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Old 03-12-2007, 10:58 AM
 
Location: Texas- moving back to New England!
562 posts, read 660,145 times
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Get Green Diamond tires, and heavy steel pipe bumpers for your 4wd vehicle.

Carry a portable stove in your truck in addition to what others have stated. Coleman makes the nifty little backpacker, the 533 you can get at Wal-mart which runs on unleaded or white gas.

Winch, shovel, all that sort of thing helps with a vehicle.

Personal survival is based on your clothes if you get stranded. Wind will cool you down very quickly even if you have tons of stuff on, so invest in windproof garments too. Wool is itchy, but it retains warmth even if wet. It is better not to get wet though. I'd suggest Cabelas Windshear Shooters Sweater which is windproof, then another fleece layer over that. For protection from wetness, a gore-tex shell parka over those layers. I wear duofold 1 piece union suits in very cold conditions for thermal protection at the base layer. Jeans are no good in the winter, the cotton makes you colder. For your feet I suggest pac boots or equivalent. Check with L.L. Bean, Cabelas or Bass Pro on those. Wool socks are the best. I wear Merino Wool usually as it doesn't itch. I am living in Texas right now, but planning to move back north, so I am getting ready myself. I however will be moving to New Hampshire. Not quite sure yet where though
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Old 03-12-2007, 05:25 PM
 
Location: hinesburg, vt
1,574 posts, read 4,857,406 times
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Before coming to Vt I lived in Anchorage, Ak and all you really need here in Vt are good all season radial tires. I have a F150 pickup and a Subaru Forester, so I do recommend all wheel drive. Studded tires were better in Anchorage. Up there we had just as much snow, but they did not salt the heck out of the roads, just used sand. The salt makes a nasty slushy brine which in my opinion is worse than driving on sand and ice. Some use studs here, but the roads clear up fast here and you will just grind them down driving on pavement. I live almost three miles up a dirt road and that road is better than driving on pavement, except in mud season. The mud and ruts can cause more control difficulty than snow and ice. One more point, when it does snow watch that right shoulder because you cannot see where it drops off and you will get sucked right off the road if your tires get into that drop zone. The best advice was already mentioned previously, adjust your speed to conditions! You will have those that will blow by you, but they are not the ones paying your insurance premium. I was a cop until retirement and all of my years I worked in northern climates. Speed is overwhelmingly the predominant cause of accidents supplemented by innattention.
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Old 03-12-2007, 09:14 PM
 
Location: Midwest
9,419 posts, read 11,166,375 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwatted Wabbit View Post
I mostly agree with Jason, except for the studs part. In my region there are lots of folks who run studs, including the local government vehicles, and IMO studs are overkill like wearing a bulletproof vest to a bingo game. Yes, there IS a chance a stray round could come through the window and your vest will save you. But the other 9,999 years it won't happen.
The flip side of studs, besides the terrible toll they extract on the roads, is that for the 99 percent of the time you're not driving on glare ice, they have a much lower coefficient of friction than standard snows, or all-seasons for that matter. You are essentially driving on steel tires, and steel does not grip well.
Snow tire technology has reached a level today where even the unstuds will give good grip on ice.
My Bridgestone Revo1s do well on ice, I bought them because around here they leave the snow on many side streets to pack, and it turns into ice which may or may not get a bit of sand or gravel from time to time.
So, bottom line: studs tear up the road, they give a false sense of security although they do not have nearly the traction of any other tire on dry or wet or even light snow; quality snow tires will do most folks fine, unless they live on a hill that ices up several times a week all winter. Then you can always use cat litter or fireplace ashes. Ashes are freebies, are good for the gaahden come springtime, and they are great for traction.
edit: This is the first set of snow tires I've ever bought. FWD has taken me everywhere I needed to go. But the snows are far far superior on ice.
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Old 03-13-2007, 04:45 AM
 
Location: Apex, NC
1,341 posts, read 6,189,943 times
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I can't recommend Hakkapeliitta snow tires enough. I no longer live in Vermont - I own a horse farm in Boones Mill, VA just south of Roanoke - but I grew up in Vermont and logged hundreds of thousands of miles on snow without wrecking. You can cheap out and buy some Coopers or whatever but you'll get what you pay for.

You can get by with good all season radials on a 4WD or AWD vehicle. However, you'll maintain more control and enjoy an overall safer ride if you have a full set of winter tires. I recommend keeping the winter shows on cheap steal rims to simplify wheel swaps (because you can do the swaps yourself to save some $).

A rear wheel drive vehicle is as safe or safer than a front wheel drive vehicle as long as you have a full set of winter tires. The reason is because you can steer with your throttle at city driving speeds. With front wheel drive if you start an outward slide around a corner at < 25mph it takes longer to regain control than it does with a RWD, where you can turn in the front tires and feather the accelerator and get yourself pointed in the right direction. But most people raised on FWD vehicles consider this counter intuitive driving despite the majority of police cruisers for the past 75 years being RWD vehicles.

Trucks are overrated in the snow. Don't get me wrong, you can have the keys to my Dodge Ram 1500 SLT Hemi when you can pry them from my cold dead hands but they truly offer about the worst snow handling in the known universe. The reason is the light rear end. The only major accident I've ever been in was with my wife driving her truck around a corner when we hit a patch of sleet and ice. The truck tried to get out of it's own way in a hurry and it was just impossible to regain control of a truck with a 75/25 weight distribution. They're also more prone to slides due to this distribution without 4WD engaged and the last time I checked transfer cases didn't appreciate full-time 4WD because about 50% of the time you'll be driving on bare pavement (spotty snow etc) and wearing down the gears alot faster. If I had a choice between my 1500SLT with all seasons, or my Toyota Prius w/ four Hakkis then I'd pick the Prius during a snow storm every day of the week.

I have some insight regarding chains. Twelve years ago I was a pizza delivery driver in Burlington in the busiest Dominos in the state (and 59th busiest in the country). We'd drive like 100 miles a night around town in our cars (and come home with about $125 in tips). One of the drivers was always looking for an edge and he tried out chains on one night. He let me take his Honda Civic hatchback out on one run with the chains on during a big snowstorm and it was unbelievable. The car behaved like it was on dry roads. However, by the end of the night two of the four sets of chains had broken off the vehicle and one of the chains when it did break beat the bejeesus out of a quarter panel before it broke completely free. Now, granted, spirited delivery drivers don't drive as normal humans do but you get the idea. I don't think they're worth it, and they may very well be illegal in Vermont by now due to breakage and also the damage to the asphalt. Another thing I learned while delivery driving is that an e-brake that controls just the rear brakes is a godsend. You can learn to use the e-brake to the level where it becomes an integral part of your steering during snowstorms. I got so handy with mine that I could be driving down a side road, spoot the house on the left side of the road, and tap my brakes and pull the e-brake to spin a 180 and stop parked at the curb in front of the house in about 5 seconds.

Sean
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Old 03-13-2007, 09:18 AM
 
23,600 posts, read 70,412,676 times
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"I got so handy with mine that I could be driving down a side road, spoot the house on the left side of the road, and tap my brakes and pull the e-brake to spin a 180 and stop parked at the curb in front of the house in about 5 seconds."

Guess that would explain all those pizzas with the toppings on one side only.

On a related note, be aware that many drivers will drive fast on the dirt washboard roads, which they handle like snow-covered roads. One friend of mine had a house out on the river road between Waterbury and Bolton. He knew every turn by heart, and took great pleasure in trying to stop mine as he raced down the road, loosing the rear-end and drifting through the turns in the middle of the night at 80 mph.

Driving fast on washboard is a lot more comfortable, and while it puts a lot of stress on the tires and ball joints, the suspension probably moves a lot less than if you going at a slower kishka-shaking speed.
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Old 03-13-2007, 09:59 AM
 
Location: Burlington VT
1,405 posts, read 4,787,584 times
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Sean - Terrific post.

When I had Peugeots and VW Rabbits, I used the hand brake on turns all the time - particularly when driving slowly.

And your point about Rear Wheel Drive is apt too: what the heck do people think Vermonters etc drove before Saabs etc got people thinking about 4wd? I had a Dodge Dart for years, and I ran snows with bags of sand in the trunk. That beat the heck out of the Fort Taurus I have to rescue on our street each year.

Standard transmission helps in the winter too - but the cars I buy don't come with it anymore, nor do they like to admit that the could still sell me a Front Wheel drive model like my first one - they seem to come with Automatic and 4WD now and you're just SOL trying to find one without those particular bells and whistles...

David
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Old 03-13-2007, 02:50 PM
 
Location: N.H.
1,022 posts, read 3,475,856 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harry chickpea View Post
"So I am moving to Vermont, I have
For the car- add a can of starting fluid, a jar of peanut butter, a couple small bottles of water, and half-a-dozen emergency candles. A candle or two will keep you from totally freezing and allow you to thaw the peanut butter and water. On sub-zero days, crank the engine once. If it doesn't start, don't wear the battery down. Grab the starter fluid and give it a shot.


Snow tires. Tires that have ground walnut shell in the tread give great traction on ice without as much damage to the roads as studded tires. I still remember one winter when the Richmond hill on the interstate (near the Twist-o-Hill Lodge) was sheer ice, and there were cars of all types (including subarus) and semi trailers that were unable to make the grade and sprawled all over the road and embankments. With my nutty snow tires and my '68 Chevy Nova, I was able to smoothly drive up the hill throught the reverse slalom course created by the stalled out cars without any problem.

One more thing. Don't eat yellow snow.
LMAO (yellow snow) Great advice. Ground walnut shells? This replace sandpaper recaps? Anyway You can try Green Diamond tires as well. They are like the sandpaper recaps but they are not recaps. I have 4 uncles and 2 aunts that live there and run them, They swear by them. I know several people here in NH with them as well, and they say they are the best. Next year I will put them on my truck just due to all the positive I have heard about them. You have to put them on around August as they need several thousand miles to work. Google Green DIAMOND tire and it has all the info. The walnut shell sound cool too. Then if they leave in the walnut and you break down you can always have a piece of tire, if you get hungry.
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Old 03-13-2007, 04:03 PM
 
Location: Apex, NC
1,341 posts, read 6,189,943 times
Reputation: 618
Quote:
Originally Posted by harry chickpea View Post
Driving fast on washboard is a lot more comfortable, and while it puts a lot of stress on the tires and ball joints, the suspension probably moves a lot less than if you going at a slower kishka-shaking speed.
LOL. I'm getting carsick just remembering how my tightly wound Porsche 944 project car handled the dirt washboard roads in VT!

BTW, there is a 1985 1/2 Porsche 944 project car buried in snow somewhere on a farm in VT that hasn't been driven since 2002. I bought it for $5K, I put $3K in parts into it and several pints of blood, and with just another $5K (in parts and labor, I'd sell it for much much less) and several more pints of blood it could make you carsick on dirt washboard roads too Interested parties feel free to PM for the deal of the century. Just don't sick your wife on me after you buy the car and it eats all of your free time

Sean
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Old 03-13-2007, 04:05 PM
 
Location: Apex, NC
1,341 posts, read 6,189,943 times
Reputation: 618
Quote:
Originally Posted by chaz longue View Post
Standard transmission helps in the winter too - but the cars I buy don't come with it anymore, nor do they like to admit that the could still sell me a Front Wheel drive model like my first one - they seem to come with Automatic and 4WD now and you're just SOL trying to find one without those particular bells and whistles...
So true. My father in-laws favorite snow car was for years in the 1960s a RWD VW Bug that he somehow squeezed his wife and four children in (this was before seatbelt laws). He claimed it just never got stuck, ever, even during major whiteouts.

Sean
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Old 03-24-2007, 03:49 PM
 
1,652 posts, read 2,549,838 times
Reputation: 1463
Chains are not necessary. Buy 4 snows and run them all winter, the margin of error is so much better. I drove for years on "all seasons" and never thought I "needed" snow tires until I actually bought 4 and ran them for a whole winter. I'll never be without them again in wintertime. Night & day difference.

Studs are, in my opinion, overkill unless you spend a lot of time on frozen dirt roads. Studs actually decrease your traction on dry pavement.

AWD or FWD is preferred for sure, and certainly recommended for a Florida transplant. However.... I strongly disagree with the "RWD is useless in snow" remark. That's the sort of hype that car makers were selling when they switched to FWD, as if no one drove before 1985.
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