Memo To Grammar Cops: Back Off! (speech, money, quote, words)
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If you don't correct them how are they going to learn?
I think incorrect English interferes with comprehension of what the speaker is trying to say. For instance, I have seen clothing sellers online who describe something as "embellished with sequence" or this dress is "for sell". Yes, we can figure out what they are trying to say but it is annoying and it slows down the comprehension process to have to translate what they are saying.
So, yes, they can eventually be understood, but the communication is not as effective as it would have been if they had written it correctly in the first place.
(pounding fist--just came from a site on which someone talked about the whaling wall.....and I don't think they were referring to a fishing village either.)
I'm sorry, but I laughed. I'm with you--unless you have a valid learning disability, there is no excuse for not using correct English, especially spelling. If you've READ the word, you know how to spell it. It's in your memory, and it only takes a moment to call it up on that little screen inside your forehead and read it off.
And now we pledge allegiance to the flag...and to the Republic for Richard Stands...
Swear by the gods, once when I was little, my littler sister was instructed to say the Lord's Prayer as grace before an enormous extended family dinner. And she said: "Our Father, who aren't in Heaven, halibut be thy name..." Somehow we all managed to avoid snickering.
I would think that using a block quote with a link below would qualify as proper citation of a quotation as a matter of discussion group style.
The point was more about the the violation of the subject-verb agreement rule. I suppose one should expect poor grammar in an article that is trying to justify poor grammar.
Swear by the gods, once when I was little, my littler sister was instructed to say the Lord's Prayer as grace before an enormous extended family dinner. And she said: "Our Father, who aren't in Heaven, halibut be thy name..." Somehow we all managed to avoid snickering.
An interesting article about english grammar and those who go screaming into the night to protect it.
"To protests that the language police are only protecting the accuracy, precision and clarity of our tongue, Lynch lifts a skeptical eyebrow. Many of the most roundly deplored "debasements" of English are nevertheless perfectly comprehensible: I didn't confuse you by writing "Ain't it the truth?" in my opening paragraph, did I? The only truly unbreakable rules of grammar and usage are the ones that, when broken, result in a genuine failure to communicate. The rest is a form of covert class warfare, and today's usage reproofs constitute a status-protecting thump on the head delivered by the upper middle class to uppity members of the lower middle."
And what do you do with someone like me? I had a geed education and wonderful English teachers who actually understood grammar and dangling participles. I diagramed so many sentences I dreamed I was in English class at night. I alway received good grades in all English classes statring about fourth grade.
Then I had a stroke.
It took months before I could understand what I read. It was even longer before I could write a coherent sentence correctly. It was nearly five years before I could finish a simple crossword puzzle - and I used to complete the NY Times Sunday puzzle. The rules I knew so well are still a mystery today. I can't define a noun, tense is correct most of the time, but to this day, my punctuation requires the Grammar Police.
I wish someone here would start a basic Grammar class. I would be trying to relearn what I once knew.
Arts, music, painting etc. have never had written standards that serve as guidelines. There is no set of rules that apply to these creative endeavors. And there shouldn't be. These are universal expressions of creativity, whereas language is not. The English language is our common currency and as such, requires preservation with standards and rules. Once understood, these rules can be bent, even broken. But the baseline must be preserved if the language is to survive.
I'm not sure about that... music majors learn 'rules' of counterpoint and musical forms and they are quite strict. Dancers learn the 'rules' for the correct duplication of steps and maneuvers; painters learn the 'rules' of perspective and color combinations, etc. These rules are written and there are textbooks and exams. Every discipline has its body of pedagogy and every class has its rebel innovator who shakes things up and is thrown out of Conservatory as unteachable and then goes on to found a new expression of that disciplines ideas. Or not. Not picking on you, I get your point, and agree but I've had one too many burned out Music Major cry on my shoulder about the 'rules' and how they couldn't abide them.
And what do you do with someone like me? I had a geed education and wonderful English teachers who actually understood grammar and dangling participles. I diagramed so many sentences I dreamed I was in English class at night. I alway received good grades in all English classes statring about fourth grade.
Then I had a stroke.
I've seen this: an impairment that is no fault of the poster's. On forums that allow .sig files, one option is to mention something about it there. This one doesn't offer them, unfortunately. I also thought about forums having an icon a user could check to indicate ESL or a typing-affecting disability. On another forum where I was a mod, we had a regular who was either severely dyslexic or legally blind and it was a triumph of the will for him to post. Now and then some newb would rag him about his typing, and we would quickly correct the ragger, but in the ideal situation there'd be a flag to indicate that a given user has a good reason for typos, grammar issues and so on. If something happened to me, I'd surely want it. And if this were a French forum (for example), I'd welcome a FCLE (my guess...'francais comme langue etrangere') label so that people'd realize French is not my first language and not presume I was willfully semiliterate.
I'm not sure about that... music majors learn 'rules' of counterpoint and musical forms and they are quite strict. Dancers learn the 'rules' for the correct duplication of steps and maneuvers; painters learn the 'rules' of perspective and color combinations, etc. These rules are written and there are textbooks and exams. Every discipline has its body of pedagogy and every class has its rebel innovator who shakes things up and is thrown out of Conservatory as unteachable and then goes on to found a new expression of that disciplines ideas. Or not. Not picking on you, I get your point, and agree but I've had one too many burned out Music Major cry on my shoulder about the 'rules' and how they couldn't abide them.
H
Of course there are rules and guidelines for these disciplines. The point I was trying to make was about the universality of these arts versus the non-universality of the English language. If you go to a villager in, say India, and dance a waltz, show them a painting by Van Gogh, or play them some Ella Fitzgerald, they will likely understand that they have seen and heard dancing, art and music, however different than their own forms of these expressions. They may be profoundly moved or profoundly puzzled, but they will recognize the art form presented.
But read them an O'Henry short story or a poem by Poe and it will be lost to them. It is a specific language we are discussing here. And as with all arts, the rules must be learned before they can be bent or broken. If the only directive for ones language is to "effectively communicate" then why is there great literature?
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