Beyond Chron: Oakland, A tale of two cities (San Francisco, Pittsburg: school, dangerous)

[HappyinCali]

Originally Posted by 18Montclair

This is nice, but there appear to be layers of bureaucracy in each of your points:

1. A Commission
2. A Task Force
3. A Joint Committee
4. A Supervisory Board

By the time we got to number 5, perhaps all the criminals will have killed each other off.

Im not even saying that I have a better solution, but I do think the answer revolves less around committees and more about direct involvement by Oaklanders themselves taking responsibility for their communities and neighborhoods-until we the people get on board and stop pointing the finger of blame at police and city officials, the problem will really never get resolved.

I was being sarcastic

My point is that nothing ever gets done in Oakland and San Francisco, because there are layers of bureaucracy, that prevent any swift and decisive action and any true reform will take years and years. But hey, at least the machine will be happy, right?

[DocGoldstein]

Originally Posted by HappyinCali

I was being sarcastic

I think 99% of the people who read your post noticed that immediately. Your humor wasn't lost on us.

[18Montclair]

Originally Posted by HappyinCali

I was being sarcastic

My point is that nothing ever gets done in Oakland and San Francisco, because there are layers of bureaucracy, that prevent any swift and decisive action and any true reform will take years and years. But hey, at least the machine will be happy, right?

By the way, I initially thought that but sadly your satire is precisely the same old tired solutions that the city has sought to implement in order to solve this issue.

The results are peaks and valleys when it comes to our crime rate.

Just when it seems the crime rate is falling(as it was for 4 straight years from 2007-2010), for some reason(s) a new wave just comes seemingly out of nowhere. This has been our pattern for the last 20-30 years.

Usually crime in Oakland follows the state of the national economy-this last economic downturn was an exception as the crime fell even as the economy stagnated, which is odd.

Then in the fall of 2010, out of nowhere crime just started shooting up again and that wave is where we now find ourselves.

The police are not to blame. The Mayor is not to blame. Criminals are to blame.

What do we do to get rid of the criminals(many of whom are quite lawless, lack any moral compass and are totally unprepared to function as free adults) or lead people away from a potential life of crime? That is the 64 thousand dollar question.

We dont need to be bombarded by hate posts by outsiders, that solves nothing, contributes nothing to the debate and only stalls meaningful conversation.

What we do need are quick and practical solutions.

[DocGoldstein]

The criminals are to blame for their actions.

But what creates the criminals? Lack of jobs or opportunity. Poor schools that create dropouts. Programs to mentor youths. These are all things that the politicians can have a direct effect on. Imagine what $60,000,000 in Oakland PD lawsuit payouts might have done for all of the above.

[Natural510]

You can provide all the opportunities in the world, but only some will take advantage. At the end of the day, we all choose our own destiny, and a lot of kids choose the "fast life" because it's more exciting than the grind of work and school. Then, by the time they grow older and already have a record, it's too late because they can't get hired for any meaningful work and the cycle continues.

[18Montclair]

Originally Posted by DocGoldstein

The criminals are to blame for their actions.

Period.

But what creates the criminals? Lack of jobs or opportunity. Poor schools that create dropouts. Programs to mentor youths.

Above all of these reasons is uinvolved parents/guardians.

When parents are involved in the lives of their children, it makes all the difference.

However that can be hard when you have a single parent working 2-3 jobs to support their children. It can be difficult when parents come from a foreign culture and they have difficulty in communicating with their US-born and raised children. It can be hard when you have children who are born to and raised by parents who have provclivities to commit crimes like drug dealing, prostitution, theft, robbery, assault etc.

So the answers are not cut and dry, nor are they simple.

These are all things that the politicians can have a direct effect on.

Yes, but their influence only goes so far.

Imagine what $60,000,000 in Oakland PD lawsuit payouts might have done for all of the above.

Imagine if Oakland police officers' actions didnt warrant such payouts. So much money could have been saved in lawsuits. I agree.

[18Montclair]

Originally Posted by Natural510

You can provide all the opportunities in the world, but only some will take advantage. At the end of the day, we all choose our own destiny, and a lot of kids choose the "fast life" because it's more exciting than the grind of work and school. Then, by the time they grow older and already have a record, it's too late because they can't get hired for any meaningful work and the cycle continues.

Many are enticed by the 'fast life' and more importantly 'fast money' provided by drug dealing and prostitution.

There is also a huge problem with parolees being dumped into Oakland-they are definitely a very bad influence on our youth. I recall Jerry Brown stated a few years ago that any given time, there are 3,000-4,000 parolees in Oakland at any given time, many of them fall back to their life of crime rather quickly because as well know, employers generally DO NOT hire people with felonies, so what recourse do they have?

I think I need to rethink my theory: Yes we are ultimately responsible for our own actions, but society sometimes makes it very difficult for people who have made mistakes to leave the cycle of crime that got them into trouble in the first place.

[bmw335xi]

Criminals are to blame, but so is the mayor and city leaders. You cut the police force by 200 and prosecute them when they defend themselves. Criminals need to fear police and our justice system. Sadly, that isn't the case in Oakland. It's a joke to criminals there and a battle they are winning. If you lack all morals and the murder solving rate is only 27%, it's easier to kill someone and steal their things than to work 9-5.

[Nineties Flava]

Originally Posted by bmw335xi

Criminals are to blame, but so is the mayor and city leaders. You cut the police force by 200 and prosecute them when they defend themselves. Criminals need to fear police and our justice system. Sadly, that isn't the case in Oakland. It's a joke to criminals there and a battle they are winning.

You clearly are not familiar with the OPD.

[Nineties Flava]

Originally Posted by 18Montclair

What we do need are quick and practical solutions.

There are none, and that's the main problem when the people that are supposed to come up with real solutions are more interested in convenient two and four-year plans that end or even go unimplemented the moment they leave office. Real systemic change takes more than four years, it happens over the course of a generation. We can only know if it worked by looking at how the next generation turns out.