One down, hundreds to go (Graffiti cleanup) (Alamo, Van: houses, legally)

[SilverCreek78250]

I think the main disconnect here is difference between tagging and graffiti. In my mind, the adult who was arrested for tagging is a tagger. He marks up places without permission.

I don't much care for that artist who dipped a crucifix in a jar of pee, and I'm only slightly more entertained by the use of colorful letters to spell out names and such that the graffiti "artists" tend to enjoy. But like the crucifix in pee, both he and the graffiti artist, generally do their business on canvas they own or have the permissive use of.

Taggers illegally mark territory without permission. Arrest them, lock them up and fine them for their damages. Community service should be the last thing these idiots get. And if a home or business owner catches them in the act, shoot them and shoot them dead. End of story.

Tomorrow morning, I'll be painting over the work of taggers in San Antonio's wrongly named "Graffiti Wipe-out". You cannot wipe-out graffiti when you turn around and fund and allow so called graffiti walls. It sends a mixed signal. I'll be providing my feedback to my council member.

I'd love to see fellow CDers painting over the filth and making sure that every person associated with the city knows that we need more police and stronger penalties for Tagging.

[wCat]

Originally Posted by SilverCreek78250

I think the main disconnect here is difference between tagging and graffiti. In my mind, the adult who was arrested for tagging is a tagger. He marks up places without permission.

I don't much care for that artist who dipped a crucifix in a jar of pee, and I'm only slightly more entertained by the use of colorful letters to spell out names and such that the graffiti "artists" tend to enjoy. But like the crucifix in pee, both he and the graffiti artist, generally do their business on canvas they own or have the permissive use of.

Taggers illegally mark territory without permission. Arrest them, lock them up and fine them for their damages. Community service should be the last thing these idiots get. And if a home or business owner catches them in the act, shoot them and shoot them dead. End of story.

Tomorrow morning, I'll be painting over the work of taggers in San Antonio's wrongly named "Graffiti Wipe-out". You cannot wipe-out graffiti when you turn around and fund and allow so called graffiti walls. It sends a mixed signal. I'll be providing my feedback to my council member.

I'd love to see fellow CDers painting over the filth and making sure that every person associated with the city knows that we need more police and stronger penalties for Tagging.

SilverCreek.....you make some very good points. Reform without the punishment is not suffering any consequences for the damage and cost to the property owners. I'll jump at the first chance to appreciate and promote art because I am tightly associated with it....but not at the expense of taxpayers and volunteers that have to go out in force and clean it up.

SC...you also made a good point about the difference between tagging and graffiti. There's a bigger point that's being missed in this discussion and that's the gang element associated with some of this "artwork". This display of graphics is marking their territory like a dog lifts it's leg on a tree. It's ownership and a dare....it's an invitation to violence.

And yes...there are exceptions, but where do you draw the line. OK....Gang related graffiti is criminal activity? but lets let the pseudo artists do time in an art school? None of it should be tolerated.

Manthechange.....I do see your point of the artistry on train cabs....and I've had to stop and appreciate some of the talent behind the images myself....momentarily...then I get angry. It's still the wrong canvas. There is identification information on the outside of train cars for a reason. It's a huge mess to sort out shipping containers when this information is barely legible. It just has to stop....and it won't as long as people are soft on this crime. Law enforcement is getting little support from the community when we oogle the "art" and make it awe inspiring. If we look at the big picture, it's a waste of talent by individuals that have no boundaries and worse, no respect for the boundaries of others. It should never be glorified in any manner.

[majormadmax]

Note to all taggers and graffiti artists out there, when you see that little red laser dot on your head or body, you'd better start running as fast as you can!

And as one who has lived in Europe on multiple occassions, the graffiti manthechange mentioned is no more accepted there than it is anywhere else. It is still against the law, and they too are trying to deal with the criminals that deface public and private property. Please don't give the impression that it is accepted there.

Cheers! M2

[wCat]

MM...we are in total agreement! I was watching the travel channel last recently where they were touring a very historic ancient part of Paris....cobblestone narrow streets with buttressed overhanging second stories....mostly stucco or plaster type exterior walls....and was sickened at the sight of spray painted tagging all along the row. These buildings were about 600 years old.

Nothing is sacred to them....like I said...they have no boundaries. Let them tag San Fernando Cathedral, or the Alamo .....then the city might get more serious about consequences.

[rd2007]

hmmmm, interesting idea there...

[traveler guy]

Originally Posted by rd2007

y'all can appreciate your home values depreciating along with your "art". I'll still try to hurt anyone I see doing it in my hood.

So you would break the law a commit a real crime just cause you see someone vandalizing some property. What if he/she is doing it legally and asked permission to do it. You just committed assault and will get some time in prison just cause you were ignorant enough to picture a biased action thinking all of the taggers doing it are doing it Illegal and or doing ugly scribble scrabble writing. While I hate the ugly tagging that gives graffiti the bad rep I also hate how some people just depict all graffiti artist as young rebels or stupid criminals with no respect to their neighborhoods, Cause that is just a stupid observation of graffiti artist in general.

I'd most likely do the same thing as you if I saw someone tag up my property but that doesn't make it right.

[majormadmax]

Nice try, but I am not buying it. For one, I would except if someone were hired to "tag" someone's property legally, they would be doing it during normal business hours and in plain sight. I don't think many "legal" taggers would be doing their work at night, and under the cover of darkness.

Secondly, "graffiti artist?" Give me a break, it is the unwanted defacement of private or public property, and it is against the law. I have seen real artists doing chalk renderings in public areas, usually the area is roped off and they have a sign advertising their art. Trying to put these punks in the same category is an insult to real artists! If they really have artistic skills, then put their work on canvas and sell it. But I bet no one would buy it, which further proves that it is not wanted or liked.

The bottom line is that it is illegal and the vast majority of people disapprove of it. The problem is too many parents excuse it away as juvenile activity and if the culprit is under age, I think the parent should get the same amount of community service cleaning up what their "artists" and others punks like them have done. Maybe then they would all get the message.

And I think it is probably legal to shoot someone if they "tagged" the Alamo. If not, it should be!

Cheers! M2

[rd2007]

You pretty much have free reign to do anything you want to people that are on your property. This is Texas and we're allowed to hurt the bad guys. I saw someone with something in their hand that appeared to be a gun and my vision isn't the best in the world. Oh well, sucks to be the dumba$$ on my property.
If it wasn't on my property, but was in my neighborhood, I don't think anyone would see a thing. I know I would just walk back in my house satisfied that someone did a good thing to a bad person.

and someone legally tagging a fence in the neighborhood? come on now.. not only is that against the rules of the HOA, it's just not even going to happen.

edit- I love the chalk artists and they are actually artists. They provide a service that people appreciate and then it's washed away with water or rain.

[firstclassflyer]

Originally Posted by rd2007

If it wasn't on my property, but was in my neighborhood, I don't think anyone would see a thing. I know I would just walk back in my house satisfied that someone did a good thing to a bad person.

Exactly...back in NY when questioned by authorities.. "I don't know nuthin"...I didn't see nuthin" pretty much those are the street rules.

[SilverCreek78250]

We participated in the SA Tagger Wipeout today and had a good time. A few pics for your enjoyment.