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I mentioned it to my fiance later that day because I was flabbergasted, and she was surprised at my shock. She more or less said, why should they know? What does Brazil have to do with China?
It's ironic that we are discussing soccer, because the gov't has recently begun a massive push to make china the top contender in football. No doubt you've read about this. Two days ago, the kids at the middle school next to my building were out doing football drills. Doing that comes at the expense of other athletics, such as gymnastics, another sport china emphasized dominance on.
You don't live here any more. I don't have any idea how often you go back but I know you don't have kids here, or you would be wicked stoked to be in Boston/Cambridge and put them through a school whose Chinese equivalent would cost well over 100k RMB/year. My education 20 years ago in the US was better than the common core intellectual massacre going on there today, but as misguided as it is to force kids into abstract thinking on straightforward subjects, at least it's better than the simple rote memorization that makes up the core of Chinese primary education.
It's easy to get misty eyed and plug the successes of nepotistic political mandates demanding that an entire nation of kids focus on PISA scores or FIFA rankings when you aren't actually trying to get a kid through it... or, in my case, trying to get 200 kids through it...
I go back to China quite frequently and have contact with friends and relatives in China. IIRC, Chinese kids start to take geography at 5th grade (required by the department of education). So if you do the test one year later, the result may be surprisingly different.
But that is not the point. Maybe we have lived in different parts of China at different times. But I can tell you Chinese kids are not always like what you described.
Social science and arts education in China is really bad. Science education is not really good either IMO. But I would say the math education is better than many other countries'. I have seen American college students not being to solve 1/2+1/3. I have also seen American engineering students not knowing how to find roots of an equation after it is factorized. This is way more serious than kids sucking at geography. I think weak math proficiency has prevented many Americans from seeking a career in science and engineering (even if they'd like to).
I go back to China quite frequently and have contact with friends and relatives in China. IIRC, Chinese kids start to take geography at 5th grade (required by the department of education). So if you do the test one year later, the result may be surprisingly different.
But that is not the point. Maybe we have lived in different parts of China at different times. But I can tell you Chinese kids are not always like what you described.
Social science and arts education in China is really bad. Science education is not really good either IMO. But I would say the math education is better than many other countries'. I have seen American college students not being to solve 1/2+1/3. I have also seen American engineering students not knowing how to find roots of an equation after it is factorized. This is way more serious than kids sucking at geography. I think weak math proficiency has prevented many Americans from seeking a career in science and engineering (even if they'd like to).
Are you sure they didn't know how to do it rather than were too lazy to do it by hand? I didn't study engineering, I studied physics, but there is no way I would sit their and find roots of complex algebraic equations if I had a calculator or a computer nearby. I have taken math through calculus, differential equations, advanced linear algebra and complex analysis. Similarly I am not going to power through some funky integral by hand and I certainly don't have many integrals memorized besides the basics.
Are you sure they didn't know how to do it rather than were too lazy to do it by hand? I didn't study engineering, I studied physics, but there is no way I would sit their and find roots of complex algebraic equations if I had a calculator or a computer nearby. I have taken math through calculus, differential equations, advanced linear algebra and complex analysis. Similarly I am not going to power through some funky integral by hand and I certainly don't have many integrals memorized besides the basics.
As I said, the equation is already factorized, like (x-a)(x-b)(x-c)=0. No matter how lazy you are, it should be extremely easy to find the roots if you really understand the principle.
I think high school math education should allow students to choose most majors in college. If not physics or engineering, at least something like biology, accounting, and so on. If they cannot, then it fails. Their future is hindered by poor math education.
Last edited by Bettafish; 04-27-2015 at 08:57 AM..
I go back to China quite frequently and have contact with friends and relatives in China. IIRC, Chinese kids start to take geography at 5th grade (required by the department of education). So if you do the test one year later, the result may be surprisingly different.
But that is not the point. Maybe we have lived in different parts of China at different times. But I can tell you Chinese kids are not always like what you described.
But if they don't start geography until 5th grade, then why is it "impossible" to conceive that they wouldn't know where Brazil is or that Russia is the largest nation on earth and spans across Asia? You basically just proved my point...
Quote:
Social science and arts education in China is really bad. Science education is not really good either IMO. But I would say the math education is better than many other countries'.
exactly. This is basically my whole point. The Chinese educational system has its strengths and weaknesses just like any other system. Its early emphasis on mathematics and rote memorization helps it in some ways and is detrimental in others. There are simply only so many hours in a day you can teach kids and only so much they can take in.
Incidentally, and probably not entirely coincidentally, the Chinese system places emphasis on subjects that allow it to score higher on things such as the PISA tests. some of this is also probably a result of the written language ans Chinese system of numbers; the written language is not phonetic and relies on memorization of character meanings to form sentences. The number system used a more uniform manner of counting up to 100 (20 and 30 are "two ten" and "three ten" instead of "twenty" and "thirty"), which may seem trivial as an adult but is advantageous for a young learner, especially one who is not naturally mathematically talented. It also gets them thinking in fractions earlier on, whether they realize it or not, since it is basically just counting in tens in the other direction.
Quote:
I have seen American college students not being to solve 1/2+1/3. I have also seen American engineering students not knowing how to find roots of an equation after it is factorized. This is way more serious than kids sucking at geography. I think weak math proficiency has prevented many Americans from seeking a career in science and engineering (even if they'd like to).
Quote:
I think high school math education should allow students to choose most majors in college. If not physics or engineering, at least something like biology, accounting, and so on. If they cannot, then it fails. Their future is hindered by poor math education.
I disagree. By high school, I think that it should be clear that there are some students who lack the natural mathematical proficiency to be successful (or even have any interest) in these fields, and instead of "failing" someone who will never be in a scientific or advanced financial field because they couldnt pass AP trig, they should instead let them focus on their strengths so that they enter the world best equipped for the life they are going to live.
Not everyone is going to be a doctor, engineer, businessperson, or academic, all the same that not everyone is going to be an artist, musician, athlete, writer, chef, or general contractor. Not everyone will go to college or university. These people are not, by default, stupid, incapable, or destined to fail by any stretch of the imagination.
It is far, far stupider to try to force everyone into the exact same life expectations regardless of their talents or capabilities than to try to maximize each individual's level of success.
But if they don't start geography until 5th grade, then why is it "impossible" to conceive that they wouldn't know where Brazil is or that Russia is the largest nation on earth and spans across Asia? You basically just proved my point...
I disagree. By high school, I think that it should be clear that there are some students who lack the natural mathematical proficiency to be successful (or even have any interest) in these fields, and instead of "failing" someone who will never be in a scientific or advanced financial field because they couldnt pass AP trig, they should instead let them focus on their strengths so that they enter the world best equipped for the life they are going to live.
Not everyone is going to be a doctor, engineer, businessperson, or academic, all the same that not everyone is going to be an artist, musician, athlete, writer, chef, or general contractor. Not everyone will go to college or university. These people are not, by default, stupid, incapable, or destined to fail by any stretch of the imagination.
It is far, far stupider to try to force everyone into the exact same life expectations regardless of their talents or capabilities than to try to maximize each individual's level of success.
My point is, you don't need a geography class to know about Brazil in China. It is a prominent country, especially because soccer is popular in China. That was also my experience. But maybe it is not true nowadays.
Sure not everyone is supposed to be a doctor, engineer, etc. But a high school graduate should be able to solve quadratic equations and understand sinusoidal functions. Because they are very easy, simple and should be required, the same as knowing Brazil. Many American students cannot do that and it is wrong. China should never repeat Americans' mistake.
Yeah.. pretty much legit I guess, looking from this pict
Anyway the iq are based on the native population of the continent. So for australian it will be the aborigines and amerindians for america.
My point is, you don't need a geography class to know about Brazil in China. It is a prominent country, especially because soccer is popular in China. That was also my experience. But maybe it is not true nowadays.
Sure not everyone is supposed to be a doctor, engineer, etc. But a high school graduate should be able to solve quadratic equations and understand sinusoidal functions. Because they are very easy, simple and should be required, the same as knowing Brazil. Many American students cannot do that and it is wrong. China should never repeat Americans' mistake.
I have absolutely no clue how to solve a quadratic equation, and though I know what a sine wave and oscillation is, outside of composing electronic music on my computer, both have been absolutely irrelevant to my globetrotting, business-managing adult life. In truth, these things and other advanced mathematical forms are totally useless to 99% of the world's population, China and America included. If you asked a 25 year old Chinese person to solve a quadratic equation, I'm sure they would struggle with it all the same because outside of an academic, science, or engineering-based career, they likely haven't had to use it since they took part in standardized tests in school.
I find it interesting that we can figure out apologetic reasoning as to why deficient mass education in social sciences with daily, real-life applications are acceptable, but deficient mass education in advanced studies which few people will ever use is a source of shame. China has already repeated the mistake that America made in its shift towards standardized testing-based, one-size-fits-all education.
The description of the map :
World map of average IQ per country based on data in the Richard Lynn book Race Differences in Intelligence (2006). This map represents average aboriginal IQ, not average IQ of a nation's current inhabitants (e.g. South African IQ excludes all white, asian, and hispanic peoples; USA IQ includes only native americans).
The description of the map :
World map of average IQ per country based on data in the Richard Lynn book Race Differences in Intelligence (2006). This map represents average aboriginal IQ, not average IQ of a nation's current inhabitants (e.g. South African IQ excludes all white, asian, and hispanic peoples; USA IQ includes only native americans).
Seems incredibly racist.
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