Degrees of contrast within VC cities (Los Angeles, Oxnard: low income, crime, neighborhoods)

[HSP1161]

A previous thread got me thinking about comparing and contrasting the cities within the county.

For example, I have a very hard time knowing where TO ends and Westlake Village begins. Or take Simi or Moorpark - you can pretty much tell what city you're in as there is a strong consistency within those towns.

By contrast, there is a very distinct difference between Mandalay Bay and El Rio in Oxnard. Or between the Westside and the east end in Ventura. Even Santa Paula has very different communities, especially including the unincorporated areas.

Perhaps this is an artifact of the development period when each respective area grew up, but it's worth noting when looking at statistics that some cities are a ton more nuanced than some will let on.

I think a lot of heated discussion has centered on this fact (Oxnard comes to mind, and I'm no Oxnard apologist) that we paint with vastly different palettes. Some VC areas have 100 shades of beige, while others have startkly contrasting colors.

To me, the tolerance and level of contrast of areas within a place is as important as "median household income."

Personally, I think Oxnard has too much contrast for my taste. I think the Conejo Valley has too little.

[LadyKLO]

Great post OpenSky...sometimes we only see our little world and nothing else...it's a Catch 22 at times..

[user_id]

Originally Posted by OpenSky

For example, I have a very hard time knowing where TO ends and Westlake Village begins.

That is because "westlake village" was an unincorporated community that spanned two counties that is now partly TO and partly Westlake village (the city). But the lack of rigid dividing lines between communities doesn't imply uniformity. For example, Newbury Park is noticeably different than Westlake Village.

I really don't get how Oxnard has a lot of contrast. Sure there is some contrast in development because it has some older parts, but the city is rather uniform otherwise.

Also, though I don't think TO has "high contrast", a lot of the contrasting areas just aren't visible. For example, there are a lot of mansions and interesting architecture that is just hidden from normal view.

[the city]

I am including Santa Maria and down:

Santa Maria: city with a manufacturing and farming based economy

Lompoc: low income bedroom community for Vandenburg Airforce Base

Santa Barbara-coastal city with tourism and college-based economy

Goleta: coastal suburb of Santa Barbara w/ a small tech economy and college-based economy

Ventura: coastal city w/ tourism, government facility, and medical based economy.

Port Hueneme: coastal city suburban city with a navy base

Oxnard: coastal suburban city with farming, manufacturing, and some tech and medical-based economy

Camarillo: suburban city with a economy centered a college, government facility, and tourism

Thousand Oaks: suburban city with a biomedical-based economy

Simi Valley: suburban city with an economy based around tourism and being a bedroom community


Each social class follows the economies of each community. Farming and manufactoring based commmunities=lower incomes where as tourism, education, medical, and biomedical=higher incomes.

[waitressinthesky]

They are definitely hard to define; you don't get much of a different feel driving from one to another, in many cases. When I was a kid in Oak Park, I never realized that Pavilions (the one on Lindero) was technically part of Westlake, and that across the street, the Ralphs was part of Oak Park. Lindero is the dividing line there. And then Oak Park -- from what I've heard -- was grafted out of Agoura because the residents there didn't want to be living in Los Angeles County, and wanted to form their own school board.

You're right about Oxnard... I have heard from college friends who grew up there about gang problems you really don't see in the Conejo Valley.

For me, living in northern Goleta, I felt like you could really feel the economic difference between people living in Goleta and people living in SB. Santa Barbara residents tend to have more money (upper-middle to upper class), while Goleta was strictly middle to working class.

[katnip kid]

Does Oxnard still have a problem with gangs?

[Winston Smith]

I definitely see a difference between the Conejo Valley and just about every other city in Ventura County. In the Conejo Valley, the sameness of the place runs into itself in a very standard 1970s style suburban sprawl. You don't know when you left Newbury Park, entered T.O. or crossed into Westlake Village, indeed out of Ventura County at that point, by anything in the form of city separation or natural geography. The signs along 101 tell you, but that's about it.

Even suburban-sprawl Simi Valley has a definite edge. Anywhere else in VC you know when you are between cities by virtue of urban boundaries and city-separation with agriculture or rustic areas as buffers.

An argument could be made that Oxnard and Ventura run into each other at the 101, but even there the Santa Clara River forms a natural boundary and separation between the two cities.

[Winston Smith]

Originally Posted by katnip kid

Does Oxnard still have a problem with gangs?

Not nearly to the degree that it did a few years ago. Crime has dropped significantly in Oxnard over the past 10 years.

[HSP1161]

Originally Posted by Winston Smith

I definitely see a difference between the Conejo Valley and just about every other city in Ventura County. In the Conejo Valley, the sameness of the place runs into itself in a very standard 1970s style suburban sprawl. You don't know when you left Newbury Park, entered T.O. or crossed into Westlake Village, indeed out of Ventura County at that point, by anything in the form of city separation or natural geography. The signs along 101 tell you, but that's about it.

Even suburban-sprawl Simi Valley has a definite edge. Anywhere else in VC you know when you are between cities by virtue of urban boundaries and city-separation with agriculture or rustic areas as buffers.

An argument could be made that Oxnard and Ventura run into each other at the 101, but even there the Santa Clara River forms a natural boundary and separation between the two cities.

Good post. I think the degree of contrast within each city/community is also stark. In the abstract, you'd never associate neighborhoods in Ventura (or Oxnard) with one another. OTOH, Conejo Valley neighborhoods essentially flow from one to the next with only nuanced differences. It's Anytown, USA.

With the possible exception of the natural open space or maybe the Civic Arts Plaza, I can't think of anything distinctive in the Conejo Valley.

[user_id]

Originally Posted by Winston Smith

I definitely see a difference between the Conejo Valley and just about every other city in Ventura County. In the Conejo Valley, the sameness of the place runs into itself in a very standard 1970s style suburban sprawl. You don't know when you left Newbury Park, entered T.O. or crossed into Westlake Village, indeed out of Ventura County at that point, by anything in the form of city separation or natural geography. The signs along 101 tell you, but that's about it.

What is great about this commentary is that its entirely contradictory... But first, let's note that the "Conejo Valley" isn't a city in Ventura County. Its a geographic region spanning two counties that contains multiple small but well connected cities. Second, if one can distinguish the Conejo Valley from "just about every other city in Ventura County" then the Conejo Valley is distinct contrary to what you're trying to, rather ironically, imply...

So while you speak about the Conejo Valley as a whole, you ignore that and instead focus on the cities within the Conejo Valley being similar. Well duh....it is precisely because the cities in the Conejo Valley are similar and very well connected that people talk about the Conejo Valley has one joint community.

The Conejo Valley has a "definite edge"....I hear that is common in valleys...

But I suppose this is what happens when your only motivate is to say something negative.....because someone has, god forbid, said something you don't like about a city you live in. Keep up the good work though!