Is The Move Worth It? Idaho (Boise) vs South Carolina (Charleston: how much, theater)

[Charlestondata]

Nikki Haley won Charleston County by about the same margin as Trump won the state in the Republican primary yesterday. The political analysts on CNN repeatedly talked about the differences between the Lowcountry and the Upstate, calling the Upstate “in the heart of the Bible Belt.” Speaking of subtle not so subtle cultural differences. Haley even won the state’s first congressional district. So, again, I don’t think of the Charleston area as the place to direct people if they’re seeking the MAGA brand of conservatism to live around.

[LakeMan45]

Nikki's strategy was to court Democrats to vote for her in the open primary. There are more Democrats in Charleston County. Trump won Dorchester and Berkeley counties easily and he probably won Mt Pleasant. Most Republicans who relocate to Charleston won't live in the downtown area.

Nikki Haley may be more social conservative than Trump is. A social conservative wasn't on the ballot.

Nikki is the candidate who refused to say slavery was the reason for the Civil War while she was courting Democrat and liberal Republican votes, Charleston County voters turned out for a candidate who denied the cause of the Civil War.

[IsNull]

Sorry, but there was no evidence yesterday of Democrats voting in the primary. Charleston and Columbia both supported Rubio in the last election over Trump in the same levels you're seeing Haley favored here. Painting in broad strokes, I feel Charleston has more Independents, moderate conservatives, and conservative Libertarians. I think most people quickly looked past the whole Civil War comment. I mean you had Trump out there claiming his mug shot and indictments appeal to Black voters and it didn't seem to hurt his numbers.

Haley won Mt. Pleasant. The only Precincts Trump won in MtP was 34 which is small area between Park West and Hwy 41.

[LakeMan45]

You haven't presented any evidence Democrats did not vote for her. Her campaign was trying to encourage Democrats to vote for her. Trump likely won the primary in SC in 2016 because of Democrats voting for him because they thought he was the easiest to beat.

Most of Nikki's major donors are liberal. I can't recall a candidate that had more unified Republican opposition than Haley this year. She couldn't even get "moderates" like Graham on board.

I don't think Haley compares well to Rubio. Rubio was generally well liked by conservative media. I believe Rubio endorsed Trump.

In terms of policy, there's really little difference between Trump and Haley. They seem to have the same positions on social issues. I think in a one on one race, the Florida governor may have done better than Haley against Trump in Charleston County. He's the most socially conservative politician in the country right now but was able to win Florida by 20 points.

I understand some people looked past Haley's refusal to say slavery was the reason for the Civil War. That includes many people in Charleston County. If you are going to present voting for Haley as a symbol for Charleston's culture, you got to include all of what Nikki Haley has said and done.

[IsNull]

You have no proof Democrats voted in the primary other than conspiracy theory. The primary broke for and against Trump exactly like it did prior. That and exit polling by numerous news organizations including Fox didn’t find any evidence of Democrats attempting to swing the vote.

Where is your evidence?

Socially Trump and Haley differ on how to approach abortion.

[LakeMan45]

Almost all of the "moderate" Republican politicians supported Trump over Haley. It's hard to say this race was a conservative vs moderate race, and make assertions about Charleston's culture on it. I think Florida's governor would have beat Haley in Charleston County or it would have been closer. He won Miami Dade county.

What is the difference between Trump and Haley on abortion? They both seem to be against heartbeat bills. I don't think she criticize the bill in Florida the harsh way Trump did.

There are still a good number of Republicans in SC who think Haley is a social conservative because of what she said as governor. There are many people who will vote for anybody other than DJT because they don't like his personality. It isn't policy based. My mother is like that.

I don't dispute there are more liberals in Charleston than Greenville, regardless of what party they claim. But the burbs in Charleston are like the burbs in Greenville. I've lived in both.

As I've pointed out, large corporations in Greenville have a liberal culture. People who work spend most of their time at work. Stuff happens in the Greenville community like the story hours that can't be described as a conservative. Culture is more than percentages of how people vote.

[LakeMan45]

Originally Posted by IsNull

I think most people quickly looked past the whole Civil War comment. I mean you had Trump out there claiming his mug shot and indictments appeal to Black voters and it didn't seem to hurt his numbers.

Think it is hard to compare an attempt at humor like that to a person oddly refusing to say slavery was the cause of the civil war. That is almost in same category as denying the Holocaust. That was the most a native SC person has made me cringe since the notorious Miss SC contestant a decade ago. There's no reason any Republican should run away from the slavery topic, ending slavery is the party's greatest achievement. The Florida governor pointed this out. She would have been destroyed in a general based on that comment alone.

His joke is based on the non-conservative premise that cops are tougher on black people. No social conservative could create a joke like that. The humor only works if you have a certain ideology or you want to pander to it. He's trying to connect with people who have those views. He's undermining the conservative "back the blue" position when he makes jokes like that.

in my view, this race was basically a choice between two 2003 era Democrats, and more about personality than policy.

[LakeMan45]

Originally Posted by IsNull

I feel Charleston has more Independents, moderate conservatives, and conservative Libertarians.
\.

Think it is hard to make a case Haley had a significant number of libertarians voting for her in Charleston. She has a hawkish foreign policy approach. Aggressive foreign policy is the thing that interests her, not domestic issues. Keep in mind it is aggressive foreign policy that hurt the GOP in 2008. It's hard to say it represents a moderate form of conservatism if aggressive foreign policy isn't popular. Trump's viability is in a large part due to him moderating the party on foreign policy.

She would not have had a libertarian approach to covid policy if she had been in power then. 'I don't associate her with the drug legalization movement.

People said Charleston rep Nancy Mace is a moderate but she was part of the cabal who kicked moderate McCarthy out of the speaker role, and he had campaigned for her. She seems to be all in on Trump. Trump is the Republican establishment now, based on who the establishment in SC and elsewhere endorsed. Haley couldn't even get an endorsement from Tim Scott and she selected Scott to replace Jim DeMint.

Charleston native Tim Scott must do well in Charleston given he is unbeatable in SC right now. There are some people who say he is far right, and he has a socially conservative reputation. He sounds like a preacher at times.

[IsNull]

My 80yo mother in the midlands who’s never supported a Dem in her life voted for Haley. She simply doesn’t like Trump. She feels he’s dim witted, a Christian charlatan, and acts like a bully not someone with the character of President. She did vote for him in the past.

I live in Charleston county and am pretty much Independent. Probably more conservative Libertarian in my views. I don’t feel a need to swear my fealty to either party. I voted for Haley on policy and disagree with your assessment.

My daughter in Columbia voted for Haley because she wants someone new and is past Trump and Biden. She also wants to see a woman President.

There are various reasons people vote. Sometimes it’s for something as often as it’s against something.

Exit polling showed Trump winning big with Evangelicals (up from 2016), rural, strongly conservative, and those without a college education. Haley won with moderates, independents, college educated.

[LakeMan45]

Nobody has suggested you have an obligation to vote for Trump or anybody else. I supported another candidate that dropped out. Yesterday was first time I have not voted in a primary.

My point is it is hard to characterize yesterday's primary as a traditional establishment "moderate" republican vs a conservative Republican, and then make assertions about the culture in Charleston vs culture in Greenville.

It is surprising anybody would want to associate Charleston with a person who would not say the reason for the civil war was slavery. It is one thing to strategically vote, another to make voting for that person a symbol for the culture of the community. Her statement gave life to the worst caricatures of people in SC. I don't think think anybody would look past it if a social conservative had said it, nor should they. I can't think of any prominent social conservative who would not answer the civil war question correctly. It is the perfect opportunity to sell the party and talk about Lincoln.

Perhaps she had not got enough sleep. I don't think she's a racist but that was horrible optics. It would have been exploited by the other side given their playbook. The image of SC would have been tarred and feathered this entire year if she got the nomination. People probably think our schools don't teach us the cause of the civil war.