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Your posts outline your guesses as to how the cosmos works
and the nature of the entity which controls it all. What you do not provide is any reason to think that
your assertions are anything other than ungrounded assertions. Are you aware that this forum is a collective of people who subscribe to a rational approach to questions?
That we have a general contempt for the idea of simply choosing to believe something without investigating
and determining the validity of the belief?
What distinguishes your assertions about the nature of god from anyone else's assertions?
Why should anyone here think that your answers are the answers?
[BDon't come here and simply proclaim things, that is just you making noise. [/b]
This is not a place where your sort of emotionalism will play well.
Ok. My mistake.... to toss in another perspective about Natural Disasters.
I thought it would be interesting to hear from a "they" that has "beliefs" as in the Thread Title.
Won't be back, my bad.
Sorry for the others that may have wanted to respond to my posts.
You can always pm me.
Take care.
Ok. My mistake.... to toss in another perspective about Natural Disasters.
I thought it would be interesting to hear from a "they" that has "beliefs" as in the Thread Title.
Won't be back, my bad.
Sorry for the others that may have wanted to respond to my posts.
You can always pm me.
Take care.
I grew up in the South and was frequently exposed to the "Oh dear, you're angry with little old me?" form of pretense. I gathered that the idea was that we were supposed to believe that the person is shocked to learn that anyone would react poorly to their oh so innocent and benevolent remarks.
I found it ridiculous then and my opinion of the dynamic has not improved any since.
My thought every time is "who do you think sent the disaster"? He just did a bad job.
We've already discussed that God has no involvement in anything bad that may happen. Those things just happen by...chance? He is only given the credit when it's something positive.
"Not really"= rude and unnecessary, didn't need to be expressed.
Yet, at the same time it interested you enuff to respond to.
Have I ever? Every single solitairy day.
In the midst of wondering why with tears of gratitude...an old friend said,
"You're no more special than anyone else...but you listen and are open."
(I would add to that I also am sincerely desirous of His Divine Presence.)
An 'old friend' said 'you listen and are open(sic)'? I would declare that you are the opposite on both accounts.
Q:To whom are you listening? It's certainly not logic and reasoning. First if all, it really bothers me that you believers have your own individual concepts of god, and likewise, your own concepts of reality too. You come here making all of these claims about what god is and isn't, as if you know the very mind of god. How do you know this? Who let you in on this information and why isn't it available to everyone else? It just takes an extreme amount of arrogance to implore "you have all of the answers" because "you 'listen and are open'(sic)" and the agnostics "just don't get it...." because we don't listen and are not open... and you're telling me, I'm rude? Do you not realize how offensive it is to others that you're essentially claiming to know it all, but in reality, you probably know nothing?
Q:Open to what? A happy delusion? If religion is working for you, I'm glad the power of belief is working for you. It doesn't make it true though. It just makes it true for you. Myself, I'm simply not comfortable believing in patterns where none exist. I could never worship what is tantamount to a Rorshach Blot.
Happy believing!
I notice you frequent the atheist forum in times of tragedy- the Boston bombing and now the Oklahoma tornados..... coincidence?
Last edited by SteelDragon; 05-25-2013 at 07:23 PM..
If religion is working for you, I'm glad the power of belief is working for you. It doesn't make it true though. It just makes it true for you.
Technically, it doesn't even make it "true for her" ... to borrow from Steven Colbert, it makes it "truthy" for her.
I am what I am because in the long run it's better for me to acknowledge what's actually true, actually untrue, and actually unknown / unknowable than to embrace what I want or wish to be true and then seek out ideas, experiences, writings and people that feel subjectively "truthy" around those wants or wishes. Theists are what they are because "truthy" suffices for them. They object to unbelief because to in any way wrap their minds around why people don't believe reduces that "truthiness".
This is not limited to religion. Just one example: the TV series The Dog Whisperer. If you've ever seen Cesar Milan one or two times you find he is adamant that all problems with all dogs are surmountable, a comforting idea which any dog owner tends to find "truthy". If there is an intractable dog problem, it's always the owner's fault somehow (not sometimes, or somewhat, but always) because he "rehabilitates dogs and trains people" to be "pack leaders". The inconvenient fact that some dogs don't listen to any kind of leadership and/or aren't worth the effort to get them to do so is not allowed because it undermines the premise of the show and of his own services. He even uses quasi-Eastern ideas, constantly talking about good or bad "energy" emanating from the owner, and asserting that if you can "achieve a calm assertive state" in yourself the dog will invariably fall into a "calm submissive state". Not that there is zero to his ideas or that he isn't an amazingly intuitive guy with some great tips, but no, that's not enough: every problem has to be solvable if you can just get it "right". This is exactly the same generic message as religion provides ...
Christianity: "Are you weary, are you heavy laden? Tell it to Jesus" (quoting a creaky old hymn, which goes on to suggest all your burdens will vanish -- a perfect basis for "truthiness".)
Buddhism: "Life is suffering but if you can just (not) think a certain paradoxical way you won't care that it's that way and will always have an enigmatic smile on your face". (Offering "truthy" escape from the harsh realities of life).
... and so forth.
Of course a Christian or a Buddhist for whom these paradigms currently works more than not will object that I'm mis-characterizing or over-simplifying but I'm getting too old to keep not calling a spade a spade and deferring to all these baroque ideas about how one should live that are at least as baroque as life is all by itself.
My thought every time is "who do you think sent the disaster"? He just did a bad job.
That is actually quite brilliant and deserves a rep. Either God sent the storm and did a poor job of protecting the ones who survived with a bit of damage or loss...I am feeling a heel for making polemic out of this tragedy, but these people have got to understand that the 'God saved me' stuff doesn't stand up - or it was a natural tragedy for which nobody was responsible. And those who survived were the fortunate receipients of favourable random factors. Plus of course a few 'good calls'.
On a side note, I just saw on the weather channel, a clip showing a pastor ask "Why did God take a school and not a church?" I guess it really depends on the person as to whether they will put the blame on God for these disasters or not.
On a side note, I just saw on the weather channel, a clip showing a pastor ask "Why did God take a school and not a church?" I guess it really depends on the person as to whether they will put the blame on God for these disasters or not.
I wonder whether he will come to the conclusion that God could not possibly have done such a thing and reason his way from there?
On a side note, I just saw on the weather channel, a clip showing a pastor ask "Why did God take a school and not a church?" I guess it really depends on the person as to whether they will put the blame on God for these disasters or not.
I wonder what he says when a church is destroyed?
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