Create your own transportation system! (metro, largest, suburban, highway)

[hensleya1]

Hi all--

This thread is largely inspired by (and possibly an extension of) Create you own city!

You can do this in one of two ways (or both):

1) Create your own fictional city. If so, I suggest using the following rubric:

City name:
City population:
Metro population:
Average income:
Climate:
Major zones (residential, commercial, etc.):
Major geographical features:
Major roads and highways:
Transit options:


2) Improve upon an existing city. In doing so, give us an accurate description and as many details as necessary. Try to explain how you'll get the money for it, too. Maps and graphics are even better.

[hensleya1]

I'll start us off by doing both.

Creating a fictional city:
City name: New Bethel
City population: 400,000
Metro population: 1,500,000
Average income: 45,000
Climate: Temperate but sometimes unpredictable, think Midwest
Major zones (residential, commercial, etc.): Downtown is anchored by a ten-block or so central business district with high-rise office towers, parking lots, and city administration buildings. The State and Federal governments would have a presence, too (think of a Federal building). Thinking maybe half a dozen buildings in the 600 foot range, another 20 between 300 and 500 feet, with the rest being somewhat lower. A river snakes its way around, marking the western and northern boundaries of the CBD. Along this riverfront is a large park, a stadium, and convention center. To encourage investment downtown, there is an income tax break for anyone who lives or works within a ten-block radius of the city center (measured by an intersection of Main Street and a large monument to war heroes of days past).

The inner circle, out to a two mile radius, is mostly older housing stock, mixed in with small businesses. The houses are in varying states of rehabilitation, but generally improving. At the two mile mark is more business, hotels, etc. There is some industry in the area - manufacturing mostly, in addition to some higher-tech stuff.

At the two-mile mark is a large circle freeway, at least four lanes in each direction (more on this later). Near an exit or two is a large mixed-use shopping center, with largely apartments and single-family homes further out. Generally, outside of the freeway is outside of city limits, and getting into suburbs and unincorporated areas - but contributing to the large population of the metro area.

Major geographical features: A medium-sized river runs generally from northeast to south/southwest, with a few creeks intermittently. Generally flat to the north and west, hillier to the south and southeast.

Major roads and highways: We're assuming that a freeway was built through here at some point - for now, let's say it runs from north to south. There would be both local and express lanes, with at least 3 thru lanes in each direction for local traffic, in addition to 2 express lanes, elevated in the middle, for thru traffic (trucks, etc.) and would have no exits within the inner circle. Something like this:



All of this is, of course, intended to be a freeway system large enough to avoid any traffic tieups that we currently face. The 'inner ring' I talk about would not enter downtown itself, but rather be roughly a 16-mile long inner belt, with at least 6 thru lanes at all times - 3 in each direction, with additional space for entrance and exit ramps.

Transit options: At major surface streets leading to the city center, give buses the right-of-way for 'express lanes' in the center of each major road - in addition to 2-3 lanes for cars in each direction. Sort of like what Curitiba did back in the 70's:



This would extend at a minimum out to the innerbelt, preferably an additional 2-3 miles in any direction. There would be a total of six spokes to the 'wheel'. To improve thoroughput, there would be a large multi-level transit center in the middle of downtown, and the buses would simply drive straight through rather than turn around until they reaches the far other end of the city - north to south, east to west, and then back again. Since it would be in the middle of downtown, it would be a viable option for pretty much anyone who lived in the suburbs and worked there.

Only one route - lets say north to south - would be at ground level. The west-east line would drive up a short ramp to the second floor, and the boarding platform is there - just take the stairs to get back to ground level.

Even better: electrify the lines and turn them into trolley buses, like what many cities used to have.

I doubt a metro area of 1.5 million would be enough to justify a subway system, though. Besides. what I've just come up with is probably far, far more car-friendly than what anyone else will do.

[hensleya1]

And second, I'll improve an existing city: Cincinnati.



1) Break up the power of the public employees' unions permanently by revoking their right to collectively bargain. Renegotiate public pay and especially pensions, because they are absolutely killing the city.

2) In black, cancel the streetcar line that runs from nowhere to nowhere and that nobody would ride. It's one of the most asinine ideas ever invented and is a waste of $100 million that the city quite frankly can't afford to waste at this juncture.

3) Take the $100 million and immediately lobby both the State and Federal governments for matching funds to build some much-needed improvements among the city's highways. First priority is improving I-75.

3a) I-75 must be widened to four lanes in each direction between I-74 downtown and I-275 in Sharonville. Create a new ramp (Exit 4A?) and exit to Cincinnati State (which is near the I-74 interchange), which would likely dump directly onto Central Parkway. This would also improve access to UC, which would be a short trip up Ludlow Avenue.

3b) Likewise with I-71, which needs four lanes between the Norwood Lateral and I-275. Arguably, it needs more lanes even further out, to serve the growing areas in Warren County.

3c) In blue, build a new bridge across the Ohio River to replace the aging Brent Spence bridge - 6 lanes in each direction. This would require demolition of the old B&O building and the houses near Gest St. in Cincinnati in addition to anything on Crescent Avenue in Covington north of Pike Street. Also may require reconstruction of the 6th St. viaduct to build around the new ramp and bridge. In relation to this, improve I-71/75 in Kentucky to 5 lanes northbound from its current 3: the 6th lane on the bridge would be cars entering from 5th St. in Covington as they do now. After demolition of the old bridge, this would probably open up another 2-3 blocks of area for development (see below).

3d) Tell those guys in Indian Hill to lump it - the cross county highway's going to be extended to the east from its current end near I-71 all the way to 275 near Milford.

4) Create a 'special economic zone' - denoted by the brown line. Cut in half Cincinnati's income tax (currently 2.1%) to 1.05% if you live or work within the special economic zone. This would run roughly along the current I-75 route, north to McMicken Street/Liberty Street, east to include Mount Adams, and then follow the river, including both downtown and Over-the-Rhine. The goal is to encourage investment downtown instead of West Chester, or at least slow down the trend. Also it would probably accelerate construction at The Banks, which would be excellent.

[nei]

I don't want to hijack your thread and I'm unfamiliar with Cinncinati, but as to building more highways instead of transit, hasn't the vast bulk of transportation spending in Cinncinati already been on highways anyway? If the streetcar is inefficient, why not use the money a different way to help center city transit (maybe similar to that bus system you described). I find it hard to believe the traffic can be all that bad as the center city has declined and the metro population not increased. If you want to see highways with issues, I suggest going to east coast metros (or Chicago). In Long Island, a few of the highway have extremely short entranceways that require slamming on the accelerator. During rush hour, the entranceways have lights. One city expressway (BQE) has a speed limit of 45 mph (for good reason) with exits coming from unpredictable directions. Sometimes in the middle of the day it's clear, but it can jam at midnight.

It looks like a substantial amount of highways have already built through the city center of Cinncinati, probably demolishing a lot of the old buildings and harming downtown. Widening highways in the outer metro will make encourage more development in the outer suburbs. Since the metro has 0 population growth, new outer development will occur at the expense of older inner suburbs / center city. Perhaps that's what people want, but I think it's senseless to use funds to further decay of old neighborhoods.

Now making my city...

[hensleya1]

Originally Posted by nei

I don't want to hijack your thread and I'm unfamiliar with Cinncinati, but as to building more highways instead of transit, hasn't the vast bulk of transportation spending in Cinncinati already been on highways anyway? If the streetcar is inefficient, why not use the money a different way to help center city transit (maybe similar to that bus system you described). I find it hard to believe the traffic can be all that bad as the center city has declined and the metro population not increased. If you want to see highways with issues, I suggest going to east coast metros (or Chicago). In Long Island, a few of the highway have extremely short entranceways that require slamming on the accelerator. During rush hour, the entranceways have lights. One city expressway (BQE) has a speed limit of 45 mph (for good reason) with exits coming from unpredictable directions. Sometimes in the middle of the day it's clear, but it can jam at midnight.

It looks like a substantial amount of highways have already built through the city center of Cinncinati, probably demolishing a lot of the old buildings and harming downtown. Widening highways in the outer metro will make encourage more development in the outer suburbs. Since the metro has 0 population growth, new outer development will occur at the expense of older inner suburbs / center city. Perhaps that's what people want, but I think it's senseless to use funds to further decay of old neighborhoods.

Now making my city...

Hi nei--

I'll try to address and reply to all the concerns you pointed out (without allowing us to veer too far off topic, of course). My number one concern with the streetcar is a matter of cost-benefit. If you were to extend the streetcar line to the (unused) Riverfront Transit Center and move SORTA/TANK stops to there as well, then it may improve somewhat. Even then, there simply isn't enough traffic between downtown and OTR to justify spending $100+ million unless The Banks picks up steam and you see some more development in Covington and Newport to increase the population and business near the riverfront. Even then it's still debatable - you would have to extend the streetcar line up into CUF and have a few stops near UC/Clifton to get a bunch of traffic - and the money for that simply isn't there, because the State pulled funding for it.

On the other hand, for $100 million you could easily go a long way towards acquiring the right-of-way and building a fourth lane on I-75 between I-74 and Sharonville, especially since the state and Federal government would likely chip in, given how important of a north-south route I-75 is. The right of way acquisition in the Mitchell Avenue area would be easy; Norwood would be a bit dicier, and you may need to build a second viaduct over Lockland and reroute traffic around the old canyon completely - I don't think a fourth lane would fit in there. But past the GE plant would be fine if they fixed the Neumann Way exits. From there on out to Sharonville, which opens up considerably with a wide median, just use part of the median to build said fourth lane.

IIRC the metro area grew at 8-9% as of the last Census? Even though the city proper is still being gutted, it is more than offset by explosive growth along I-71 and 75 in Lebanon, Mason, Montgomery, Fairfield, etc. There's still more development out towards Liberty Way, Hamilton, Middletown, and on up towards Dayton - I think it's only a matter of 10 years before they combine Cincinnati-Dayton into one MSA, not unlike in NE Ohio. Mercifully, I-75 has been expanded to four lanes already between I-275 in Cincinnati and the Montgomery County line near Dayton - and guess what, no traffic snarls.

I won't dispute that Cincinnati at rush hour, while bad, isn't nearly as bad as any of the larger cities on the coasts. But unlike the cities on the coasts, there is (at least theoretically) the money and the ability to solve the traffic snarls at rush hour. We can go on and on about the merits and pitfalls of suburbanization, but I'm making the tacit concession that people will continue to want to live in the suburbs. And AFAIK Cincinnati has more Fortune 500 companies than any other city its size (and even many larger cities?) so people will still need to commute downtown. No point in wasting many hours a year sitting in traffic, burning up gas, emissions, time, etc if something can be done about it. I regularly drive between Cincy and Dayton and I've spent more than my share of time in traffic tieups along I-75, fuming about why Mark Mallory is spending all the money he has on a streetcar in OTR when thousands of cars and trucks are standing still on the highway.

With regards to my bus idea, I wonder how effective that would be given that Cincinnati is much more spread out than my theoretical design? Currently, Cincinnati's Metro only goes out (roughly) to the Hamilton/Butler County line, with the suburbs beyond that unserved. Given how spread out the suburbs are, you would need some sort of park and ride initiative, but I still see it being a hard sell.

I guess this is the problem of applying all these transit solution ideas to real-world cities - something goes horridly wrong (usually the city not having the money to implement it)

[Caesarstl]

^ I think your goals and methods will probably end up working against each other though... The less traffic there is the more likely people will keep sprawling away from the city center. Also, how much money will be lost by the city just cutting in half income tax in your box?

[Marius Pontmercy]

Everyone shut up.

Pneumatic f'ing tubes.



Your arguments are all invalid.

You can all go home now.

[Chriscross309]

I'll make up a city

St. Chris
city proper---350,000
metro---800,000
location--- Republic of Vondel (shares island of Cuba with Cuba)
climate--- tropical
terrain--- along coast, flat with roolling hills further inland
founded--- 1642 by Spanish, refounded by English is 1713

History--- St Chris was an early Spanish military port and trade center. The Spanish gave the English the land in exchange for trade rights in parts of South America. The region (about the size of CT) was an English colony until 1820 when the freedom fighters defeated the British for their independence. St Chris was the sight of the winning battle. The city of Barton (50 miles Northeast) was the first capital, but in 1940 it was moved to the new city of Chesterton. Vondel has a very strong relationship with the US, and is considered the 51st state although it is its own country. Vondel is much like a blend between Florida and England. The city of St. Chris is a major cultural hub for the country, and is home to the Church of Vodel (Baptist). The city is considered the Rome of the West, and is a boasts world class architecture in both historic and modern buildings.

About City--- St Chris has a major canal system which connects every important part of the city together. The canals allow for water transportation and create an atmosphere that is unique to this city alone. The city is seen as an art community, but is also known for its world class parks and transportation network. The skyline is not a towering one, but its buildings are top notch. Because of the canals, the city is divided into numerous islands, that are all connected by boat taxi and bridges.

Transportation Network

The city offers several major forms of transportation which connects everything together.

Rail--- The rail system is the most used in the city because it not only connects the city with its suburbs, but with other citys in the country aswell. Two major train stations act as hubs for all other forms of transportation. The rail line goes underground and services more urban areas of the city aswell, but is not considered a subway.
It also connects into the airport.

UNIT system--- The Univeral Network of Inter-community Transportation or UNIT is a PRT system that is the largest in the world. It connects the city together using elevated rail, and has dozens of terminals for user convienience. The UNIT system allows a passenger to select a location using a touch screen map, and the UNIT will take them there. It also connects to the airport, and to major venues like the convention center, football stadium, train stations, museums, hospitals, and tourism districts.

Highway system--- Not anything off the walls, but the city planned ahead for the future, and all roads and interstates are build to be expanded. There are two toll express lanes going through the city which allow drivers to drive faster for a certain toll. The suburban roads are built to be expanded aswell.

Bus System--- Bus stops are located at UNIT and Train stations, aswell as in high foot traffic areas. The Bus system is more focoused on local travel, and not cross-city transportation.

Trail System--- The city boasts possibly the world's best trail system with miles upon miles of paved and rubber surface walking and biking paths. The trails are so good that they link into parks, shopping centers, museums, schools, and even Cuba. The trail sysyem connects into other trails which run into the capital city of Chesterton.

Saint Chris International Airport--- Built in 2011, the airport is one of the nicest in the World. It isn't a major hub because the country boasts two other major airports, but it is large enough for the demand. The airport was built on a man made island out from the city, and it is connected by highway, rail, and UNIT. The island and building were built for expansion, but likely will never seen it.

Canal Express--- Is a water taxi service that connects people to the different parts of the city using boat. This is mainly a tourist service, but locals use it aswell.

Well, there you go! I'll probably do another one soon.