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Location: Monterey Bay, California -- watching the sea lions, whales and otters! :D
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I agree, I have no clue. I know that when I moved here the prices were just starting to go up and there were a lot of jokes going around about running down and seeing that "dump" going for $300,000 -- and now it's higher.
Actually, I'm not sure where people are getting their stats from. I've seen more places around for $400-$500,000 than any $900,000. The only ones that are in that range are usually in the West Cliff neighborhood -- although they still look like what $150,000 will buy you back east! My father used to always joke that if he could just move his house out here, he'd be rich! Ha ha. It's true.
Of course, there are those who lived here for decades, sell and move into something else. I don't know how people do it. I know for awhile lots of people were taking equity from their homes, and that's why you see so many fancy-dancy cars around. There are a lot of entrepreneurs. And I do know of a few very wealthy high-tech people who work (or more accurately own companies) in San Jose. But I also know a lot of people who don't have money. So, it's really a mixed bag.
Of course there are also trust-fund babies here, too...I've known a few of those, also. They usually are pretty low-key and keep out-of-sight.
So, I don't know. Maybe things will change around. I know lots of college kids still share places. But I don't believe the average price for a house here is $900,000 -- that doesn't seem accurate.
It's weird, I admit. I never quite figured it out here. The ones I know who are doing the "best" (and I don't mean with being wealthy or anything) are those who have lived here for a long time or were raised here. They got into the housing market early, and now they don't have to worry. Or their parents had them inherit the houses.
Where I work, I know it's not high pay, and there are other lower paid places, too. (Management gets paid a lot, but the worker bees don't...)
It's a mystery to me. That's why I tell people to just come and look. You never know what you'll find. If it's your place to be, then something will come up. And that's all I know!
Yep ... a mixed bag.
Fancy cars? Hmmmmm, where are they? It's rare that i see one ... thankfully.
I don't know how reliable this heat map is but it's interesting to look at. Santa Cruz County Home Prices and Heat Map - Trulia.com
I was going to move into a pretty nice 2 bedroom in Soquel recently (up on a ridge ... prime property but only on an acre or so) and before the economic crisis it would have sold for over 1 million ... now, i dunno but still extremely pricey.
And you say, " That's why I tell people to just come and look. You never know what you'll find. If it's your place to be, then something will come up. And that's all I know!
Absolutely .... it's a funky and swirling and chaotic area and being open to any and all possibilities is key.
Hi, I have lived in Santa Cruz for about 4 - 5 years now and I can say one thing, "This place sucks"! There is absolutely nothing to do here except go on a few biking trails in the mountains or smoke marijuana with a couple dopes. The downtown area is disgusting with trash everywhere and homeless people that smell, walking out and about and weirdos dressed in pink and such. Also, another thing is how the beaches smell and how the city is so anti-dog (lol).
Not to mention the crime is getting worse and worse every year. Also, the housing here is so expensive its out of the question, the only place you could live is in Watsonville! And the traffic here is probably the worst in the bay area (besides San Francisco).
The only somewhat good area in this city is (getting worse, every day) probably north Chestnut St.
Just comes to show how a liberal run city works.
I cant wait to move to BOISE!!!
Actually, I agree...I have lived in great college towns like missoula and boulder, and in great cities like sfo, boston and SD...and each time i went to SC to visit family, or to scope out maybe living there, I would leave agitated and irritated. The most recent visit was this past November-I spent thanksgiving in the area and STILL I was so aggravated, and couldn't wait to leave. I SO wanted to like SC, too. The idea of it was great....
It also feels SO much bigger and more congested than it's size would suggest. Traffic horrid. And to get where? A brew pub?
And frankly, I think it's another one of those former cool granola college towns that has overgrown itself, and tries to live on the memory of what it once was. Become something of a parody of itself---similar to Portland oregon in it's history of off the beaten path and unique, but now too trendy and more of an image. SC may well still be a decent place for college....but honestly, I don't know how they can justify the rental and real estate costs for that area---at least Marin and SFO give you real tangibles to enjoy-which I suppose are subjective, but I prefer the outdoor and safety aspects of Marin, and the cultural/food aspects of SFO, to anything you can get in SC....just me. If you want true hippie not hippie/yuppie combo, then go to Humboldt these days...
Hope OP has a good time in Boise or wherever he/she ends up.
Anyway, I've only been to Boise once, and had a decent time, but cannot say I'd move there.
Last edited by lrmsd; 03-15-2010 at 04:51 PM..
Reason: typo
Actually, I agree...I have lived in great college towns like missoula and boulder, and in great cities like sfo, boston and SD...and each time i went to SC to visit family, or to scope out maybe living there, I would leave agitated and irritated. The most recent visit was this past November-I spent thanksgiving in the area and STILL I was so aggravated, and couldn't wait to leave. I SO wanted to like SC, too. The idea of it was great....
It also feels SO much bigger and more congested than it's size would suggest. Traffic horrid. And to get where? A brew pub?
And frankly, I think it's another one of those former cool granola college towns that has overgrown itself, and tries to live on the memory of what it once was. Become something of a parody of itself---similar to Portland oregon in it's history of off the beaten path and unique, but now too trendy and more of an image. SC may well still be a decent place for college....but honestly, I don't know how they can justify the rental and real estate costs for that area---at least Marin and SFO give you real tangibles to enjoy-which I suppose are subjective, but I prefer the outdoor and safety aspects of Marin, and the cultural/food aspects of SFO, to anything you can get in SC....just me. If you want true hippie not hippie/yuppie combo, then go to Humboldt these days...
Hope OP has a good time in Boise or wherever he/she ends up.
Anyway, I've only been to Boise once, and had a decent time, but cannot say I'd move there.
Agree with what? A hateful guy? Great.
You've said this before ... that S.C. has become a parody of itself ... sounds like something you read or heard and you like to repeat it 'cause it sounds good but it's just silly ... truly.
You say it's living on a memory of what it once was but you don't even know what it once was.
(And you say Portland is a parody of itself [as you've said before]. Please.)
You don't know Santa Cruz county well (it's obvious from your posts despite your know it all posturing) and yet you continue to diss it with superficial takes and impressions from your visits.
And the traffic during rush hour on HWY1 and on some side streets in Santa Cruz proper is a bummer but it's not that bad (it's all relative) especially if you know alternative routes and how to avoid HWY1 and the commonly used alternative routes.
The food scene isn't as good as S.F. and Marin and Napa, etc. but it's improving (or so i've heard) and who the f cares? Not i. To me, if the food scene gets swanky ... well, it doesn't need to and i hope it doesn't.
It's a real place with real people and it's diverse and it's still unique and of course it's changed (there is no place of reasonable population in this country that has escaped the b.s. of the dominant culture and S.C. county is no exception and it totally sucks but that's everywhere) and it's certainly not a "trendy" place or one that is concerned with its image.
I don't know where you're coming from but it ain't here.
If you don't find Santa Cruz county enjoyable that's cool but to suggest that it lacks outdoor aspects (whatever that means ... i assume that you mean outdoor activities?) is a truly ludicrous thing to say and just another indication that you kinda don't know what you're talking about and also have some attitude.
Santa Cruz (and the county as a whole) is not for everyone and it doesn't "welcome" everyone and many people find it a difficult place to flow with. The "agitation and irritation" suggests to me that you're not someone who resonates with the area and/or that it pushes you around in ways that you can't tolerate ... that make you feel way too uncomfortable.
Instead of going deeper and finding out what's going on (with you ... S.C. is a good mirror) you denigrate the place with silly judgments.
You say you want to like it and yet you continue to be disappointed.
There are most likely some reasons for that beyond your superficial assessments / complaints about traffic and congestion.
The energy here is very strong and there's a chaoticness that many people can't deal with and/or that they find threatening (usually not on a conscious level) and, speaking generally, the complaints i've read (from you and others) have, imo, more to do with that essential truth than what is going on in the external environment.
And Santa Cruz county is not a yuppie haven dear ... that would be Marin ... just oozes with some of the least savory of that "type" of a** hole and what they've done.
You like Marin county and yet i get the heeby geebies up there ... go figure ... different strokes for different folks.
And i don't know what you are talking about when you use the word "hippie".
That word means different things to different people but there are quite a few authentic alternative folks in the county and you wouldn't know it by visiting ... and given what you've expressed probably not even if you lived here.
To assess the scene of Santa Cruz county by looking at (and most likely judging) people hanging out downtown or by listening to other people who likewise can't get with the flow is folly.
I tend to think that if you don't know a place quite well (by way of experience) it's best to be quiet or at least let it be known that your experience is very limited and that you have attitude.
Last edited by coyoteskye; 03-15-2010 at 07:14 PM..
Santa Cruz seems to me like it has San Diego problems as far as not enough jobs and real high cost of living. California seems nothing but a wasteland right now.
Santa Cruz seems to me like it has San Diego problems as far as not enough jobs and real high cost of living. California seems nothing but a wasteland right now.
It's a much of the coast of CA problem ... too many people wanting to be where too many other people want to be.
How will it correct itself if people with money keep coming into the county and are willing to buy at those prices?
Economics is not my forte so i'm kinda clueless but i'm concerned that the people who can't afford to own will keep getting pushed out (not to mention what happens to us renters who already pay way too much for way too little) and at some point, Santa Cruz will be another ruined place (it hasn't happened yet!) 'cause of all the bucks and the inequity of it all.
Doesn't the entire state need a radical correction in order for the county of Santa Cruz to "balance out"?
Yes, and in fact much of inland California HAS been undergoing a radical correction over the past few years. This hasn't quite reached the coast yet but it's coming.
Here's my analysis for Santa Cruz. From our very own City-Data:
Estimated median household income in 2008: $63,227 (it was $50,605 in 2000)
Estimated median house or condo value in 2008: $742,272 (it was $397,100 in 2000)
Ratio of house/condo price to median household income:
2000 (pre-housing bubble): 7.8
2008 (peak of housing bubble): 11.7
If the ratio simply corrects back to the pre-bubble level and income stays at $63k, the median house price should retreat to $493k. Still expensive, but a lot more reasonable in my opinion.
Does anyone have a good argument why the ratio wouldn't return to what it was in 2000 (or maybe lower, if the recession drags on)?
And how can there be a median income of 63K (which i checked and it's roughly that) and average house prices around 8 or 9K?!!
How does that even work? and how in the world can the situation be sustained?
Exactly! The only way it got that way in the first place was because of all the risky mortgages that were being issued from about 2000-2008, and we all know how that story is ending. Does anyone think those mortgages are coming back anytime soon? (Or even in our lifetimes?)
Exactly! The only way it got that way in the first place was because of all the risky mortgages that were being issued from about 2000-2008, and we all know how that story is ending. Does anyone think those mortgages are coming back anytime soon? (Or even in our lifetimes?)
I look forward to the correction and hope it comes soon and i hope it's radical.
As a renter it's very difficult not only because of the inflated prices but because in the kind of rental situations i and others experience, there's a gross personal (and obviously financial - but that's everywhere) kind of inequity and both the landlord and tenant know it and it can create hard feelings.
(I have known some good and caring and aware owner/landlords but in my experience they are few and far between.)
Specifically, if you're a single person with limited income and want to rent a free standing property that is "affordable" (relatively speaking) the only option is to find a "cottage" or "cabin" (often they're glorified shacks) that sits on the property of the landlord in the shadow of the "big house" (and a tenant is often in the shadow of their life which takes precedence) and often with very little privacy in a kind of situation that, ideally, would be a communal one but is most obviously and certainly not.
These home owners are either land rich and cash poor or just plain greedy and need or just want the income (need a cash cow) but would just as soon you not be there!
They don't want a rental unit on their property ... they need it there to support their trip which would be fine if the living situation was more equitable ... as in communal. But it's not ... they want their cake and they wanna eat it to.
I'm an artist, work at home, have a lot of rental experience and often it's quite clear that a potential landlord wants someone who has a 9-5 so the tenant won't be there.
These are the folks who contribute to the spoiling of Santa Cruz county (and it will be spoiled for many of us if there isn't a radical correction) because they are entitled and do not know how to (or don't wish to) "live simply so others can simply live". .... that may be a corny notion to most but it's true.
We don't need socialism ... we just need people to wake up, get humble and stop living beyond what their personal resources can sustain in a balanced fashion, stop using others who have less worldly "power", ie; money!, and recognize that the earth is limited in its resources and can't endlessly provide for an absurd amount of stupid (as in greatly lacking in care and awareness) humans and their ridiculous population growth.
It's just frustrating because Santa Cruz county is a place in particular (in my opinion and for some far out and not far out reasons) that should not belong to the wealthy.
There are some magical places in this country and people with money often want to own such places and they often can and do.
Then those who basically just want to be with the nature and the energy of the place and in a harmonious way get forced out.
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
Oooops ... ranting.
Last edited by coyoteskye; 03-15-2010 at 10:00 PM..
I look forward to the correction and hope it comes soon and i hope it's radical.
As a renter it's very difficult not only because of the inflated prices but because in the kind of rental situations i and others experience, there's a gross personal (and obviously financial - but that's everywhere) kind of inequity and both the landlord and tenant know it and it can create hard feelings.
I hear you, and the problem is far from confined to starving artists. I am a lifelong renter, mostly by choice due to moving around a lot, but I wouldn't have minded settling down and buying a place starting around, oh, 2005 or so.
Unfortunately that was right in the middle of the real estate frenzy which even then was obviously not sustainable, not when I knew how much cheaper the same houses had been going for just five years earlier. (Like half as much, or even less.)
So I continue to rent, and it costs me right about half as much as a mortgage payment would be on the same exact house, even assuming a 20% downpayment and today's cheap interest rates. For it to make any sense to buy, either rent would have to double (good luck with that) or house prices would have to... well, you can do the math.
Renting sucks in some ways, no question about it, but think how much infinitely worse it could be, if you were one of those who bought into the mania a few years back and now were stuck with a house worth hundreds of thousands of dollars less than your mortgage, and quite possibly like many people dreading the day when the sheriff will knock on the door and send you packing.
There has been a lot of horrific greed over the past decade, and it's really done a lot of damage to this state - and the country, for that matter. If this "great recession" leaves people (and the government!) just a little bit more modest, humble, and willing to try to live within their means instead of trying to outdo each other with mad spending, that will be no bad thing at all.
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My father used to always joke that if he could just move his house out here, he'd be rich! Ha ha. It's true. 
and how in the world can the situation be sustained?
