[nancny]

thanks for the advice--I only ask about Montpelier because that is where the previous job offers have come from...

Would it make sense to live somewhere closer to Burlington (for the community) but work in Montpelier? I understand that although the snow is at times tremendous, the roads are plowed and maintained very well.

We will have fun and be enchanted but I know one can't survive on environment alone!

[GypsySoul22]

The thing is, the competition IS fierce here. It's not like, okay everyone is 60 plus and I will walk into a job because 'all the kids' are gone.

I thought the same. I also figured I am probably going to have more luck because I have not only a BA, but also a MS degree.

Sure...

Trouble is, any job that looks like it may pay more than the (bow please) $10-12 considered 'good' will have a ton of applicants. They take longer to get back to you than in NY.

I suppose there is the route of getting in with a good company and just dealing with the horrible pay.

Like I said, I don't know what we will do.

[Alaskapat528]

Originally Posted by Sherylcatmom

This is what I mean by the subjective experience. For me, born and raised in South Florida, the weather there was "nothing but depressing." I wilt and feel ill in heat & humidity. Vermont winters get a little long, but I'd take long Vermont winters over SFla summers anytime. I can always put on more clothes so I'm comfortable being outside. But in heat/humidity, I found myself trapped indoors most of the year. How do you acclimate to something you were born feeling yucky about?

I believe that Vermont does face challenges as described here. Look around the country -- every state does. Every nation in the world does. At least we still have viable agriculture to eat delicious food, which good luck getting in most states.

So it's not that things aren't tough here -- it's which challenges are you most able & willing to face? I'll take Vermont's.

I agree with you. It is not just VT facing challenges; it is all over the United States right now. I dont think there is one state that you would consider to be thriving right now with emloyment and people having it easy. I also agree with you about the heat..Good Lord...I can't stand it when it's real hot and humid. We too have long winters in Alaska but our summers are absolutely beautiful. Here's hoping and praying that our economy picks up real soon.

[MRVphotog]

Originally Posted by vter

Having a good life here is entirely possible. For me, the cost of living here is worth it.

Like today for instance....beautiful day....soft and sweet spring skiing....great day for cross country skiing, snowshoeing...just getting out there. The sap is flowing....pure Vermont...go outside and get some.

http://forums.skimrv.com/albums/album23/BushAllyns.jpg (broken link)

[harry chickpea]

Originally Posted by MRVphotog

Like today for instance....beautiful day....soft and sweet spring skiing....great day for cross country skiing, snowshoeing...just getting out there. The sap is flowing....pure Vermont...go outside and get some.

http://forums.skimrv.com/albums/album23/BushAllyns.jpg (broken link)

From one of my previous posts in this thread:

"I think that the tax burden in Vermont is outrageous, and prevents any realistic expectation of "retirement," syrupticiously (sic) using a state promoted addiction to beauty and sweetness to drain funds from residents that otherwise could be saved for one of the many rainy days."

Thanks for so eloquently making my point.

No disrespect intended at all, simply pointing out that Vermont can promote a shifting of values, where the sheer beauty gives a tremendous "high" that feels worth it, while the low wages and taxes are quietly nibbling away at your 'nads. If there is a core dichotomy to living in the state, this is it.

Maple syrup, flaming autumn colors, sweet scents, crisp snow days are all drugs that impact the brain, and keep the individual from denying that overall, their financial health is going to pot.

[nancny]

Then are most of you saying that it is not worth it living in Vermont except for a small group of people who are lucky enough to find jobs with decent wages?

Do good wages far outweigh being in a wondeful environment such as Vermont? I know you can't eat fresh air and scenic beauty, but where is the balance?

Then how are the majority of Vermont's 600,000 people surviving, and does this mean a steadily declining population and pending economic imbalance for Vermont? And what is the solution?

[Sherylcatmom]

Originally Posted by nancny

Then are most of you saying that it is not worth it living in Vermont except for a small group of people who are lucky enough to find jobs with decent wages?

You could take a vote, but it would represent a tiny slice of a much more diverse (yes, that word means more than color and sexual orientation) population who doesn't use the internet, this forum, or the "reply" button. It also wouldn't tell you anything about Vermont's compatibility with your own values and needs, or what your experiences here would actually be like.

And what is a job with decent wages? I have work I enjoy and earn enough to live the way I want -- certainly not the way I might fantasize about when I hear that the lottery jackpot is over $100 million, but the way I actually am. I enjoy the bulk of my waking hours.

Originally Posted by nancny

Do good wages far outweigh being in a wonderful environment such as Vermont? I know you can't eat fresh air and scenic beauty, but where is the balance?

I think that the balance is found when someone has enough of what they want and need. I have enough of what I want/need here that I can't imagine giving up living where I love to earn more and possibly spend less on things like property taxes. When I walk out my door, I want to be standing in Vermont. And I spend far less money than when I lived other places because I'm not using stuff to numb myself. But this is my experience -- others look around and wish they were somewhere else, which is just as valid and I hope they get what they want.

Originally Posted by nancny

Then how are the majority of Vermont's 600,000 people surviving, and does this mean a steadily declining population and pending economic imbalance for Vermont? And what is the solution?

No one knows what's going to happen. I very much doubt that things are going to continue on exactly their current course here or anywhere else. Likely they'll improve in some ways for some people and become more difficult for others. Who knows? Maybe the powers that be will get it together and plan for a more sustainable future, economically and otherwise. If the citizenry is upset enough, maybe they'll participate in the process more.

I do see that people in Vermont are having problems -- in some cases severe financial issues threatening their basic needs and futures. I see that people are leaving. I also see that people are doing fine (or better) and staying. Others are moving here.

Look, I really value the input of people on this forum. I have a sense of being informed in ways unique to this medium, viewpoints and experiences I might not otherwise know about. But I also wouldn't generalize that what you're reading here represents "most" of Vermont -- or what you are likely to experience.

[MRVphotog]

Originally Posted by harry chickpea

Maple syrup, flaming autumn colors, sweet scents, crisp snow days are all drugs that impact the brain, and keep the individual from denying that overall, their financial health is going to pot.

That's a pretty cynical outlook and I realize some folks are afflicted with that perspective but to imply this is what all Vermonters face everyday simply isn't true IMHO.

[harry chickpea]

Then are most of you saying that it is not worth it living in Vermont except for a small group of people who are lucky enough to find jobs with decent wages?

No, I'm saying that there is a trade off. Most, if not all on this forum would be dumbfounded how little my wife and I pay in property tax and insurance, while still enjoying our own stream, forest, and rolling fields.


Do good wages far outweigh being in a wondeful environment such as Vermont? I know you can't eat fresh air and scenic beauty, but where is the balance?

YOU have to decide that balance. Just remember that when you get to an age where you no longer can work, your phrase that "you can't eat scenery" will have much more meaning. I could post some nice scenic photos as well, some that you couldn't tell from those taken in Vermont. We did a LOT of research before ending up where we are.


Then how are the majority of Vermont's 600,000 people surviving, and does this mean a steadily declining population and pending economic imbalance for Vermont? And what is the solution?

Don't want much, huh? I've no idea what the solution is. Neither does the state government. If TSHTF with a few more investment bank failures and job losses ripping the guts out of the economy, the rest of the nation may soon be asking similar questions. I count at least four times in the past four months that the nation has literally been snatched from financial meltdowns at the last moment. If there is an economic blow-out, being in Vermont trying to survive and pay taxes might not be fun. But that is semi-beside the point.

Am I cynical? Perhaps in the original Greek sense of the word, or the UVM student paper, I am a cynic. I tend to think of myself as more of a pragmatist and a survivor. I like the idea of a roof over my head that can't be removed easily by a bank or a tax assessor, and I like to eat regularly and know that more food will be available if I need it. You know, Maslow's hierarchy of needs and all that. Stuff that people who grew up in the 1980s and 1990s never had to worry about.

It might be easier to understand my view, if I related the story of a friend who bought a $6,000 house (yes that figure is right) on the Winooski River in the 1970s. He and his wife didn't have much of an income, and one of his joys was his (used) Mercedes. It was glorious riding down the river road in the middle of the night in that Mercedes, going to his home in the country with a massive stereo system, and chinchillas in the back room, and wonderful strong coffee and great discussions about life. The scenery, the ambiance, the life, all were wonderful.

He got sick. It was all gone within less than a year. He and his wife got divorced. I've driven by since then and beat my way through the weeds to visit the cellar hole and rubble.

It was beautiful while it lasted.

[vter]

I agree with Sheryl - it all comes down to one thing. Personal preferences.We have a beautiful piece of property and I find the taxes to be reasonable.
Also, as Sheryl said, only a miniscule amount of people are posting here. Of all my circle of friends, family & co-workers, they are all happy here.
So, Nancy....only you and your hubby can decide if it's worth it or not to go for the move. I wish you the best of luck!