Why does Thorncliffe Park get such a bad rep? (2013, apartments)

[Marissa23]

I lived in Toronto for one year (2010-2011) and rented an apartment in Thorncliffe Park. I couldn't afford to rent an apartment downtown and didn't want to lease a car, and so I was looking for an area that was well served by public transit and was fairly close to downtown. A couple of people suggested that area and said that it wasn't as bad as some people made it out to be, and that most of the apartments were some of the most spacious in the city. I wound up renting a one bedroom it one of the 20-story buildings.

The apartment was very big and had great views. The lobby and the hallways were passable, but obviously nothing fancy. What I liked about the neighborhood:

- a huge park with walking and cycling trails
- a baseball field and adjacent tennis club and pool
- an O.K. mall
- 15-20-minute walk to either upscale Bayview avenue restaurants and shops or stores on Laird


Now, shortly after I moved in, I found a lot of articles online about how the area is "not so good" mainly because it has a high population density. Yes, it does have a lot of people living in one street. However, this is what you find in most major cities around the world. It seemed safe. While I was there, I didn't hear of major crimes taking place, like sometimes in Scarborough or parts of West End.

So, why is this area considered one of the worst in the city? It's certainly a notch above the adjacent areas like Flemingdon Park or Pape/Cosburn across the highway bridge, and some of the other high-rise areas. I hope this doesn't sound like I'm advertising that area. It's just that I don't understand how it can be considered a "rough area".

P.S. I'm from Maryland.

[a_jordania]

Thorncliffe Park isn't even really in the top 10 of most dangerous neighbourhoods in TO. I don't want to trivialize it, but stuff like this can happen:

Shooting in Thorncliffe Park sends 2 males to hospital - Toronto - CBC News

[canadian citizen]

When the old Shorncliffe Park race course was torn down in the 1960's, the area was developed as a really nice place , with a combination of new high rise apartment buildings, with an industrial area just to the north. It was considered a nice place to live THEN.

Over the years, the complexion ( and I do mean the skin colour ) of the area changed, drastically. The apartment buildings became high rise ghettos, with multiple families jammed into two bedroom suites.

Now the area is home to a very high percentage of recent immigrants, and the local schools are just about 100 percent "visible minority " students. The newest school to be opened is the largest Kindergarden ONLY school in Canada, with seven hundred kids in it. Imagine that, a school that is ONLY for five year olds, and they have it filled to the brim, in it's first year of operation.

This is a part of Toronto that has many problems, mostly due to immigration, and the huge numbers of kids that immigrant families seem to have. The population density is amazing.

You couldn't pay me to live there, and thankfully, I don't have to.

Jim B

Toronto.

[Average Fruit]

Jim summed it up, basically it has a bad rep because of the lack of white people. Now if Thorncliffe park was 80% white and everything was still the same, it wouldn't be consider a ghetto, just "gritty" and the people would be consider "blue collar", and the crime problem would be describe as " little rough"

[katzpaw]

I believe it depends which building you are in. 79 Thorncliffe is Toronto's #1 building for complaints, but an investigations manager with the city’s licensing and standards division says the problems are typical of buildings that size and 79 is not the worst building he's seen. Its just the top for complaints.

"The grim dirt-grey exterior of 79 Thorncliffe Park Dr., with its dilapidated balconies and drooping electrical wiring, only hints at the problems within. Cockroaches, poor ventilation and plumbing problems topped the list of concerns for the apartment tower that have made it the most complained-about residential property in Toronto this year. “There’s water leaking through the ceilings, and there are cockroaches and mice everywhere,” says Abbas Kolia, the president of the tenants association."

Toronto’s top apartment building for complaints: 79 Thorncliffe Park | Toronto Star

[mrjun18]

Originally Posted by Average Fruit

Jim summed it up, basically it has a bad rep because of the lack of white people. Now if Thorncliffe park was 80% white and everything was still the same, it wouldn't be consider a ghetto, just "gritty" and the people would be consider "blue collar", and the crime problem would be describe as " little rough"

This.

[Marissa23]

I didn't live in 79. Actually, I was told that I should avoid it at all costs. I saw five apartments before renting mine and they were bigger and the rent was less than the ones I later saw in Davisville and High Park. Shortly after moving in, I realized that some people didn't like the area because most of the residents were ethnic minorities. That's just racist. I had friendly neighbors. Initially, I wanted to rent an apartment in one of the 40-story buildings, however it was out of my price range. And that's another thing. A so-called bad area won't have luxury rental buildings. Also, I remember it had a nice beige brick condo, a townhouse complex and a loft condo building overlooking the tennis club. To sum it up, I've seen worse city neighborhoods in North America and Europe.

[canadian citizen]

Marissa:

You are entitled to your opinion.... But the people who were born in Toronto, and who are realists, know that Toronto is now a half and half city, with half of it "old Canadians " and the other half are "New Canadians " who were born somewhere else in the world. Where would you suggest we live ?

I grew up in a Toronto that was very much British, and where speaking English, with out an accent was the norm. So did hundreds of thousands of others. Now, we are a minority, in our own city, made to feel like outcasts. Is it any wonder that we reject certain neighbourhoods, where we are outnumbered by the "New Canadians " ? If I am going to own a house here, it will be in a part of the city where I am comfortable. That was what I mean when I said.... "thank goodness I don't have to live in Thorncliffe Park.

I may have to put up with being crushed and stepped on while riding on the TTC, but at least I have a choice about where I live, and who I live next to.

Jim B.

Toronto.

[Average Fruit]

Originally Posted by canadian citizen

Marissa:

You are entitled to your opinion.... But the people who were born in Toronto, and who are realists, know that Toronto is now a half and half city, with half of it "old Canadians " and the other half are "New Canadians " who were born somewhere else in the world. Where would you suggest we live ?

I grew up in a Toronto that was very much British, and where speaking English, with out an accent was the norm. So did hundreds of thousands of others. Now, we are a minority, in our own city, made to feel like outcasts. Is it any wonder that we reject certain neighbourhoods, where we are outnumbered by the "New Canadians " ? If I am going to own a house here, it will be in a part of the city where I am comfortable. That was what I mean when I said.... "thank goodness I don't have to live in Thorncliffe Park.

I may have to put up with being crushed and stepped on while riding on the TTC, but at least I have a choice about where I live, and who I live next to.

Jim B.

Toronto.

You're a minority in your own city, boo hoo . Cry me a river! I've been a minority in this city (and this country) since the day I was born. If I could survive, so can you.

[canadian citizen]

Thanks for your sarcastic response. It was really helpful. Not.
Jim B

Toronto.