Opinions - What Would You Do In This Situation? (crime, felony)
Seattle areaSeattle and King County Suburbs
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Let me just say upfront that I absolutely do not mean to make this a racial issue, just giving the facts as to the people involved.
I'm white, middle-aged and about 5'9''. This past weekend I went to a restaurant by myself on the south end, a place I am starting to frequent and so the staff knows me a bit. I took off my coat and was about to sit down when out of nowhere a black teenager whom i've never seen before came up to me from the side and said "BOOO!" and threw a punch which went off to the side of my head. The punch didn't connect, just off to the side. I've taken quite a few self-defense and boxing courses in the recent past and I immediately went into a boxing/self-defense stance without even thinking. I didn't swing back but I got ready for the altercation. The kid just kept walking but was staring me down and muttering. Everyone in the restaurant was quiet, nobody said nor did anything.
The kid was thin, big glasses, probably about 14 or 15. He sat down in a booth with what I believe were his parents - a very large black man (by large, I mean tall, with serious reach) and an older women with dreadlocks. His parents didn't say anything at all. I got the feeling that they didn't give a damn, but that's just a feeling on my part. I figured that everything was over with so I sat down in my booth. However the kid kept shooting me looks and staring me down, he seemed pretty aggressive and hostile and I really couldn't figure out why. I finally had enough and jumped up out of the booth and yelled, "JESUS CHRIST, WHAAAT???!!!". The entire restaurant went quiet again, nobody moved. The kid waved and said, "oh, hi!". I thought that was strange, not sure what to make of that. Again his parents remained quiet and said nothing. His father probably could have completely dismantled me, I would have had to kick him in the knee and run. But not a move from either parent.
I finally ignored him and when they got up to leave the kid stared me down again all the way to the door. He then yelled something at me, to which I made a fist and slammed it into my palm, then pointed at him. Again his father did nothing. They turned and left. It was the strangest situation ever.
The more I think about it, the kid seemed like he had behavior issues. I don't understand why his parents didn't say anything to either of us. When the kid threw a punch at me out of nowhere I had no idea what his issue was - how was I supposed to know? My training kicked-in and I was gonna beat that little bastard's ass. Teenagers can be violent - they join gangs, shoot-up schools, how am I supposed to know what he's up to?
What I shouldn't have done was get up and yell at the kid after everything had calmed down. Still, he had already thrown a punch at me, and now he's staring at me, so I didn't know what was up. I figured might as well get it out of the way. I could have just left, but dammit I hate the feeling of being bullied by some teenage kid, if that makes any sense. I'm probably wrong about that, but it's how I felt at the time. I'm not the toughest guy in the world nor do I think I can handle anyone, I simply stay in shape and get in the ring or do some self-defense training every now and then.
What would any of you have done? What could I have done differently? I often feel that Americans have this rhetoric about reaching for guns and being some sort of hero, but situations like this one are not exactly textbook. I don't think most borderline violent situations are. It's good to have the defensive training and confidence that comes with it, but you have just a couple seconds at most to evaluate an attack.
I'd have completely ignored him. If he was staring at me, I'd sit on the other side so I wouldn't see his face. People can be weird. In my troubled youth I had a friend (white boy) who I was walking down the street with one day when he suddenly screamed into the ear of a girl passing by. I have no idea why he did that except he had a troubled life. It had NOTHING to do with that stranger. It was just my friend acting up. And who knows why this boy's parents were acting the way they did. I try to avoid strange people and situations as much as possible.
By the way this incident happened more than 20 years ago but whenever I think about it, I always feel so bad for that poor girl.
You held yourself pretty well. I think many in that situation would have completely lost it on that kid. I can't (nor will I even try) to explain his anit-social behavior, nor the lack of accountability with the kid's parents. Let's hope it was an isolated and random one time occurrence: Sometimes people just act out.
Let me just say upfront that I absolutely do not mean to make this a racial issue, just giving the facts as to the people involved.
I'm white, middle-aged and about 5'9''. This past weekend I went to a restaurant by myself on the south end, a place I am starting to frequent and so the staff knows me a bit. I took off my coat and was about to sit down when out of nowhere a black teenager whom i've never seen before came up to me from the side and said "BOOO!" and threw a punch which went off to the side of my head. The punch didn't connect, just off to the side. I've taken quite a few self-defense and boxing courses in the recent past and I immediately went into a boxing/self-defense stance without even thinking. I didn't swing back but I got ready for the altercation. The kid just kept walking but was staring me down and muttering. Everyone in the restaurant was quiet, nobody said nor did anything.
The kid was thin, big glasses, probably about 14 or 15. He sat down in a booth with what I believe were his parents - a very large black man (by large, I mean tall, with serious reach) and an older women with dreadlocks. His parents didn't say anything at all. I got the feeling that they didn't give a damn, but that's just a feeling on my part. I figured that everything was over with so I sat down in my booth. However the kid kept shooting me looks and staring me down, he seemed pretty aggressive and hostile and I really couldn't figure out why. I finally had enough and jumped up out of the booth and yelled, "JESUS CHRIST, WHAAAT???!!!". The entire restaurant went quiet again, nobody moved. The kid waved and said, "oh, hi!". I thought that was strange, not sure what to make of that. Again his parents remained quiet and said nothing. His father probably could have completely dismantled me, I would have had to kick him in the knee and run. But not a move from either parent.
I finally ignored him and when they got up to leave the kid stared me down again all the way to the door. He then yelled something at me, to which I made a fist and slammed it into my palm, then pointed at him. Again his father did nothing. They turned and left. It was the strangest situation ever.
The more I think about it, the kid seemed like he had behavior issues. I don't understand why his parents didn't say anything to either of us. When the kid threw a punch at me out of nowhere I had no idea what his issue was - how was I supposed to know? My training kicked-in and I was gonna beat that little bastard's ass. Teenagers can be violent - they join gangs, shoot-up schools, how am I supposed to know what he's up to?
What I shouldn't have done was get up and yell at the kid after everything had calmed down. Still, he had already thrown a punch at me, and now he's staring at me, so I didn't know what was up. I figured might as well get it out of the way. I could have just left, but dammit I hate the feeling of being bullied by some teenage kid, if that makes any sense. I'm probably wrong about that, but it's how I felt at the time. I'm not the toughest guy in the world nor do I think I can handle anyone, I simply stay in shape and get in the ring or do some self-defense training every now and then.
What would any of you have done? What could I have done differently? I often feel that Americans have this rhetoric about reaching for guns and being some sort of hero, but situations like this one are not exactly textbook. I don't think most borderline violent situations are. It's good to have the defensive training and confidence that comes with it, but you have just a couple seconds at most to evaluate an attack.
The parents sitting there in denial would have made the decision for me. If they would have at least said something, but since they just sat there? Oh hell naw. I'd have called the police. Doesn't matter the race.
Since be was a mid, I'd have called the police! I'd have called the police and got the restaurant's management involved immediateltly. In fact, go back there and request a video tape of the incident. Most businesses have cameras mounted in the case of burglery. I'd at least file a police report now and ask the police if they can obtain a copy of it.
It sounds like the kid was playing the "knockout game", which has left random people with severe injuries from head trauma. I would be willing to bet there are stiff penalties for that in most major metros and it may even be considered a felony. You did the right thing by not getting into an altercation with a kid. Who could blame you for losing it? Hell, if I was there I'd have probably yelled at that little F'er myself along with you lol.
But don't let it go. Take action now before this F'er paralyzes some old woman. I am sure the restaurant could find out who they are by the date and time they paid for the meal.
Do you think that the parents were even aware of what their kid was doing? Did they know he took a swing at you, or were there backs turned?
Did anyone else notice what the kid did that was dining in the restaurant? Was your outburst when you stood up understood by the rest of the people dining?
It seems like if he had issues, the parents would be "on alert" as to how he interacts with the public, and interfere or at least be ready to explain the kids actions.
What a very weird situation. It is hard to know how anyone would react in that moment!
Second what Sacite said about the video camera. It's better this kid learns something at 14/15 when he's still a minor. As an adult, that could potentially lead to felony charges which would follow him the rest of his life. It's not likely. He'd probably cut a plea deal for a misdemeanor as it was fairly minor and we just don't have room or money to house relatively minor sociopaths.
I agree, it's relatively minor. I'm not a big fan of involving the police for cat up a tree, but that behavior unchecked is just going to escalate. It's obvious his parents aren't parents, so that leaves it to the criminal justice system to try and instill some values, or at least fear of punishment, in him. Far from ideal, but ultimately better than it continuing to where he slugs some 70-year-old and does real damage. I don't really see any other way of handling it though. If it was somebody my own age, I'd just ask them to step outside if they had a problem and let them throw the first punch. You can't do that with a kid though.
If you're becoming a "regular" at that restaurant and the staff knows you, why didn't you complain to the staff or the manager? The kid attempted an assault, and continued to look at you threateningly. I'm surprised none of the staff got involved after that first swing, when you jumped into self-defense mode. Someone should have come over to tell you both to settle down or leave.
If I were you, I wouldn't patronize that place anymore. You could even tell the manager why. Anyplace that looks the other way as a scuffle starts to break out isn't a place that I'd find enjoyable.
Let me just say upfront that I absolutely do not mean to make this a racial issue, just giving the facts as to the people involved.
I'm white, middle-aged and about 5'9''. This past weekend I went to a restaurant by myself on the south end, a place I am starting to frequent and so the staff knows me a bit. I took off my coat and was about to sit down when out of nowhere a black teenager whom i've never seen before came up to me from the side and said "BOOO!" and threw a punch which went off to the side of my head. The punch didn't connect, just off to the side. I've taken quite a few self-defense and boxing courses in the recent past and I immediately went into a boxing/self-defense stance without even thinking. I didn't swing back but I got ready for the altercation. The kid just kept walking but was staring me down and muttering. Everyone in the restaurant was quiet, nobody said nor did anything.
The kid was thin, big glasses, probably about 14 or 15. He sat down in a booth with what I believe were his parents - a very large black man (by large, I mean tall, with serious reach) and an older women with dreadlocks. His parents didn't say anything at all. I got the feeling that they didn't give a damn, but that's just a feeling on my part. I figured that everything was over with so I sat down in my booth. However the kid kept shooting me looks and staring me down, he seemed pretty aggressive and hostile and I really couldn't figure out why. I finally had enough and jumped up out of the booth and yelled, "JESUS CHRIST, WHAAAT???!!!". The entire restaurant went quiet again, nobody moved. The kid waved and said, "oh, hi!". I thought that was strange, not sure what to make of that. Again his parents remained quiet and said nothing. His father probably could have completely dismantled me, I would have had to kick him in the knee and run. But not a move from either parent.
I finally ignored him and when they got up to leave the kid stared me down again all the way to the door. He then yelled something at me, to which I made a fist and slammed it into my palm, then pointed at him. Again his father did nothing. They turned and left. It was the strangest situation ever.
The more I think about it, the kid seemed like he had behavior issues. I don't understand why his parents didn't say anything to either of us. When the kid threw a punch at me out of nowhere I had no idea what his issue was - how was I supposed to know? My training kicked-in and I was gonna beat that little bastard's ass. Teenagers can be violent - they join gangs, shoot-up schools, how am I supposed to know what he's up to?
What I shouldn't have done was get up and yell at the kid after everything had calmed down. Still, he had already thrown a punch at me, and now he's staring at me, so I didn't know what was up. I figured might as well get it out of the way. I could have just left, but dammit I hate the feeling of being bullied by some teenage kid, if that makes any sense. I'm probably wrong about that, but it's how I felt at the time. I'm not the toughest guy in the world nor do I think I can handle anyone, I simply stay in shape and get in the ring or do some self-defense training every now and then.
What would any of you have done? What could I have done differently? I often feel that Americans have this rhetoric about reaching for guns and being some sort of hero, but situations like this one are not exactly textbook. I don't think most borderline violent situations are. It's good to have the defensive training and confidence that comes with it, but you have just a couple seconds at most to evaluate an attack.
Actually, yelling at him might've been the right thing to do. Notice that he backed down momentarily after you did that. Kids trying to act tough need to know people won't stand for it, and won't shrink from a confrontation, either. Too many people are afraid of causing a scene, so punks get away with this kind of stuff. Notice that everyone in the place including the staff did shrink away from it. Everyone pretended nothing was going on. That doesn't help kids like this learn what's right and what's wrong. The message sent to that kid was that it's ok to do what he was doing. Staff should have called the manager, and the mgr should have come up and asked "Is everything ok, sir?" or something. Anything!
I've had stuff like that happen before, though very rarely in decades as an adult. I'm pretty similar to OP, based on description. He handled it better than I might have: I'd have done the same thing, but my Irish temper probably would have had some choice words for that little ___ , and probably back in his ugly face. I'm aware of my temper, but when threatened with violence...well. As the kids today say, "It's on!"
Hard to understand why stuff like this happens, and across the decades I've handled it both well and poorly. Hopefully, more the former than latter. The thing about de-escalation is it requires two to tango, though. My dad taught me, "don't start fights, but always finish them" from a simpler era (Greatest Generation).
"Race" of any persons involved is probably relevant, somewhere along the line, due only to current events. Otherwise I'd almost always say it isn't unless a racist tirade was leveled against me (that's happened, too, once or twice in life for the crime of having a job, and being a professional, and working in a "depressed" area). But today, this week or month in particular, gotta wonder!
Maybe, btw, the right thing to do is call the police as others have said. It does occur to me the couple times I've handled stuff like that the hard way, with speed and violence, little good has come of it. And Malloric's right: can't kick the crap out of some kid. Another man, though: yep, would involve a trip out the front door for a lesson in manners.
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