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Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug1245
Thanks so much ... Most retired folks in the neighborhood move out of the Bay Area to cash out of their homes. Buy something cheaper and free up money. ...
Thanks to everyone for the great information and insights.
I worked with thousands of CA transplants (from Bay area). The 'smartest' (?) retained their CA properties and are now enjoying Prop 13 benefits in retirement. So keep summer homes in White Salmon or Hood River or on Oregon coast, nearly all returned to CA, or went where CA's go to retire (AZ, NV, CO, ID, MT, WY)
A few stuck around PNW due to kids / family staying, and those who had sold their CA homes could not afford to return.
Portland should be fine for what you are looking for, I would look for places near a park, / recreation center, and near MAX or the trolley / street car. I enjoy volunteering in Portland Parks, and attending academic talks / music events at the the many colleges (Reed College at the moment (through mid July) for CMNW.org) Works out well with volunteer time at Crystal Springs Garden. (across the street from Reed performance hall).
Taxes are gonna hurt compared to WA, but probably you can get by with 5-6% in effective state rate (after you deduct Fed Taxes).
That is interesting StealthRabbit. Are you saying most of the transplants from Ca that you worked with ended up going back to Ca full time? Or simply ended up splitting their time between Ca and the PNW? I had not heard of that. Most of the people I know who have left the Bay Area in recent years have not returned and have no desire to do so. A few went to the PNW and others to Az, TN, NM and NV.
That said, the selling the home thing is true. Once you sell in the BA and leave for a number of years you can't afford to move back. That has been true for a long time. In my case I would not sell as the gain would be huge, even with the exclusion, and I'd owe hundreds of thousands in capital gain taxes.
The idea of a "second home" in the PWN makes sense. That or spending several months there renting an AirB&B unit - but that would get pricey at $150 plus a day. The second home idea is tougher in Portland but as long as there is a transit line nearby with access to downtown, it does not have to be Portland. I've been glancing at Zillow and realtor.com and communities surrounding Portland (some) are noticeably less expensive. There is a lot to do and see in the downtown area but living a relatively short distance away in a quiet neighborhood of smaller homes is appealing.
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
34,705 posts, read 58,031,425 times
Reputation: 46172
My contacts are with previous co-workers who retained their CA props while working other locations (Including overseas).
When they Retired (after living in other areas for 5 - 30 yrs) they Retired back to CA. (Often to enjoy the benefit of their retained Prop 13 Propety tax (+ weather and activities)
(You have likely been surveying Retirees / very different objectives.)
If retired... and desiring a income tax benefit... Keep looking in WA, or get a SD (very ez... one overnight / lifetime!!!) / or... AK / TN / NH domicile
Not sure how the Prop 13 works for PT homes, BUT... consider your whole financial pic.
In Portland... look to areas around Jennings Lodge (SE Portland). Not trendy yet, lower cost, variety of homes, ez Public Transit
Vancouver, WA... I would stay as Close to Ft Vancouver as possible (Crosley Bowl...)
Last edited by StealthRabbit; 06-17-2018 at 08:16 PM..
The idea of a "second home" in the PWN makes sense. That or spending several months there renting an AirB&B unit - but that would get pricey at $150 plus a day. The second home idea is tougher in Portland but as long as there is a transit line nearby with access to downtown, it does not have to be Portland.
It seems to me doing the reverse makes much more sense. That is, owning in the PNW, let's say Portland. It's comfortable living in spring, summer, fall, and arguably some of the best weather in the lower 48 during these seasons (no humidity, no bugs, nice weather mix of sun, light rains, clouds). Maybe only Hawaii and California are better. So for the bulk of the year, you live in the PNW, in either no-sales-tax Oregon or no-income-tax Southwest Washington.
The final season is winter. It's true, PNW winters are gray, overcast, rainy. A PNW winter is much better than many other areas of the country, but still, it's gray/rainy/windy/sometimes cold. The one month I truly don't like up here is January, it's depressing. So what do we do? We vacation. Just get the hell out of here for a month (or two). Traveling during winter is the best, in my opinion. Plenty of places to go with fantastic January weather. Good availability, too, from Florida to any of the Southern states, Arizona, Nevada, Hawaii, California -- or other countries. Zero competition from stressed nuclear family units. Families are busy with their annoying kids and school, then the Christmas holidays, and after January 1, right back into school and work for them. This is why winter travel prices are among the lowest of the year, because parents and families simply can't travel during this time. January/February are the time when travel agents used to vacation because their clients are busy and because of significantly reduced prices and crowds. If you watch airline/hotel/BnB/cruise prices, you'll see, they start to pick up significantly in spring, and skyrocket in summer once the school calendar reads "summer vacation begins." The prices drop, sometimes significantly, in winter.
So that's what I'd recommend. Live in the PNW for the bulk of the year. Travel during winter, and you absolutely can afford a place for a month or two in a beautiful sunny locale, when rental and airline prices are at their lowest. It's ideal.
It seems to me doing the reverse makes much more sense. That is, owning in the PNW, let's say Portland. It's comfortable living in spring, summer, fall, and arguably some of the best weather in the lower 48 during these seasons (no humidity, no bugs, nice weather mix of sun, light rains, clouds). Maybe only Hawaii and California are better. So for the bulk of the year, you live in the PNW, in either no-sales-tax Oregon or no-income-tax Southwest Washington.
The final season is winter. It's true, PNW winters are gray, overcast, rainy. A PNW winter is much better than many other areas of the country, but still, it's gray/rainy/windy/sometimes cold. The one month I truly don't like up here is January, it's depressing. So what do we do? We vacation. Just get the hell out of here for a month (or two). Traveling during winter is the best, in my opinion. Plenty of places to go with fantastic January weather. Good availability, too, from Florida to any of the Southern states, Arizona, Nevada, Hawaii, California -- or other countries. Zero competition from stressed nuclear family units. Families are busy with their annoying kids and school, then the Christmas holidays, and after January 1, right back into school and work for them. This is why winter travel prices are among the lowest of the year, because parents and families simply can't travel during this time. January/February are the time when travel agents used to vacation because their clients are busy and because of significantly reduced prices and crowds. If you watch airline/hotel/BnB/cruise prices, you'll see, they start to pick up significantly in spring, and skyrocket in summer once the school calendar reads "summer vacation begins." The prices drop, sometimes significantly, in winter.
So that's what I'd recommend. Live in the PNW for the bulk of the year. Travel during winter, and you absolutely can afford a place for a month or two in a beautiful sunny locale, when rental and airline prices are at their lowest. It's ideal.
Good points. I will keep my BA home so it's a question of how to split the time. And find a home/cottage in Portland I can afford. That would be in an outlying areas The key is being near transit so I can get by without much driving. Someone suggested a month in an adult community - find one that rents for short terms. They sent a link to one in downtown Portland with great views. Not that I am looking for that kind of adult community. That community, per the video, was focused seemingly on people in their mid-70s and beyond. There is a place in Beaverton or near there on a hill that is over-55 centered but more youngish. I may contact them to see if a month rental is possible. It has cottages and views and lots of open space.
Thank you for the response. BTW, the tax rate in Oregon is not much less than in California so, if I choose Portland because of the ability to be car free (if I so want), that won't be much of a factor. Also, when I worked there 15 plus years ago I fell in love with the Tualatin Valley - Hillsboro out to Forest Grove - and I may check that out too. .
The key is being near transit so I can get by without much driving. . . . so, if I choose Portland because of the ability to be car free (if I so want), that won't be much of a factor.
Not having to drive is an enormous plus. Modern driving absolutely sucks. Every major American city is goddamn jammed up. Portland during extended morning and evening commutes, it blows. Seattle/Tacoma/Olympia during commutes, even worse, just jammed everywhere, it can take hours to get where you need to go. Yet these PNW cities are better than Los Angeles and the Bay Area, which are the absolute worst, it can take 40 minutes just to get on the freeway in California. San Diego is a little better, but not much. And what's really scary is U.S. driving conditions are better still than many places in Asia and India, which are utter hell-on-earth parking lots with dangerous conditions and choking pollution. I hate driving, I hate cars, I hate the ancillary services dealing with any of it. Car-free is freedom.
Also, not having to throw money away on a depreciating car, insurance, maintenance, yearly fees, it adds up. Monthly insurance savings alone can pay for some Uber/Lyft rides, or a car rental, for those occasions when you need transpo.
Not having to drive is an enormous plus. Modern driving absolutely sucks. Every major American city is goddamn jammed up. Portland during extended morning and evening commutes, it blows. Seattle/Tacoma/Olympia during commutes, even worse, just jammed everywhere, it can take hours to get where you need to go. Yet these PNW cities are better than Los Angeles and the Bay Area, which are the absolute worst, it can take 40 minutes just to get on the freeway in California. San Diego is a little better, but not much. And what's really scary is U.S. driving conditions are better still than many places in Asia and India, which are utter hell-on-earth parking lots with dangerous conditions and choking pollution. I hate driving, I hate cars, I hate the ancillary services dealing with any of it. Car-free is freedom...
I can see why most people hate driving in and around Portland. I've driven some of the worst freeways in the US. Yet driving through Portland during rush is a nightmare! You get the sense that whoever designed all those roads crisscrossing over the river with ridiculously short exits and transitions were on drugs! I would rather drive in LA during rush hour. And I hate LA traffic. But at least the road interchanges are a bit more sane and the freeway is wider. Washington DC is the worst. Chicago is not much better. I prefer driving through Seattle rush hour than Portland and that isn't saying much.
If you live there and *must* drive in and around Portland I guess you have to learn about when to get in and out the places you need to be without going crazy. They seem in desperate need of highway system modernization.
This is one of things I love so much about Monterey. We have virtually no traffic to speak of with *zero* population growth. Between all the strict building codes and insane RE prices the area remains the same in size. My commute down Hwy 1 to work is about 10 minutes during 'rush hour' going ~ 70 mph. The only time it gets sorta bad is when we have major sporting events or music festivals. But the majority of time its a breeze. So we've gotten spoiled here definitely in that regard.
I guess I'll have to think about that when comparing QOL living in Vancouver/Camas vs. Corvallis. I would imagine Corvallis is similar in some ways to Monterey or other smaller towns in OR/WA. While every area has 'some' traffic that can vary wildly depending on a number of factors. In the case of smaller towns driving can actually be enjoyable such as along the Oregon coast or in the less impacted regions of WA.
I can see why most people hate driving in and around Portland. I've driven some of the worst freeways in the US. Yet driving through Portland during rush is a nightmare! You get the sense that whoever designed all those roads crisscrossing over the river with ridiculously short exits and transitions were on drugs! I would rather drive in LA during rush hour. And I hate LA traffic. But at least the road interchanges are a bit more sane and the freeway is wider. Washington DC is the worst. Chicago is not much better. I prefer driving through Seattle rush hour than Portland and that isn't saying much.
If you live there and *must* drive in and around Portland I guess you have to learn about when to get in and out the places you need to be without going crazy. They seem in desperate need of highway system modernization.
This is one of things I love so much about Monterey. We have virtually no traffic to speak of with *zero* population growth. Between all the strict building codes and insane RE prices the area remains the same in size. My commute down Hwy 1 to work is about 10 minutes during 'rush hour' going ~ 70 mph. The only time it gets sorta bad is when we have major sporting events or music festivals. But the majority of time its a breeze. So we've gotten spoiled here definitely in that regard.
I guess I'll have to think about that when comparing QOL living in Vancouver/Camas vs. Corvallis. I would imagine Corvallis is similar in some ways to Monterey or other smaller towns in OR/WA. While every area has 'some' traffic that can vary wildly depending on a number of factors. In the case of smaller towns driving can actually be enjoyable such as along the Oregon coast or in the less impacted regions of WA.
Derek
You mention Camas. Friends are in the process of relocating to Washougal which is close by. They have purchased a 3/2 on a river with a couple of acres of land. They paid 510K. I've seen photos and they are quite stunning. The kitchen and living area look onto the river. My friends live in Petaluma and love the small town feel there but the growth has reached them and the freeway is a nightmare. Driving in Washougal might be a "treat" - to the extent driving can be so.
You mention Camas. Friends are in the process of relocating to Washougal which is close by. They have purchased a 3/2 on a river with a couple of acres of land. They paid 510K. I've seen photos and they are quite stunning. The kitchen and living area look onto the river. My friends live in Petaluma and love the small town feel there but the growth has reached them and the freeway is a nightmare. Driving in Washougal might be a "treat" - to the extent driving can be so.
That place in Washougal sounds very nice with the view of the river. One thing to consider during your research is the wind off of the Gorge. I posted a thread asking about it a while back and during the winter it can a significant factor. For those with unobstructed views in that area they will face it head on. Some don't mind the trade off given the gorgeous views. But it is a factor to be made aware of none the less. That would be quite surprise if no one told them.
StealthRabbit basically gave me this line where the wind is the worst which apparently tappers off as one approaches western Vancouver.
Regarding driving, I found Vancouver itself much better than Portland while visiting the area. The main problem would be having to drive into Portland from Vancouver during the wrong times off the day.
Derek
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