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Old 03-13-2008, 10:23 AM
RH1
 
Location: Lincoln, UK
1,160 posts, read 4,233,405 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223 View Post
I mean people actively writing a work of fiction or non-fiction.

I have one published, a humorous novel, and working on my second. To put food on the table, I work as a marketing/advertising consultant, which means I sell my soul by day and buy it back at night.

So, if you write, talk about what you're working on. If you'd like to write, tell us what's stopping you. Maybe we can help.
You've already helped me quite a bit in one of the other threads so thanks for that advice. I went off and did exactly what you suggested, but now I've stopped again because as soon as I got time to toss the idea around in my head, I dismissed it as a silly idea and started to spot various potential problems, then began to think "well that ending... maybe it's a bit of a cop out.."

I'm also concerned that, because I've identified various fragments from previous writing that I like and found a way to sit them together, I might be shoving them together in an unnatural way and an uneasiness is going to come through - like a join in a wall that you can never quite sand over smoothly.

This has always been my problem in whatever I do; I'm my own harshest and most irrational critic - usually before I've finished, sometimes even before I've started. Any tips on that, anyone? Especially when time is a scarce resource so I'm reluctant to waste any...

I work full time and am a commissioned artist in my (not nearly enough) spare time, so either painting or writing has to step aside (and the former pays). I do take comfort from the fact that, as sidelines, neither need you to be in the flush of youth to make a go of it. So I'll always have something to do when I finally make it to 60 (or 65...)
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Old 03-13-2008, 01:12 PM
 
Location: Piedmont NC
4,596 posts, read 11,446,142 times
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Default Maybe a different genre?

Sometimes, I have wondered if a different genre, entirely, would get me moving.

Over the years, I have convinced myself I cannot write fiction, it has to be real (which has been the sum total of most of my writing experience). My husband smiles, and says, "pretend it is nonfiction," which sounds easy enough but it doesn't work.

I have wondered if maybe story ideas I have/get wouldn't be better developed as scripts for a tv movie, or play, or something -- or even just write in that genre, much like some writers do. Wilde comes to mind, as does George Bernard Shaw, and some American playwrights whose names escape me at the moment -- playwrights whose work is written more to be read than performed.

And couldn't a frustrated author/writer make money selling just story lines? I have one I'd love to see Stephen King develop.
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Old 03-13-2008, 06:47 PM
 
Location: Journey's End
10,203 posts, read 27,113,560 times
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Some thoughts that went through my head this afternoon: I started writing on the computer and virtually gave up writing with pen and paper.

I think there is a different stream of consciousness that takes place--almost organic--when we use our hand to head, the pen and pencil approach and not the typewritten (computer) approach. One of several observations I've made is I remember everything better if I write it rather than type it.

Also, RDSLOTS, as you are a King fan, wonder if you've read his book On Writing? Although it's quite some time since I read it, I found it impressive and just ordered a second hand copy (as a refresher).

The other book I thought was a good quick learning tool is Ray Bradbury's book on his writing process. It's out of print these days, but it is slim, inexpensive and a quick read. What impressed me about Bradbury's approach is the simplicity of it: he enters his studio filled with stimulating objects, focuses on any one of them, and writes. Yes, he may write about a pen that becomes a villain or a child's toy that becomes an evil clown, but it all starts out with one single object. I found that fascinating and it was something I often did with my Theological Writing Group (1990s, Boston). It is also a writing prompt in many writing groups I've either led or participated in. We took some random words, put them on white pieces of paper, placed them in a cup/cap or bowl, and then put our hand in and voila: a word, a story!

These are just basically intended to rev up the writing juices. You may get a really good story out of that word or a remarkable poem, but essentially these exercises are warm ups.

Another approach to get the juices going is what is called Proprioceptive Writing. Linda Metcalf and her partner, Toby, coined this phrase and give workshops across the country on the technique. You can check out Linda's website here. I worked and studied with Linda and Toby in the early 90s in Portland (ME) and had enough training to be permitted to run workshops myself. I did organise and deliver workshops on several occasions in NY and NM. They work! Without going into all the details, it is also a warming up process to unleash, so to speak, the stream of consciousness and can often lead to some excellent writing. Each write as we call them lasts about 20-odd minutes. It is a ritual of sorts, but from my experience, rituals can have great value.
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:43 PM
 
502 posts, read 1,066,021 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ontheroad View Post
The other book I thought was a good quick learning tool is Ray Bradbury's book on his writing process. It's out of print these days...
totally irrelevent, but I felt compelled to say that this one is still in print and selling nicely everywhere.
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:47 PM
 
Location: Journey's End
10,203 posts, read 27,113,560 times
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Yes, a little on the irrelevant side, and perhaps reprinted as it was out of print when I was looking for it last.

But thanks for clearing it up for us, colorado native.

Quote:
Originally Posted by colorado native View Post
totally irrelevent, but I felt compelled to say that this one is still in print and selling nicely everywhere.
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Old 03-13-2008, 10:52 PM
 
Location: Piedmont NC
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Default Ironically enough

I have King's On Writing (now you wouldn't have expected less of a real King fan, would you?), and somewhere in my professional works, I may have the Bradbury book. Or I may just have the Bradbury book confused with another.

I DO appreciate the tips and suggestions. I think getting the little office set-up will keep me from getting sidetracked and distracted, and I will have to establish some sort of 'schedule' for myself, and stick to it. I have been slowly getting back into all sorts of 'literary things' -- reading more, doing things like the online book club here, continuing to jot things down in a 'writer's journal' of sorts.

I actually realized how much I missed writing when I was asked by the online newspaper advisor, at the HS where I was teaching, to write a weekly column from a teacher's perspective. I really enjoyed writing on all sorts of topics -- one of my favorite columns being an argument on "Why Grown-ups Are Cool," which led to some fun discussions with the kids. That, and a column on "Things You Always Wanted to Say to Your Parents, But Knew Better. . ."

It went like this. . .

Mother: "I suppose if all of your friends jumped off the Empire State Building, you'd jump, too?"

Kid: "Of course not. Somebody'd have to live to tell the tale." OR, "Of course -- with NO friends, what would I have to live for?!"

All of those ridiculous things parents say to their children, you know.
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Old 03-14-2008, 09:42 AM
 
Location: Journey's End
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Sounds as if you are all set, RDSLOTS, now where is that pen?
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Old 03-14-2008, 10:23 AM
 
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I don't want to cool anybody's ardor on books about writing. In fact Annie Dillard writes wonderfully on the subject. And, you should really do yourself a favor and buy/checkout Writers At Work, the collection of the Paris Reviews interviews of the greatest writers of the 20th Century. Also, here's an indispensable book: The First Five Pages, by Noah Lukeman. Great, no-nonsense advice on how to actually ensure that you submit a quality manuscript, especially in terms of writing style.

Yet, all that being said, there comes a time when you have to put down the books on writing and do the actual writing yourself. Writing books are kind of like writer's conferences. The first one is a revelation. The second one confirms a lot of what you've already learned. The third one is old hat, unless you've really progressed to specific refinements of your technique.

Mind you, I am NOT saying any of this to downplay your enthusiasm. All I'm saying is that the best time for you to satisfy your passion is now. That means, there's no substitute for sitting down and writing your 500 words a day. Heck, my theory is now to just really polish one page a day. One page. Edit the bejeezus out of the thing. Commit to taking the baby steps every day, and you'll really be amazed at how far you progress.

RH1: It's okay to think your ending is a cop-out. That means you just need to keep at it. Ask yourself some hard questions about plot and character. Because it's all about character, how do you want them to develop? What is the finished product? That will tell you a lot about how to end things. Keep at it a little longer, and you'll be surprised when something reveals itself to you.
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Old 03-14-2008, 10:31 AM
 
Location: Piedmont NC
4,596 posts, read 11,446,142 times
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Default About that pen. . .

You know, funny you should have mentioned actually putting pen-to-paper earlier, on the road.


I know exactly what you mean about the connection between the brain/head and the ideas there, and moving the hand with a pen across the parchment. I have page after page after page of handwritten chapters of my own story. Pieces of it will come to me -- once riding home from the courthouse, in the car. I could hear it in my head, and it sounded too good to try to commit to memory. I grabbed my teacher's bookbag, a legal pad and pencil, and went to it. In the course of a 20 minute drive home, I had a good, solid, five pages.

I also used to advise my own students to sort of write all over the place, that a story, essay, poem, whatever, didn't necessarily have to begin at the beginning or the introduction. If it is the ending/clincher that you have, work backwards. Or begin anywhere that seems to be where you are -- sometimes, for me, it's been in the middle, or when writing features for a publication, it may have started with a quote or even just a word.

In NC, 10th graders take a writing test, based in some part upon world literature. Tough test. I used to tell them to think of their response to the question/prompt in a sentence, let that be their conclusion, and work from the stance that now they had to "prove" it. We'd spend whole weeks on just coming up with support for an argument, another several weeks on interesting intros, still more weeks on transitions, and equally interesting (and hopefully, thought-provoking) conclusions.

I recall sharing with them that I truly feel most good writers are indeed, born, but anyone can improve upon their writing, regardless.


Just talking about writing is helping. Strange, huh?

Maybe not.
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Old 03-14-2008, 10:32 AM
 
Location: Journey's End
10,203 posts, read 27,113,560 times
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I hope I didn't give the impression that reading about writing is writing.

Good recommendations.

Quote:
I don't want to cool anybody's ardor on books about writing. In fact Annie Dillard writes wonderfully on the subject. And, you should really do yourself a favor and buy/checkout Writers At Work, the collection of the Paris Reviews interviews of the greatest writers of the 20th Century. Also, here's an indispensable book: The First Five Pages, by Noah Lukeman. Great, no-nonsense advice on how to actually ensure that you submit a quality manuscript, especially in terms of writing style.
In fact I found this little adventure of mine quite informing. I went to a reading at the Harwood Museum (in Taos), excited at the prospect of meeting Natalie Goldberg of "Writing Down the Bones" fame. She was introducing a young, new writer and was reading herself.

I was thoroughly disappointed in Ms. Goldberg's writings and aglow with praise for the young writer. While Ms. Goldberg has created a series of good writers' materials, I don't find her particularly a good writer.

For the record, the young writer was Goldberry Long of the Juniper Tree Burning.
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