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Private sector Fortune 500 here, it's really not a big deal at all as long as you manage your work load well.
We're supposed to be here at 9, but today for example, I showed up at 9:40. At the same time, I'll likely stay here until 6:30 most likely because I need to make changes to the system that are best done off hours. On top of that, part of my role is a support type role, and I find most people haven't run into their problems first thing in the morning, but I always get a ton of people showing up at 5. So I change my hours based on when I think I'll be needed. No point in me showing up at 8 to sit around with little to do and then get stuck here until 6 because someone ran into a problem at 5pm.
If I have an early meeting, I come in early. If I don't, I come in but don't worry about hitting 9 on the dot. I've proven my reliability and I don't need to discuss this with anyone.
But yeah, I don't worry about the clock at all. Performance reviews have always been 4 or 5, so obviously management doesn't disapprove.
Now, let me get this straight. Other threads are talking that people are over worked and can't make a living. Then this thread comes up and people are fine with being late, passive, don't care, "I did what I had to do", etc. And in business we all know nothing every comes up spur of the moment.
I find that very interesting.
Exactly. I would say there is a direct correlation. I think it rather humorous reading all the posts that say "what difference does it make as long as I get my work done?" For those that can't figure it out, I will explain the difference. If you are routinely late and dick around during the day but you "still get your job done," you could have been more productive. Simply "getting your job done" doesn't impress too many people other than maybe the rest of the slackers.
When I worked with a group of hourly employees it was expected that all of us would be at work on time, take the allotted amount of time for breaks and lunch, and not leave until our appointed time. We did not have to clock in but were watched by our manager.
It was an issue when 'favored' employees were allowed to come and go at will and still receive a 40 hour paycheck and those who didn't place the manager on a pedestal were routinely chastised for not being on time and their paychecks were docked accordingly.
See above. We're not shift workers, we're not working the counter at McDonald's, we're not floor nurses or factory workers or customer service reps whose lateness or absence would create more work for their coworkers. We (IT people) work in knowledge...we are paid for our knowledge and our ability to apply said knowledge to solve specific problems. So yeah...if I'm a few minutes late one day, who cares? Most people wouldn't even notice because they're busy doing their own work. We all regularly pull between 40-50 hours each week....more if a project requires it. So I don't want to hear that we're lazy or "passive."
I didn't say "you" were lazy, I did say passive. I also said that being on time shows respect.
I don't care what business someone is in or what they do. I'm saying that it shows respect to show up on time. How is that so hard to understand?
If you get your paycheck a day or two late, you going to say "eh, no problem cause my bills can wait".
People notice if they are busy working already and then you show up. I'm just saying that it shows respect to be punctual. Just what I've known to be true over the years.
You can do what you want, it's only my opinion. You know that opinions are like ***holes, everybody else's stinks.
Interestingly, Dorianro is a private sector worker. I am a public sector worker and care very much that people are on time. I fired somebody this morning for not adhering to schedule, among other things.
Agreed it does depend on the nature of the work. But for the most part (at least in corporate America) , you shouldn't be required to be sitting at your desk on the dot and be monitored like a child if you have to get up and go "wee wee" especially if you have demonstrated reliable and trustworthy and get the dang job done.
If you're 15-30 mins late.. BIG DEAL. Unless there is some mandatory meeting first thing in the morning. Treating adults like school children isn't going to do anyone any favors.
Oh... And does anyone monitor the corporate big wigs all day? These goofs out getting their 9 holes or out to various "meetings" aka. Hobnobbing on company time and doing god knows what else. Its funny, I don't see the same accountability applied to them ever. Any metrics and results they are being counted on for today? Who knows..
But thats corporate America for you.. Double Standards all over
We need to quit looking at the bottom of the totem poles already and start looking for accountability HIGHER.
Its never ceases to amaze me in this backwards freaking society that people with more responsibility seem to be held LESS Accountable now. Oh lets make sure the janitor is at the toilet on time in the morning to clean the turds out though Or make sure theres an adequate supply of toilet paper on hand by 8 am on the dot OR ELSE. The big wigs up the food chain? " Oh they'll be in after their morning 9 holes" however
... Just as long as have toilet paper. Thats all that matters. The Corporate Managers? We don't know where they are.
Well, the big wigs cause you be able to pay your bills. So who wins? I would fire you on the spot for being late. I am not a big wig, more like bottom feeder but I have the basics down.
I didn't say "you" were lazy, I did say passive. I also said that being on time shows respect.
I don't care what business someone is in or what they do. I'm saying that it shows respect to show up on time. How is that so hard to understand?
If you get your paycheck a day or two late, you going to say "eh, no problem cause my bills can wait".
People notice if they are busy working already and then you show up. I'm just saying that it shows respect to be punctual. Just what I've known to be true over the years.
You can do what you want, it's only my opinion. You know that opinions are like ***holes, everybody else's stinks.
I'm in before most of my colleagues and unlike most of them, I still work a full day if I've had to monitor a deployment the night before or if I'm called about a production issue at 4am. Some of my colleagues will count those hours and subtract them from the next day's working day.
I'm not the problem.
I'm also very rarely late and whenever I am, it's 100% due to idiots crashing into each other on the highway.
I'm in before most of my colleagues and unlike most of them, I still work a full day if I've had to monitor a deployment the night before or if I'm called about a production issue at 4am. Some of my colleagues will count those hours and subtract them from the next day's working day.
I'm not the problem.
I'm also very rarely late and whenever I am, it's 100% due to idiots crashing into each other on the highway.
No problem. I was simply replying to your post that was directed at me.
Not hardly. Most public sector employees are scrutinized much more closely than private sector. Every hour is documented and justified.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dijkstra
Exactly. I would say there is a direct correlation. I think it rather humorous reading all the posts that say "what difference does it make as long as I get my work done?" For those that can't figure it out, I will explain the difference. If you are routinely late and dick around during the day but you "still get your job done," you could have been more productive. Simply "getting your job done" doesn't impress too many people other than maybe the rest of the slackers.
The "correlation" very much depends on the industry and job being done. My dad for example, years ago, before telework was even a word, worked from home. He was paid for results, not hours. That meant some days he was home all day. Other days he worked from 5 am until after midnight the next day and then repeated. Sometimes weekdays. Often weekends. And sometimes on the golf course. Yet he made millions for his company each year.
My job's different. We have normal core hours, but our work is 24/7. Often event driven. One day I might be early. The next day working late. Or called at night or on the weekend. Even holidays. What counts is 80 hours over 14 days and results, not the start time. In our case, it's not about productivity as measured in an assembly line or production environment. It really is about simply getting the job done. It really does impress people and failure is not an option.
If you wish you were paid more, go find a job that pays more. Believe it or not, they do exist. Ditto with this thread. If you like more flexibility in when you come in, leave, hours worked, etc., then find another job that'll accommodate that. Those do exist.
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There are some jobs where punctuality is essential, so be sure to avoid those jobs. Other cases, they just care that the work gets done. (In fact, they have bigger fish to fry, like if you decide to sell corporate secrets.). Showing up on time and working the x amount of hours may be nice, but other times, it's just for show. If you work 9 out of 8 hours, but the engineer who comes in late 15 minutes late manages to design a solution that not only gets the job done, but under budget, and you can't improve upon that... management isn't going to care that you worked an extra hour per day. They're going to wonder what your extra presence of an hour contributed.
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I'm thankful that I've been on jobs where they tell you to get the stuff you need to get done. No, that's not an invitation to take 4 weeks off without clearing it. Small stuff like you need to go to your kid's school b/c your kid is acting up, your apartment flooded, you and your spouse need to spend a few hours to close on a house, your car needs to be fixed, or you have a doctor's appointment... stuff like that. They reason if you don't get it done, you're going to be thinking about this all day and you won't be focused on your work anyways.
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