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Old 03-22-2013, 03:30 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
18,982 posts, read 32,663,382 times
Reputation: 13635

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jade408 View Post
Corrected this for you.
Thank you, good point I don't think toll roads are even completely profitable either. Certainly not the ones in Orange County.
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Old 03-22-2013, 03:36 PM
 
Location: Lafayette, CA
2,518 posts, read 4,011,513 times
Reputation: 624
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gentoo View Post
As I mentioned earlier, because of the heavy capacity on most of the freight lines here, that's not possible. Commuter trains stop the most and this would greatly back up rail traffic. Only in the southern part of Caltrains line can it share the tracks. Amtrak only has two lines heading that way and UP as far as I know doesn't give trackage rights to BNSF as it has it's own tracks nearby.
Well I'm not arguing that it's not possible, but I agree with his point that BART is just a welfare program when it comes down to it. That's why it's so much in the hole (just like the USPS).
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Old 03-22-2013, 03:47 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
18,982 posts, read 32,663,382 times
Reputation: 13635
Well if BART is a "welfare program" it certainly takes in a lot less welfare than every other mass transit sytem in the nation except for the NYC subway going by its farebox recovery ratio. Thank god it isn't nearly as much of a subsidy black hole like LA Metro and Metrolink.
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Old 03-22-2013, 04:13 PM
 
Location: Lafayette, CA
2,518 posts, read 4,011,513 times
Reputation: 624
I don't know of any metro system that has factored in $6.1 billion of welfare over the next 25 years. That's like the king of all welfare systems.

BART must lock in promise that fare increase will be used only for capital needs: Contra Costa Times editorial - ContraCostaTimes.com
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Old 03-22-2013, 04:27 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
28,226 posts, read 36,883,248 times
Reputation: 28563
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocGoldstein View Post
I don't know of any metro system that has factored in $6.1 billion of welfare over the next 25 years. That's like the king of all welfare systems.
"welfare.
BART must lock in promise that fare increase will be used only for capital needs: Contra Costa Times editorial - ContraCostaTimes.com
Apparently the $40B per year for the highway system doesn't count as "welfare"
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Old 03-22-2013, 04:28 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
18,982 posts, read 32,663,382 times
Reputation: 13635
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocGoldstein View Post
I don't know of any metro system that has factored in $6.1 billion of welfare over the next 25 years. That's like the king of all welfare systems.

BART must lock in promise that fare increase will be used only for capital needs: Contra Costa Times editorial - ContraCostaTimes.com
.Not sure how an article talking about how BART needs to use revenues from increased FARES is "welfare". That's actually the opposite of welfare. Again, you really should read the aritcles you post a lot slower and think about it more.


farebox recovery ratio:
BART: 76.6%
SD Trolley (LR): 57.4%
Caltrain (CR): 49.5%

And speaking of WELFARE:

Metrolink (CR): 46.1%
LA MTA Red/Purple Line (HR): 35.6%
LA MTA (LR): 21%

source: APTA


Pathetic that not even a single transit sytem in LA can cover 50% of it's operating costs with fares. Even San Diego does better than LA, haha. Just look at all those tax increases they have recently approved in LA to fund transit, not that I consider that a bad thing but you seem quite ignorant of what transit systems are the REAL welfare queens.

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Old 03-22-2013, 05:12 PM
 
Location: Lafayette, CA
2,518 posts, read 4,011,513 times
Reputation: 624
$6 billion in BART welfare is a lot. More than the combined debts of LA Metro, Seattle Central Link, Denver RTD, and Chicago Metra. COMBINED.
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Old 03-22-2013, 05:27 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
18,982 posts, read 32,663,382 times
Reputation: 13635
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocGoldstein View Post
$6 billion in BART welfare is a lot.
BART was never given $6 billion dollarsmod cut
Quote:
More than the combined debts of LA Metro, Seattle Central Link, Denver RTD, and Chicago Metra. COMBINED.
Source? mod cut
mod cut

Last edited by Sam I Am; 03-23-2013 at 03:33 AM.. Reason: not about LA
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Old 03-22-2013, 05:36 PM
 
Location: Lafayette, CA
2,518 posts, read 4,011,513 times
Reputation: 624
That includes roads, freeways, genius.
Quote:
Measure R will help fund dozens of critical transit and highway projects
mod cut BART by itself is over $6 BILLION in the hole, no other system like it in the U.S has accumulated that much welfare.

Last edited by Sam I Am; 03-23-2013 at 03:34 AM..
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Old 03-22-2013, 05:48 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
18,982 posts, read 32,663,382 times
Reputation: 13635
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocGoldstein View Post
That includes roads, freeways
I realize that and that is why the total for Measure R is $40 BILLION. The portion that funds transit is roughly $26 BILLION genius mod cut

Quote:
mod cut BART by itself is over $6 BILLION in the hole, no other system like it in the U.S has accumulated that much welfare.
You make no sense, first you refer to the $6 billion as welfare now you claim it's debt. mod cut

Quote:
Originally Posted by DocGoldstein View Post
$6 billion in BART welfare is a lot. More than the combined debts of LA Metro, Seattle Central Link, Denver RTD, and Chicago Metra. COMBINED.
Also where is your SOURCE??? mod cut

Last edited by Sam I Am; 03-23-2013 at 03:36 AM..
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