Do we underestimate and downplay how Great Sacramento weather really is? (Los Angeles: boundaries, color)

[Chimérique]

Another day of cold, fog and clouds in Sacramento, but apparently, we don't have a winter according to some people. it's been either chilly, cold, foggy, overcast with several days of rain, another several days of rain is coming tonight/tomorrow. Snow in the nearby mountains.

All this but with some bright sunshine for a few hours when the temp tops out in the high 50's. As of late, foggy mornings in the mid to high 30's.

It appears for the last 10+ years climate change cancelled Sacramento's 150 years of observable winter Tule fog only to return this season. Just shows you it's unscientific to rely on cherry picked data for only the last 10-20 years.

10AM, Dec 27, 2023

Miami 65F

Orlando 57F
Los Angeles - 54F
Phoenix 52F

Atlanta 49F
Sacramento 49F
New Orleans 46F
Austin - 43F

[PhoenixSomeday]

Originally Posted by Chimérique

Another day of cold, fog and clouds in Sacramento, but apparently, we don't have a winter according to some people.

It's bizarre. For some people, if there's no snow there's no winter, the end. For others, there has to, at the very least, be a minus sign in front of the temperature. What's interesting though is that there's snow not even that far from here.

[tstieber]

Originally Posted by PhoenixSomeday

It's bizarre. For some people, if there's no snow there's no winter, the end. For others, there has to, at the very least, be a minus sign in front of the temperature. What's interesting though is that there's snow not even that far from here.

Also, it's interesting that Sacramento's morning temp was pretty much in line with other 'mild winter' climates like the desert SW, Austin, and Florida. Those areas can also get chilly (even if less often). We live in San Diego, and we're not considered to have a real winter either, but we're still looking at low 60s most days, with some upper 50s in the ten day forecast. Nights in the upper 30s and low 40s in our area (away from the water but within city limits). We were just asking each other yesterday if winter tourists are happy or disappointed with these temps, bc it really depends where you are visiting from.

I guess the question, is what is a 'real winter?' It's subjective, not absolute. Without ice and snow, it's not what I think most people think a 'real winter' means. We think having to put on a sweater or turning on the heat means 'real winter,' but it's more like how fall feels in most parts of the country. I would argue that Sacramento has a 'real fall,' which just happens to come in winter. ;-)

[Chimérique]

Originally Posted by tstieber

Also, it's interesting that Sacramento's morning temp was pretty much in line with other 'mild winter' climates like the desert SW, Austin, and Florida. Those areas can also get chilly (even if less often). We live in San Diego, and we're not considered to have a real winter either, but we're still looking at low 60s most days, with some upper 50s in the ten day forecast. Nights in the upper 30s and low 40s in our area (away from the water but within city limits). We were just asking each other yesterday if winter tourists are happy or disappointed with these temps, bc it really depends where you are visiting from.

I guess the question, is what is a 'real winter?' It's subjective, not absolute. Without ice and snow, it's not what I think most people think a 'real winter' means. We think having to put on a sweater or turning on the heat means 'real winter,' but it's more like how fall feels in most parts of the country. I would argue that Sacramento has a 'real fall,' which just happens to come in winter. ;-)

TS, it's truly subjective, I get it.

On average, Sacramento has a mild and wet winter, although not warm by any means and occasional not very wet during extreme drought years.

Sacramento is consistently colder and wetter than most of SoCal over 150 year averages(observable, recorded official data). Yet we are as warm as much of the southern USA, not including Florida and Hawaii. And we rarely experience deep freezes like the southern USA. Based on all that I am totally agreeing with you.

But, there is always a but, lol, the nuance is Sacramento is very much connected to the region just east of us, the Sierra Foothills and the High Sierra, those communities are actually part of our official metro area, and they definitely have a cold wet winter as cold and often much colder than much of the USA.

Folks from the Bay, SoCal and the coast, don't get this, Sacramento is way more connected to the Sierra just by the very nature that we are so very close to it (30 mins to 2 hrs depending where and how far up yo are going).

Some Bay Area folks may own cabins in Tahoe but its still 3-6 hours away, and they don't really live or work there for any length of time, most of working Sierra folks work down in Sacramento more than the Bay. Sacramento folks own cabins in the Sierra and there are more working folks between the two and more commuting between the two, hence why the Sierra's up to Tahoe are part of the Sacto Metro.

[mixxalot]

the rain damp cold is back!

[Chimérique]

Originally Posted by PhoenixSomeday

It's bizarre. For some people, if there's no snow there's no winter, the end. For others, there has to, at the very least, be a minus sign in front of the temperature. What's interesting though is that there's snow not even that far from here.

Folks from the Bay, SoCal and the coast, and really the rest of the country, don't get this about Sacramento:

The Sacramento Metro includes the Sierra counties up to Lake Tahoe (high elevations, cold snowy winters)

The Sacramento lifeystyle is very connected to the Sierra just by the very nature that we are so very close to it (30 mins to 2 hrs depending where and how far up you are going).

Many Sierra folks work down in Sacramento. Sacramento folks own cabins in the Sierra and there are more working folks between the two and alot of commuting between the two, hence why the Sierra's up to Tahoe are considered part of the Sacto Metro.

Some Bay Area folks own cabins in Tahoe but it's still 3-6 hours away, and they don't really live or work there for any length of time, no daily back and forth commuting.

[mixxalot]

Well said Chim, but have to admit that San Diego and socal has better warmer weather most of the year compared to the damp wetter winters we get up here in Sactown. I miss San Diego but it was way expensive and not many jobs that pay a living wage there so I left.

[tstieber]

Originally Posted by Chimérique

TS, it's truly subjective, I get it.

On average, Sacramento has a mild and wet winter, although not warm by any means and occasional not very wet during extreme drought years.

Sacramento is consistently colder and wetter than most of SoCal over 150 year averages(observable, recorded official data). Yet we are as warm as much of the southern USA, not including Florida and Hawaii. And we rarely experience deep freezes like the southern USA. Based on all that I am totally agreeing with you.

But, there is always a but, lol, the nuance is Sacramento is very much connected to the region just east of us, the Sierra Foothills and the High Sierra, those communities are actually part of our official metro area, and they definitely have a cold wet winter as cold and often much colder than much of the USA.

Folks from the Bay, SoCal and the coast, don't get this, Sacramento is way more connected to the Sierra just by the very nature that we are so very close to it (30 mins to 2 hrs depending where and how far up yo are going).

Some Bay Area folks may own cabins in Tahoe but its still 3-6 hours away, and they don't really live or work there for any length of time, most of working Sierra folks work down in Sacramento more than the Bay. Sacramento folks own cabins in the Sierra and there are more working folks between the two and more commuting between the two, hence why the Sierra's up to Tahoe are part of the Sacto Metro.

Yeah, I can totally see that living in Sacramento and being so close to the Sierras, that the connection to a winter mindset, winter sports, and snow is much more present than in the Bay Area, for example. Although I knew some kids growing up in the East Bay who would go up to the Sierras for skiing, it was always a huge ordeal getting through hours of traffic, and it seemed like a real chore. It's not that much different from the way some of our SoCal neighbors will pack up for a week in Mammoth -- like it's driveable but feels like a different region. But from Sacramento, the travel time cuts out a good two hours of ski traffic to the west and makes it more of a backyard playground. So yeah, I can see how there would be more of a feel of winter being accessible and close by, without the headaches of actually dealing with winter conditions in the Valley. In that regard, I always think California has it made in the shade, because unless there is no snow due to drought, you can pretty much always find snow at some elevation in winter, sort of 'on demand.' In fact, I was thinking how cool it was that our neighbors down the street always rent a cabin in Mammoth every Christmas and New Year so that they have a guaranteed white Christmas. On the East Coast, getting a white Christmas is a crap shoot, and the mountains aren't tall enough to ensure snow access. Our majestic Sierras, by comparison, reliably deliver winter to Sacramento's doorstep.

It seems we agree on factual issues relating to Sacramento's climate and that this is more of a discussion about the winter culture of Sacramento.

[Threestep2]

Originally Posted by Chimérique

Folks from the Bay, SoCal and the coast, and really the rest of the country, don't get this about Sacramento:

The Sacramento Metro includes the Sierra counties up to Lake Tahoe (high elevations, cold snowy winters)

The Sacramento lifeystyle is very connected to the Sierra just by the very nature that we are so very close to it (30 mins to 2 hrs depending where and how far up you are going).

Many Sierra folks work down in Sacramento. Sacramento folks own cabins in the Sierra and there are more working folks between the two and alot of commuting between the two, hence why the Sierra's up to Tahoe are considered part of the Sacto Metro.

Some Bay Area folks own cabins in Tahoe but it's still 3-6 hours away, and they don't really live or work there for any length of time, no daily back and forth commuting.

Would you commute 3-6 hours on a daily basis?

[Chimérique]

Originally Posted by Threestep2

Would you commute 3-6 hours on a daily basis?

Sacramento is only 30 minutes to 2 hours from the Sierra's. Having a snowy, cold, icy winter can be very much part of the Sacramento metro lifestyle, and it is for me.

Not only do Sacramento folks recreate in the snowy Sierra in the winter, many folks commute back and forth for work from those Sierra communities to Sacramento and back.

The Bay Area is 3-6 hours from the Sierra's one way, and their chances of getting stuck in some type of really bad traffic is often tripled, exponentially longer compared to someone living in the eastern Sacramento Metro.