Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I never said it's always been a fraud. I'm writing in the present tense. You read something into my thread title and first post that isn't there.
Quote:
Dear Texas Teachers:
I wanted to be a math teacher because I am good at explaining mathematical concepts to people, whether basic or advanced, and I enjoy working with young people. I was under the impression that math teachers are in high demand and that I would have no problem finding a job as a math teacher in junior high or high school.
I spent several hundred dollars on your tuition and state exam fees. I passed TExES math 4-8 and math 8-12. I applied to every school district in Tarrant County plus a few in Dallas County (e.g., Carrollton and Farmers Branch).
As part of my training, I spent a week at Trimble Tech High School in Ft Worth assisting in Algebra I and Algebra II. I greatly enjoyed my time there, and I looked forward to helping students learn, especially those from disadvantaged homes, which is the great majority of students who attend Trimble Tech. One of the students asked me if I was going to be back next week, and I was sorry to say that I wasn't.
I was very disappointed by the response I got from school districts. Crowley ISD was nice enough to send me a rejection letter while everyone else ignored me. I got one interview in Arlington ISD and no job offer or rejection letter.
I am writing you to let you know that I am very dissatisfied with your false claims. Essentially, your organization is a fraud. There were hundreds of people in your training seminar, all of whom were excited about making a positive difference in students' lives. Very few of them will actually be able to do that. The vast majority of your customers, like myself, will be disappointed and angry that they wasted time and money looking for teaching jobs that do not exist.
By making false claims that the alternative certification program and resume tips from an HR representative will result in a high likelihood of getting a job, especially in math and science, you are doing people a disservice and basically stealing their money.
I have spoken to several people on this subject, and I have informed them that the wild claims that certified teachers, especially in math and science, are difficult for schools to find, is a joke.
I am going to write my state representatives to ask them to shut down the alternative certification program on account of it being a fraud.
I would like for you to shut your doors because you are a fraud, and it makes no difference to schools since they will continue to hire people from universities with teaching certificates and student teaching experience.
The first bold makes the claim that they will NEVER be able to teach, or it sure sounds like it. Perhaps you should choose better wording?
The second bold, well, yeah. Please tell me you went to college. I haven't read through all of these posts due to sheer laziness to find out. And, you should have student teaching experience before working. If you have neither of these, I don't know what you're complaining about. Even without hiring freezes, it's expected that you have, at a minimum, the bolded. I mean, I wouldn't want someone with only a high school diploma teaching me algebra or calculus, because it's not likely they know how to apply it or how it logically works.
As someone else said, even with shortages, there are standards. There is a shortage of engineers and computer scientists willing to work in the field, but I would NOT hire someone who merely went through a course with no formal degree. They have to KNOW what they're doing, not just collect a check.
Perhaps the organization you wrote to is a fraud, but the general math/science teacher shortage is not.
The first bold makes the claim that they will NEVER be able to teach, or it sure sounds like it. Perhaps you should choose better wording?
Good grief, I didn't say NEVER! Read the words... it says "will not be able to", that's present tense.
Quote:
The second bold, well, yeah. Please tell me you went to college. I haven't read through all of these posts due to sheer laziness to find out. And, you should have student teaching experience before working. If you have neither of these, I don't know what you're complaining about. Even without hiring freezes, it's expected that you have, at a minimum, the bolded. I mean, I wouldn't want someone with only a high school diploma teaching me algebra or calculus, because it's not likely they know how to apply it or how it logically works.
As someone else said, even with shortages, there are standards. There is a shortage of engineers and computer scientists willing to work in the field, but I would NOT hire someone who merely went through a course with no formal degree. They have to KNOW what they're doing, not just collect a check.
Perhaps the organization you wrote to is a fraud, but the general math/science teacher shortage is not.
I don't have a teaching degree; that's why I paid Texas Teachers for the alternative certification. I do have a math degree, which is very helpful if one wishes to teach math.
Nooo, there is no MONEY. There is a shortage of math/science teachers, because of many factors. One, anyone who gets a degree in science/engineering can get a better paying job (even Wall St with their analytical skills). In this economy, though, they are more apt to take on a teaching role. However, RIGHT NOW, they are unable to hire many teachers because of limited capital. You can need/want these teachers all you want, but if you can't pay them, they won't work for you. Thus, you have no choice but to do without.
In normal conditions, however, hiring is more apt to take place and turnover is higher because of lower barriers of entry to other fields caused by positive aggregate hiring. There is also more capital available to districts to fulfill their needs.
Thus, the science/math teacher shortage is NOT a fraud based on your limited experience in this recession.
There has never been a shortage of elementary teachers even before the recession. I was told by my university that there was an elementary teacher shortage. I graduated in 2004 and had to fill out about 300 applications and move to Arizona before I could finally get a job. Now, I am trying to sub so I can get off unemployment but can't get called because there are hundreds of people trying to sub at the elementary level. Some schools have even told me that they are no longer accepting applications for substitute teachers.
Bottom line, anyone who is trying to choose a career SHOULD conduct their own investigation to see if their particular chosen career is in demand. Do not rely on colleges to give you accurate information because they want your money. For example, I am trying to switch to speech language pathology. Before I made this decision, I conducted my own research to find out if speech pathologists are having trouble finding or keeping work. I even spoke with a few speech pathologists in two different areas of the country. I also checked job listings to see if there were jobs posted on your basic career web sites.
I agree with many on this board. There was a teach shortage until the economy tanked and schools were forced to scale back their budgets. I have been told in the past that the fastest way for a school to but their budget is to cut teachers!! There are many schools who just increased the number of students per class (which is a travesty and disservice to students) and cut or froze teaching positions until they get their budgets back. I live in the Kansas City, MO area and 95% of districts are frozen and not hiring and/or actually laid off a bunch of teachers!! Once the economy is better, the teaching positions should open back up.
There has never been a shortage of elementary teachers even before the recession. I was told by my university that there was an elementary teacher shortage. I graduated in 2004 and had to fill out about 300 applications and move to Arizona before I could finally get a job. Now, I am trying to sub so I can get off unemployment but can't get called because there are hundreds of people trying to sub at the elementary level. Some schools have even told me that they are no longer accepting applications for substitute teachers.
Bottom line, anyone who is trying to choose a career SHOULD conduct their own investigation to see if their particular chosen career is in demand. Do not rely on colleges to give you accurate information because they want your money. For example, I am trying to switch to speech language pathology. Before I made this decision, I conducted my own research to find out if speech pathologists are having trouble finding or keeping work. I even spoke with a few speech pathologists in two different areas of the country. I also checked job listings to see if there were jobs posted on your basic career web sites.
I agree with your last statement of doing your own research. Schools are just trying to make money.
As for your first, where did you go to school or intend to live originally? Also, elementary, from what I hear, is where many head to after graduating, and there seems to be a lower turnover rate (it's easier to teach, they're less aggressive/mouthy than middle and high schoolers, etc... I noticed going through school that elementary school teachers didn't quit as much (my 1st grade teacher is STILL doing it), but in middle school, they seem less happy and there was more turnover, and in high school.. FORGET ABOUT IT! they dropped like flies). It also depends on the socioeconomic status of districts and other dynamics. The "hood" needs more teachers, and the South hires quickly because districts grow fast, whereas Northern cities are stable in population. I see you moved to Arizona, which has fast population growth. Our district grows by 2000 kids a year, and teachers get hired regularly. Science and math, at the secondary levels, though, are generally harder to fill (right now, major cut backs don't allow it) because science/math/engineering grads can make much more money in the private sector starting out. Many are also less social (it's a stereotype, but it is true for many in these fields). Getting up to teach everyday would be very hard.
Oh I agree, and one of the most important standards is to be certified. If it weren't for NCLB, there wouldn't be a shortage of any teachers in a particular subject matter because anyone can read out of the teacher's book while having no idea what he's talking about.
If there's a shortage and you stink at teaching or interviewing to be a teacher, you'll still get plenty of interviews but no job offers. When the number of interviews in three months can be counted on one hand after having blown off four fingers in a fireworks party, it means there is no shortage.
You can't seriously think that NCLB has ensured that teachers are decent (or even capable). I work every single day with teachers who don't know ****.
As the human race continues to devolve in a downward spiral of stupidity and psychosis, the only expanding jobs in teaching will continue to be in Special Education.
Teacher supply/demand has and still is a local equation. Inner city schools will have more issues and wealthy suburban schools less overall. Many who say they can't find a job are also being selective where they apply or are willing to live. The current economy has created a much tighter job market but districts still want to hire the top tier of applicants . It is their ability to weed out the lower echelons of those teaching that is the challenge.
Teacher supply/demand has and still is a local equation. Inner city schools will have more issues and wealthy suburban schools less overall. Many who say they can't find a job are also being selective where they apply or are willing to live. The current economy has created a much tighter job market but districts still want to hire the top tier of applicants . It is their ability to weed out the lower echelons of those teaching that is the challenge.
Problem is that's not what they're doing. You don't have to be the best to get the job. You have to know the right people or have flexible certifications. If they were after the best, people like me who come into the teaching profession with professional degrees in the subjects they teach and many years of experience actually using what they learned would be in high demand. We're in lowest demand. They don't go after top tier at all. They hire the cheaptest candidate they like. If they hired top tier, masters degrees would help teachers get jobs. Reality is they hurt. Ditto for being a subject matter expert, that hurts too because you can only teach the subjects you're an expert at.
I sent my resume and work history to the state board of education and explained that I cannot find work and they were appalled. I explained that posting after posting insists on general science certs over subject matter expert certs. They agreed that that is my issue. Unfortunately, Michigan doens't intend on doing anything to force schools to hire subject matter experts so we'll continue to flounder until we stumble into a position or leave the profession.
I have heard that other states require subject matter expertise to teach higher science courses (Someone said Pennsylvania does but I haven't checked it out). I may leave for another state as soon as my kids are through school.
I WISH they hired top tier. I'm in it. We're the ones who are struggling the most. I have a masters degree in chemical engineering and a master of arts in teaching with a near 4.0 (One A-), I have a exemplary work history, wonderful letters of recommendation, subject matter expert certs in three subjects and I can't buy an interview let alone land a job....Well, maybe I can, I haven't tried that one yet.
The last time I interviewed in a district, the principal stood up half way through the interview and said "Those are the best answers I've heard all day and you're the 14th candidate". When I didn't even get invited back to teach a lesson, I asked them what I could have done differently. They said "Nothing". The candidate they hired was a graduate of the school. It didn't matter that I have all the bells and whistles.
You're kidding yourself if you think schools pick top tier. They pick who they like and they choose from people who have generalist certs because they can put them where they like.
And the inner city schools are laying off here so it's not a matter of being picky, unless you count not wanting to work for low paying charter schools as being picky. I don't consider the job I have a real job. This is a temporary assignment until I can find a real job.
Ivory, you live in Michigan. If I'm not mistaken, Michigan's economy has been **** poor for a long time, people have left the state in droves, and they have cut back on any staff in all levels of government because it's not affordable. I would say "move the hell out of dodge," but you said you have kids. Anyway, I think it's bad to use your personal experience to make a judgement call for the entire market in normal conditions, when your state has been in recession far longer than the rest of the country, and conditions there are not the norm. As I said in a previous post, many of the rustbelt states are more slow to hire because of their economies. If you come down here to the South, it's a whole new story. The district we live in, for example, usually hires about 500-1200 teachers a year (depending on enrollment) because we can't get enough. This year, they "froze" hiring, but still added 300 teachers. They tend to prefer Masters degrees, as well. In science, they like you to have both general AND specialized certs. The general is for regular classes, and specialized is for AP courses (you have to get AP certified, but they pay for it here). The starting pay is pretty good, too, at about 45-50K for first timers, depending on education and other factors. It's due to the population explosion here. Also, I've heard that the state (GA) wants to make teachers get specialized certs due to new education standards. IDK if it's true or not, but I remember hearing some teachers complain about it. So, there may be some hope for you after all (just get those kids through school and leave MI)!
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Shortage
