Twenty-somethings working small jobs live in SF. Why do these forums act like that's not true? (San Francisco: rental, hotel)
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It's not tough. If you can't get a job, then yeah it's tough like anywhere else and will eat through your savings faster than just about anywhere else other than NYC. If you can get a job making around 32k or so and live with roommates and don't have a car and you're ok with bohemian standards, life in SF is pretty easy. Living conditions are better and cheaper than NYC. Weather is miles better than Chicago. You can walk everywhere. There's tons of restaurants you can eat at cheaply. Trader Joe's keeps grocery and booze costs down, and you don't even have to feel like you're slumming when you go there.
Rent is the single biggest expense that is hugely different from anywhere else (other than similarly expensive places like NYC or whatever) but you get used to it really quickly. I moved from Chicago where my portion of the rent for a big 1 bedroom I was sharing with my gf was $375. Before I moved to SF I was freaking out about how much rent was going to be, and I ended up paying $600 a month for a small room in an apartment. Ouch! But I got used to it after a couple of months. You don't need an air conditioning and you don't need to use the heater much, so that is $100 or so less a month compared with somewhere hot like Florida or somewhere cold like Chicago. You don't need a car so that is $200-300 less a month.
But I do think SF is getting too yuppie-ish. I moved there only 7 years ago and back then people in the Mission area were pretty scruffy and hipsterish. Seems like when I go out to places on Valencia or even somewhere like around Folsom, it's all preppy yuppies. It means there's more places to go out and some scary areas have been cleaned up, but Oakland is more like what SF was like when I moved there. It's weird that it feels so different in only 6 or 7 years.
I would say that anyone who feels priced out by SF should check out Oakland. The nice parts of Oakland feel safer and quieter than anywhere worth living in SF and they're much cheaper too. Public transit isn't great and BART is expensive but parts of Oakland are very walkable and it's more bikeable than SF because it's flatter and less windy. I felt kind of priced out of SF, it's very hard to get an apartment in SF and I wanted a studio but couldn't find many places in my price range in SF. I like Rockridge because it's quieter and cleaner than SF, after a while I got tired of those aspects of SF.
Also I'd say that while it's surprisingly easy to find a job when the economy is good in SF, that also makes it MUCH harder to find an apartment. When I looked in 2004 it was tough, I was looking for roommates and while I went to be interviewed by a lot of people it was hard getting any of them to take me seriously for some reason, but I ended up with some guys in the Mission--nice apt but crappy location. I looked a couple years later for a 1br with my gf at the time...pretty hard, lots of people at every open house we saw, but we could have gotten a couple of nice places if she'd had good credit. Finally we got a place by Dolores Park from a Chinese landlord who didn't care about credit...but man what a dump, it was dark and mildewy and eventually we had to deal with mice, then rats, then bedbugs at one point...UGH. Great location but a terrible apt. Then we broke up and I was looking for a studio or roommates in 2007, not long before the economy crashed. It was just about impossible. I emailed tons of people looking for roommates on craigslist, probably 100 or so, and only got back a few replies and only met with two people. I ended up looking for studios because at least that way the landlord holds an open house and you can actually meet the landlord, but there were always tons of people at the viewings. I lucked into a studio in Hayes Valley only because I was the 2nd person to show up (the 1st person got the first place that was available, I got the 2nd one)...great location, great apartment, but it was right next to a very noisy nightclub that blared music 6 days a week that was driving me insane. Finally last summer I snapped up a studio in Rockridge and never looked back. Nice place, nice location, and I can actually get a good night's sleep.
Despite the thousands of people that seem extremely eager to come to San Francisco to follow a dream I would say that you should go for it. However, let me tell you a few things that have already been said but just in my own way. First of all I am not from the Bay Area and Im probably a little older than you are like some on this forum. But here is my story and hoepfully you "get the picture" after reading. I left HS in 1997 from my hometown in SoCalifornia and went off to college just eager to leave. Did my thing and stayed single for years from about age 18 to 25 all while living in the college town I graduated from. Anyway, I dont have any regrets about all the great time I had surfing couches of college friends and just living paycheck to paycheck working a menial job at a local big box retailer. It was the perfect life: kegs, get laid, go to work, hit the beach, sleep, see a free lecture on campus... you get the idea! Then, I started hitting 26 and my life changed forever as I woke up one day and you just know that its time to move on...trust me you really feel it cuz suddenly your the "old dude" amongst a bunch of 17 yr olds that just moved into said college town. All the signs will present themselves to you. At the same time I got married and basically began chapter two of a life that many of these individuals couldnt fathom. And like many on this forum it probably happened the same way give or take a few things.
So from 26 to now (Im 31) my new marriage shaped me into a different person and as I got older I started to see things differently. You basically stop looking in the rear view mirror. My wife and I built up our lives and our finances and we still laugh and look back on where we were in our lives. But there comes a time in every persons life when they do the young thing and then.............ITS OVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You change, your life changes, your so called friends are not really there for you as they are trying to figure their own life out. Now, I had goals of getting to San francisco like you but you know what Im too much of a "realist" and here is truth: I moved back to my hometown here in SoCal for the following important reasons ---
1. The economy tanked...everyone knows this and our plans changed after thoroughly evaluating things. This is what you do when you have a spouse. Move to SF after graduation for an oversaturated career in Graphic Design...nope not a chance in hell!! I majored in art/web design. Seriously I dont have the time or the desire to struggle real bad chasing a so called "dream" and actually never make it. No I didnt give up I just know better.
2. Wealth doesnt know a location..wealth just matures with time. I made the decision to relocate and settle down in my hometown because I already had family connections and because my family is 4 generation deep in my town and we have a substantial amount of wealth. My dad gave me an offer I couldnt refuse to build my dream 6 bedroom estate on 2 acres for $300,000 since he is a retired contractor. My moms brother owns his own construction company and has an ranch estate in the east end of the valley and he is retired. Since I have been back my wife is a manager for the county adminstration and makes great salary. I have been in consulting and basically do okay. Several of my relatives own mexican restaurants in my home town and my 60 year old mother is their accountant. There are more than 60 of us that reside here and we are a tight network. The cost of living is low here and by moving back I was able to purchase vacation property in San Luis Obispo/pismo beach from making a living. Basically all the things I couldnt do just couch surfing at 22 years of age. Finally, I needed healthcare because stuff happens and you get older and end up with medical issues. Today, I golf, attend seminars at community colleges, take my wife to nice restaurants, drop money on card tables at casinos, use spas once in a long while, and work out at an exclusive club that I renew every two years for a fee.
Okay, the point here is do it and see what happens but honestly I am glad I did my thing and began the next stage of life. Would I want to do what you want to do today? NO WAY...been there done that!! GOOD LUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!
Is this a script from a 90210 episode? GREAT story....
I've become increasingly frustrated with the SF forums here...every optimistic twenty-something who comes through here with less than 5K is told they will starve to death in San Francisco. I am one of those prospective twenty-somethings who has been told to move to Austin or Chicago by every single person over 30 because SF is "way too expensive." My younger friends have told me that I will be absolutely fine. There are plenty of young people who have jobs in bakeries or bookshops in SF....how would it be IMPOSSIBLE for a college educated person with small job experience to survive in your city? I'd give my left arm to live in San Francisco and have since I was 18...I hate that every day I think "Well, maybe I'll live for a few months in another city and save up money [for a long period of time] to move to California."
Positivity in this thread is welcome and encouraged.
I don't know about SF, but I movied to Honolulu HI, another expensive place to live, 25 years ago. Everyone told me it was nuts, even some people under 30, but I'd been through a painful divorce and needed a break from the environment where I'd lived with my ex in early years of marriage.
It turned out to be one of the smartest things I ever did. When I first arrived, with less than $2K, I knew no one and had no job prospects. My first job was a Christmas holiday retail job, low paying, but a few months later, I landed a good job in a bank.
Don't let anyone discourage you from living a dream. Now in my mid-50's, the only regrets I have are about those things I DIDN'T try because of listening to naysayers instead of my own heart.
I moved here during the tail end of the dot-com with $900. That was 11 years ago and rent was through the roof. I got a crappy $7 an hour job, shared a 2 bedroom apartment in the East Bay ( Not SF) with 3 other people, bought bulk groceries from the discount grocery store, rode a bike, didn't eat out, bought clothes from Goodwill, and basically lived almost like a pauper. But I actually was able to save money. If you're going to make it here you're probably going to have to make concessions- like I did. 11 years later I now make a pretty good income, continue to save, rent a nice house, and have an overall stable life.
In hindsite I sort of almost wish I had chosen somewhere else to live though. It was fun when I was younger. But now that I'm married and older and would like to buy our own place the reality of how expensive it is here becomes an issue and as a result we're probably moving out of state- which is going to be a pain. You might want to not only consider the short term, but also the long term scenario. But to answer your question, yes- its totally possible to live here on less money. But you might want to check out other Bay Area cities besides SF because SF is way more pricey than other areas.
18Montclair, we posted at the same time. But immigrants move here with a plan already set up. They have programs unique to their situation, have housing set up, most of the time if they have to room with someone they don't have to pay rent and if they do it is like $50, a lot of the times they even have family here already. Food and healthcare is basically free for them because again they have the system down. If this person has the system down move here.
how the hell do they get all that for free? I'm looking at the options to move to SF and I sure as hell won't get a free apt, health care, food ETC.
I don't exactly know how this thread turned into a debate on immigration but from my experiences, many modern immigrants come over with a lot of family support and help. My husband is an immigrant and lived rent free with his relatives and other friends until he landed a job. There were a lot of other Irish looking out for each other. In fact, many immigrants initially find jobs through networking amongst their friends/relations. The immigrants of today have a lot more help and resources than the immigrants from the past. That's not to say that moving anywhere is in any way easy and people (immigrants or not) don't have to work their butts off to get ahead!
As for low cost health care, there are sliding scale clinics all over the city. As a former starving college student I used to go to the one at UCmed center but they are also available through the city. These are available to all- not just immigrants.
I don't exactly know how this thread turned into a debate on immigration but from my experiences, many modern immigrants come over with a lot of family support and help. My husband is an immigrant and lived rent free with his relatives and other friends until he landed a job. There were a lot of other Irish looking out for each other. In fact, many immigrants initially find jobs through networking amongst their friends/relations.
And what makes you think that the experience of your husband or relatives are representative of the general trend? Family based immigration is only a part of the vast number of ways people immigrate to the US. Many people immigrate through employment or as refugees.
MathieuL, there are so many things Americans don't realize that immirgrants are doing when they get here. In CA I'm sure people are aware but don't say and or do anything. One of the reasons CA has such a deficit is due to Healthcare subsidies. Who do you think is getting them?
There are plenty of healthcare facilities to care one can get at colleges. Family and friends or just people of the same ethnic group have social groups awaiting their arrival. They let people know where to get food from, places to stay, etc.
This one lady's place I went into she had an apartment she didn't pay for, furniture that was donated, food she got from markets and other programs that give, saw the doctor for free, had electricity subsidized, and had free cable and a cell phone. Her kids were grown and had kids and lived with her. They paid zero rent. It happens.
At one time SF was giving money away to people that claimed they were homeless. They didn't have to provide ID or anything. That changed when Newson stopped it. Remember care not cash?
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