so on ad infinitum..
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So, he does not weary,
You sure?
"...for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed." Exodus 31:17
Quote:
Nor is he subject to the limitations of his creation.
"And the LORD was with Judah; and he drove out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron" - Judges 1:19
"And the Lord said, because of the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous; I will go down now and see whether they have done altogether according to the cry of it which is come unto me, and if not, I will know" (Gen. xviii. 20)
Ooopsie!
Moderator cut: orphaned
Quote:
For example the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Dead people don't come back to life, but in Jesus' case, he rose from the dead.
You have just encapsulated the main reason I lost my belief...The lord works in mysterious ways was the standard answer I got when I asked difficult questions.....Not good enough for me, so I did my own research, and that put the cap on my atheism.
you see if you look at the original qyestion it says"why was the creator created"and that in-itself has flaw and i wasn't refering to the question i was only specifieng that God always held SOME mystery -you see the creator(im sure were refering to the Supreme when we say creator)was never created if He was then who'would have created Him,everything comes from something,we are ordinary living enritys,He's not,He;s holding this whole reality toghether as we speak,He controls the atoms,nature is only a fragmental part of His energy's which are innumerable and eternal,He has character like all his sentient beings and our own true nature is the same as His eternal nature-its called God consiousssness,inside our very soul's lies the supersoul,it is God particle that exist's inside our own soul particle.
But we are only individual particles of spirit that have feelings and thought's and desires and character and personality-but He is the complete whole,this entire cosmos rests inside Him and He is everywhere and yet at the same time nowhere-His Brahman feature is the energy of the Lord that pervades the whole cosmos,it is an impersonal aspect and some people devote their time to acceive this liberation ,i think the Bhuddists call it nirvana-and most impersonalists(people the beleive God only exists as an energy and has no form)are atracted to this impersonal aspect-and in a mystical sense(-in other words its a mystery how He does it- but it dosent mean we cant experience it---)the Bramhan is the effulgence emanating from His transcendenteal body.
but if we can experience love and freindship and all the things that we can be-then why cant He -why cant He experience interpersonal relationships-if the individual living entity's can have charachter and personalitys then surely the supreme personality of Godhaed can aswell.--if you put a limit onto God then its not God your talking about its some other powerfull demigod or something.our souls were never created either
so to get back to the OP-not everything in existence is temporary-yes these body's-this world-this sun-this universe all are temporary-but the energy where these elements came from has always been in existence its a simple word called eternal but theres very few who can wrap their temporary little brains around it.it means no beginning and no end-but its hard to grasp that concept-everything in the material cosmos has a beginning(creation)a middle(maintanence)and end(destruction)and God is in control of all that'--why? because no-one else can do it-unless He gives them the power to do it(no-limits).but the energy that gives life life,the spiritual energy is not of the same nature as the material energy and is etenal and we are parts of that whole energy
the reason why i was stating that God was mysterious and that its one of His quality's is because well ..its a mystery....had to think there for a second, because it realy is a mystery why He does it all,that,s what makes it a mystery although He can show us whatever He likes about Him -He can give any benediction,mystical power and realization(no-limits) through His causlless mercy and Supreme power or magic ao mystery,whatever way you want to look at it.
and to you this might be frustrating because you want so much to know how everything works,and theres nothing wrong with that,but i think its pretty cool that theres certain mystery/magic to God-
but i remember reading that God will be always learning new things about Himself-not that He dosent know everything about Himself at any one moment,but because his energy's are forever expanding then their always more to learn.
Wow! How amazingly convenient! And.... He's all nicely rolled into one super-being! Anything comes up, He's there to fix it, 'cause he can do anything! (The bible didn't mention any of this; it's all conjecture added on since biblical times to explain His apparent and necessary omniscience, but hey; who's keeping track of the mythology...)
Yah gotta luv it!
(BTW, I'm officially abandoning logic in any further defense of science. It's time to assert the spiritual side of honest inquiry. From now on, anything that can't be absolutely proven by good research, or isn't believed because it ripples folks' stubborn belief paradigms right now will just be considered to have "always been", or to be "holistically, inherently correct" because, well, because it just is/was/will be. Oh, and also, because I WANT it to be. So there!!)
--just because its not written in the bible dosent mean t dosent exist--i'd say thats a saying that yav used yuorselves often-so now its firing back at you rifleman-bang bang-down goes the dear....ah im only messin with ya.but seriosly what she said is pretty spot on God is unaffected bye material nature- actually it is under His control and if He didnt exist nothing would hold in place and you'd never be able to do all that research that you so love..and hats off to ya-your pretty up there with it all that jazz..
but i just wanted to know asking you man to man-why do you come on these God consioss thread's-is it to try and find holes in peoples beleifs or is it just to add into the conversation, or do you pretty sure beleive that theirs nothing,except what your senses can pick up,in other words the world around you-at the end of the day you only BELEIVE theirs no God and it cant be proven that their isnt so its realy only faith,even though your life came to the conclusion that theirs no God,others based on what they experience and learn come to the conclusion that their is a God.will we ever know?. who knows, but on this topic none of us can say we are right or wrong untill we find out,how we find out ,i havent got a clue-but personaly i have enjoyed our chats,although i'd say everybody hates me,im always arguing with christians and atheists,the two predominating philosophy's on this thread.yeah hah.
.im always in the middle of yes
Yet, he does allegedly have a nature inherent to himself and a realm in which he resides. Therefore logically, HIS creator would be outside of that realm of reality, and so on ad infinitum..
You sure?
"...for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed." Exodus 31:17
"And the LORD was with Judah; and he drove out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron" - Judges 1:19
"And the Lord said, because of the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous; I will go down now and see whether they have done altogether according to the cry of it which is come unto me, and if not, I will know" (Gen. xviii. 20)
Ooopsie!
Let the apologetics BS begin!
Ehm, no.. he didn't.
you know using the bible to prove theres no God is as uselss as using the bible to prove there is-
What??? Give a single example of anything that's known about God.
You're kidding!! You need to take an evening stroll over to the Christian forum where you will find loads of folk who know EVERYTHING about their god. They know what he thinks, what he likes and doesn't like, when he's happy or sad, what he wants and doesn't want, what he did and is going to do. You'll even find some that claim to know the whole game plan from start to finish. They'll also tell you what is allowed and not allowed in Heaven and what goes on there. Their encyclopaedic knowledge of something that has never actually been proven to exist is quite astonishing!!
The Christian forum reminds me of a Mencken quote:
"A church is a place where men who have never been to Heaven, explain what it's like to people who will never get there."
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A New Belief Paradigm. All Convenient and EVERYTHING!
(The bible didn't mention any of this; it's all conjecture added on since biblical times to explain His apparent and necessary omniscience, but hey; who's keeping track of the mythology...) 
From now on, anything that can't be absolutely proven by good research, or isn't believed because it ripples folks' stubborn belief paradigms right now will just be considered to have "always been", or to be "holistically, inherently correct" because, well, because it just is/was/will be. Oh, and also, because I WANT it to be. So there!!) 
..its a mystery....had to think there for a second, because it realy is a mystery why He does it all,that,s what makes it a mystery although He can show us whatever He likes about Him -He can give any benediction,mystical power and realization(no-limits) through His causlless mercy and Supreme power or magic ao mystery,whatever way you want to look at it.
