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Those that are arguing that we should be doing everything organic, and growing small plots, and say this is the only sustainable way to raise food are way behind the knowledge we have today.
50 years ago, India had a huge problem feeding their people. They had to import huge amounts of wheat, rice, etc. and the country could not afford it. They were farming exactly like you are preaching we should do. It was keeping the country at the bottom of the heap.
Back in the 70s we sent agriculture expert over to help them. We taught them to farm, and helped them develop strains of seed to work for their climate and part of the world. Within a few years, the starvation problem was solved, and they started not only being able to feed their people, but then started to export grain where it was needed.
In the orient, we did the same with rice. Went over there, helped them develop seed for their area, and taught them how to farm and they are able to feed their people and export rice for income.
It was called the green revolution. It got starving people fed.
What you want to happen in this country, is go back to where we were 50 years ago. At that time, it took 30% of the people in this country to produce the food we eat. Now it takes 1 1/2% to feed the country and export food.
Not many people want to go back to working the farms the way they were done back then. I mean the workers that would have to leave the cities, and go back to small farm towns and work like dogs to make the food.
Those that are arguing that we should be doing everything organic, and growing small plots, and say this is the only sustainable way to raise food are way behind the knowledge we have today.
50 years ago, India had a huge problem feeding their people. They had to import huge amounts of wheat, rice, etc. and the country could not afford it. They were farming exactly like you are preaching we should do. It was keeping the country at the bottom of the heap.
Back in the 70s we sent agriculture expert over to help them. We taught them to farm, and helped them develop strains of seed to work for their climate and part of the world. Within a few years, the starvation problem was solved, and they started not only being able to feed their people, but then started to export grain where it was needed.
In the orient, we did the same with rice. Went over there, helped them develop seed for their area, and taught them how to farm and they are able to feed their people and export rice for income.
It was called the green revolution. It got starving people fed.
What you want to happen in this country, is go back to where we were 50 years ago. At that time, it took 30% of the people in this country to produce the food we eat. Now it takes 1 1/2% to feed the country and export food.
Not many people want to go back to working the farms the way they were done back then. I mean the workers that would have to leave the cities, and go back to small farm towns and work like dogs to make the food.
Excuse me for pointing out the following but most of these "working people" you are talking about have terrible problems surviving in the cities lately. The income has been stagnant for the last few decades while corporate profits have gone up, most jobs have been exported to the Chinese and Indians and who knows where else, enabling corporations to profit even more, the CEOs to get richer but it all but destroyed the American worker. Factories shut down, not much in terms of production - soon we won't know how to make the basic things, INCLUDING food. I have lived in cities and I have lived rural. I still don't think that the guy who gave up his farm and came to the city to work in an office got a better deal, esp. if his job was exported elsewhere and now he is left to wonder what next. At least with his own farm he could have "worked like a dog" but it was his, fair and square, no indentured servitude to the bank, no poisoned and tainted food supply, your destiny is in your own hands and the hands of the people in your community. No genetic and chemical experiments on your head.
The problem is our economic system. It forces people to take part in it, almost a form of slavery if you ask me (taxes, mandatory this and that if you build or own a home, in most areas). People who want to live as the OP describes can't because of the taxes and such. It doesn't reward people's true talents the way many would claim, it rewards what is most "profitable," that is, it places paper and ink above what is probably more important (i.e., national self-sufficiency, clean water, air, wildlife etc.). Consider how many talented writers or whatever else are wasting their lives away in dead end "jobs" simply because they're forced to in order to survive.
I don't know what the answer is to fix it but I'm certain it will wither away slowly. The endless growth our economy is based on is not possible with limited resources.
... 50 years ago, India had a huge problem feeding their people. They had to import huge amounts of wheat, rice, etc. and the country could not afford it. They were farming exactly like you are preaching we should do. It was keeping the country at the bottom of the heap.
Back in the 70s we sent agriculture expert over to help them. We taught them to farm, and helped them develop strains of seed to work for their climate and part of the world. Within a few years, the starvation problem was solved, and they started not only being able to feed their people, but then started to export grain where it was needed.
The Peace Corps while in East India also managed to force a parasitic mite to leap from a regional species of bee, over to the European honeybee. That mite was brought back to North America and now is among the problems we have with our honeybees.
Ignorant 'agriculture experts' did a lot of things.
The Peace Corps while in East India also managed to force a parasitic mite to leap from a regional species of bee, over to the European honeybee. That mite was brought back to North America and now is among the problems we have with our honeybees.
Ignorant 'agriculture experts' did a lot of things.
Not to mention that the agriculture system we use today is unsustainable in the long run. It depletes the soil of resources, it pollutes the water supply etc. There is a reason why people were starving in India, there were too many for what the soil can SUSTAINABLY support. Now there are more, they eat contaminated crap just like we do but the planet is slowly turning arid, polluted and dying. So, yes, maybe the green revolution was a "fix" (and a bad one at that) but it only bought some time, nothing else.
Division of labor? Benefits of multi-layer complex society with specializations? Need to get away from what everyone was already doing 10,000 years back? Sanity?
Not to mention that the agriculture system we use today is unsustainable in the long run. It depletes the soil of resources, it pollutes the water supply etc. There is a reason why people were starving in India, there were too many for what the soil can SUSTAINABLY support. Now there are more, they eat contaminated crap just like we do but the planet is slowly turning arid, polluted and dying. So, yes, maybe the green revolution was a "fix" (and a bad one at that) but it only bought some time, nothing else.
This is bull manure. You find subsistence economies in the Third World, and poverty, disease, and starvation are the norm in those societies. Historically, you find subsistence economies in the late Stone Age and early Bronze Age cultures. Get a clue, people have been abandoning subsistence agriculture economies for specialization and urban living for 10,000 years. bg7 has the right of it.
Furthermore, there is absolutely no correlation between subsistence agriculture and protection of soil fertility or water quality. Generally, it's just the opposite. People who scratch in the soil to raise just enough food to feed and clothe their families live in flimsy huts, suffer from all kinds of nasty bacterial diseases from polluted water, and move on after they've despoiled their current areas. They tend to practice slash and burn agriculture. People who terrace hillsides to prevent erosion or who build irrigation canals are part of advanced cultures where some farm and others observe celestial events or write on stone tablets or build aqueducts to supply water to cities. They aren't moving anywhere, so they take care of the soil and water that they have.
This is bull manure. You find subsistence economies in the Third World, and poverty, disease, and starvation are the norm in those societies. Historically, you find subsistence economies in the late Stone Age and early Bronze Age cultures. Get a clue, people have been abandoning subsistence agriculture economies for specialization and urban living for 10,000 years. bg7 has the right of it.
Furthermore, there is absolutely no correlation between subsistence agriculture and protection of soil fertility or water quality. Generally, it's just the opposite. People who scratch in the soil to raise just enough food to feed and clothe their families live in flimsy huts, suffer from all kinds of nasty bacterial diseases from polluted water, and move on after they've despoiled their current areas. They tend to practice slash and burn agriculture. People who terrace hillsides to prevent erosion or who build irrigation canals are part of advanced cultures where some farm and others observe celestial events or write on stone tablets or build aqueducts to supply water to cities. They aren't moving anywhere, so they take care of the soil and water that they have.
Boy, you sound bitter - it is not healthy do carry that stuff all bottled up!
Anyways, I will take someone who maintains the health of the soil through organic methods any time over someone who douses it in all sorts of chemicals and then regurgitates the mantra that it is all safe and that science knows all. In almost all instances we find the truth decades later. I mean, after all, aren't the same corporations who sold us s*it now making "natural" versions of the same s*it? And charging more for it? What happened to the stuff they sold before? Isn't that a quiet admission that they were selling s*it?
You mentioned in the thread that you prefer to pursue your professional interests and make money and live an easier life instead of slaving on the land. Curious- do you have any scientific training? If so, how can you write the stuff above? Makes me seriously wonder about the quality of our education system . Although I think even someone with primary school education would understand the different between using composted manure to enrich the soil and dousing the soil in all sorts of chemicals which devoid it of any life.
I don't care if you choose the life of debt and indentured servitude to banks and employers. I personally could't sleep knowing that I have debt and that someone like a disgusting bank is making money on me like I am some sort of a mule to exploit. At least slaves did not have a choice, they were made to lose their freedom. But when someone voluntarily gives it up... well, it is just sad.
I also can't sleep knowing that someone is poisoning me knowing full well that what they are feeding me is s*it but because they bought off enough senators and congressmen and because they employ immoral scientists, they can pass laws that make all the stuff healthy for you to eat. Or should I use their terminology and say "not unhealthy" . See I can speak "lawyer speak" too! Too bad it's all we reduced ourselves to.
Anyways, thanks for your point of view. I now understand why most people don't do it. All I can say is I am sad for humanity.
Actually, to avoid possible inaccuracies, it could be cow manure. Well... or a steer/bullock dung. Or perhaps a trans-bull or trans-cow poop-pie?
But for the sufficiency types--looks like fire fuel in the formative stage.
Last edited by ChrisC; 12-09-2013 at 07:55 PM..
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- it is not healthy do carry that stuff all bottled up!
