Tech workers now doubting decision to move from California to Texas (Houston: real estate market, lease)

[wac_432]

Originally Posted by ohio_peasant

Most of these concerns speak to start-ups and Google/Apple type of companies. Imagine in contrast that you're an electrical engineer for Northrop-Grumman in El Segundo, or a materials engineer in Lockheed-Martin in Palmdale. You're probably middle-aged, have school-aged children, and your social life consists of kids' activities, maybe church, maybe golf. You couldn't even find Muir Woods on a map, confuse Mt. Whitney with Mt. McKinley, and think that Golden Gate is a Chinese restaurant in Alhambra. Such a person would probably welcome a relocation to Austin, as it means a bigger house, more golf courses and more Sunday-school choices for the kids. In fact, even Austin might be too... "weird"... better would be Ft. Worth, or Huntsville (Alabama).

Maybe, but the topic is: "Tech workers who regret moving to Texas" not "Mid-career Engineers Longing for more Golf and Church". I simply paraphrased the article, and said I see where it is coming from.

I agree that 40/50-something cogs might like to move from Palmdale to Waco.

[apple92680]

Originally Posted by ohio_peasant

What are the operative factors? Is it the weather? The culture? The lack of ethnic restaurants? Or are folks just missing the "vibe" of their former home?

It's all of that, really.

Something that tech companies really value and capitalize on is serendipity, or chance encounters that occur at the right place and right time between the right individuals and right groups of people. To foster an environment where serendipity is not only possible but continuous, you need lots of creativity and inspiration, a plethora of natural scenery and a place that promotes dreams and sees them to reality. So, a pleasant climate, pleasant scenery and pleasant workforce is key to innovation.

California is really special in being able to cultivate that, and it's hard to replicate elsewhere. Texas doesn't foster creativity. Try as it may, Austin is no San Jose, much less San Francisco. Scenically and culturally, I'd argue that even Sacramento has a leg up on Austin.

Austin swelters in heat and humidity a large part of the year. It is 4-5 hours to drive to a beach on the Gulf of Mexico. The few recreational spots around Austin such as Barton Springs and Lake Travis are constantly jam-packed. The "Hill Country", although beautiful in its own right, is nothing compared to the Sierra Foothills, Big Sur, Napa Valley or the Marin Headlands.

And then there is that Texas provincialism that everyone must contend with. It gets very redundant and obnoxious after awhile.

[apple92680]

Originally Posted by ohio_peasant

Most of these concerns speak to start-ups and Google/Apple type of companies. Imagine in contrast that you're an electrical engineer for Northrop-Grumman in El Segundo, or a materials engineer in Lockheed-Martin in Palmdale. You're probably middle-aged, have school-aged children, and your social life consists of kids' activities, maybe church, maybe golf. You couldn't even find Muir Woods on a map, confuse Mt. Whitney with Mt. McKinley, and think that Golden Gate is a Chinese restaurant in Alhambra. Such a person would probably welcome a relocation to Austin, as it means a bigger house, more golf courses and more Sunday-school choices for the kids. In fact, even Austin might be too... "weird"... better would be Ft. Worth, or Huntsville (Alabama).

Wow! Nice dump you took on So Cal...

You don't have a very high opinion of electrical engineers or materials engineers, apparently? What makes you think they are all that dumb?

I live in Palmdale and I have an engineer neighbor who retired from JPL in Pasadena. He now teaches computer science and engineering courses at the local community college part-time. He's an absolutely brilliant man! His son is also an engineer at Dryden on EAFB and neither of them have a desire to relocate to Texas or Alabama.

[ohio_peasant]

Originally Posted by apple92680

Wow! Nice dump you took on So Cal...

You don't have a very high opinion of electrical engineers or materials engineers, apparently? What makes you think they are all that dumb?

Something must have been lost in translation, to put it mildly. I live and work in the area. Aeronautical engineering.

First, "tech" =/= software development. The Palmdale and El Segundo example are tech workers too. Let's not lose sight of that.

Second, most people live humdrum lives. Serendipitous interaction and critical mass matter... critically. But access to the Pacific surf or to the Sierras...? I wonder: what percentage of tech workers in Palo Alto, or even Sacramento, have never been to Yosemite or Sequoia? Probably the majority. That those natural wonders are nearby, is... of marginal relevance. In a similar way, probably the majority of Wall Street "quants" have never been to the Metropolitan Museum of Art, or saw a concert in Carnegie Hall. Would their lives really be diminished, if they moved from New York City to Peoria?

Texas is middle-America, with the manifest disadvantages of middle-America. It's much like Ohio, from which I escaped. But here's a funny thing: when I lived in Ohio, and took business-trips to visit various colleagues, in DC, San Diego, Seattle and the like... it was a common refrain, among middle-aged parents in particular, that they'd be thrilled to relocate to the Midwest. Why? I was baffled! Answer: "Because it's a lower-cost and more wholesome place to raise a family".

[tikkasf]

Originally Posted by ohio_peasant

Something must have been lost in translation, to put it mildly. I live and work in the area. Aeronautical engineering.

First, "tech" =/= software development. The Palmdale and El Segundo example are tech workers too. Let's not lose sight of that.

Second, most people live humdrum lives. Serendipitous interaction and critical mass matter... critically. But access to the Pacific surf or to the Sierras...? I wonder: what percentage of tech workers in Palo Alto, or even Sacramento, have never been to Yosemite or Sequoia? Probably the majority. That those natural wonders are nearby, is... of marginal relevance. In a similar way, probably the majority of Wall Street "quants" have never been to the Metropolitan Museum of Art, or saw a concert in Carnegie Hall. Would their lives really be diminished, if they moved from New York City to Peoria?

Texas is middle-America, with the manifest disadvantages of middle-America. It's much like Ohio, from which I escaped. But here's a funny thing: when I lived in Ohio, and took business-trips to visit various colleagues, in DC, San Diego, Seattle and the like... it was a common refrain, among middle-aged parents in particular, that they'd be thrilled to relocate to the Midwest. Why? I was baffled! Answer: "Because it's a lower-cost and more wholesome place to raise a family".

It's a good thing I think (going by what you posted) that there are those who think areas like the Midwest are perhaps a more desirable place to live. The supposed lower costs are not a surprise.....specially when it comes to housing. What really matters is if you are happy where you live....whether it is in CA or somewhere in middle -America

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by ohio_peasant

most people live humdrum lives.

Speak for yourself.

Originally Posted by ohio_peasant

when I lived in Ohio, and took business-trips to visit various colleagues, in DC, San Diego, Seattle and the like... it was a common refrain, among middle-aged parents in particular, that they'd be thrilled to relocate to the Midwest.

Interesting. I've never met a couple in California who would be thrilled to relocate to the Midwest. Going along with it because one or the other had to relocate due to a job, yes.

[vunderbar]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

I've never met a couple in California who would be thrilled to relocate to the Midwest. Going along with it because one or the other had to relocate due to a job, yes.

The head of a recruiting company that places American teachers in American schools overseas says he does most of his recruiting in the mid-west... says those people are happy to leave... where as Californians tend to say, thanks... but no thanks. I like it where I am just fine.

[Du Ma]

Originally Posted by vunderbar

Austin is OK. But it's friggin surrounded by Texas. if you're at all progressive - or a female - it's a horrible place to be.

you mean females in conservative cities/states don't have to share a restroom with "woman" named Kaitlyn with full a beard and a visible adam's apple and pee standing up?

yeah, it's horrible indeed

[blameyourself]

Originally Posted by Du Ma

you mean females in conservative cities/states don't have to share a restroom with "woman" named Kaitlyn with full a beard and a visible adam's apple and pee standing up?

yeah, it's horrible indeed

Sure, because conservatives tend to clutch their pearls if they have to share a common sink with someone from the LGBTQIA community.

Clearly you're not familiar with how these shared facilities are constructed. But do go on with your nonsensical talking point.

[Du Ma]

Originally Posted by blameyourself

Sure, because conservatives tend to clutch their pearls if they have to share a common sink with someone from the LGBTQIA community.

Clearly you're not familiar with how these shared facilities are constructed. But do go on with your nonsensical talking point.

What facilities you speak of? I live in Los Angeles. There is no special facilities for transmen because they are using women’s restroom

But feel free to go on with your nonsensical talking point