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Raised Catholic, only 3-4 years atheist. It started when I quit drinking and I went from Catholic to non denominational to spiritual to agnostic to atheist. My transition was painful for many reasons, but being an atheist is also still painful. And I now understand why the "angry atheist" is a thing.
The upside to atheism is that it revealed what I was made of in the way of my non-profit work. It's no longer a way into heaven or in avoidance of hell. I know now that my motivations were genuinely driven by compassion. My work is far more gratifying and I am way more driven. I get to own my achievements and successes 100%. But my work, and my dog, are the only sources of joy in my life anymore. Oh, and food.
Which brings me to the downside. I can't relate to most people. Marriage, that was once everything to me, is now pointless. Monogamy as well. The old romantic is at constant odds with the new me, a Sheldon-like goof who sees love as nothing more than a chemical/biological draw. I don't have the filter of faith, the insulation of God's love, the buffer of Jesus between me and life's ugliness anymore. The world, as I know it now, wears me out. It is overwhelming. It also falls flat. I still find joy in little things, but those big things that made life so grand are just no more. I feel like I've been robbed. And I'm pretty p|ssed about that.
For those of you who went from faith to atheism, what was the transition like for you? And how are you now?
Internally it was a breeze, no more difficult to manage than the before and after of Santa Claus belief.
Externally I was still surrounded by Catholics...family and school, so there was some outer conflict. I'd like to pretend that these hostilities did something horrible to my character, but the truth is I got a bang out of all the arguments because I was so confident of the correctness of my positions despite the majority around me. I very much identified with the boy in the Emperor's New Clothes who points out that the emperor is actually wearing noting. Being so badly outnumbered gave it an aura of noble romance.
It also caused me to conclude that a large number of people in positions of authority over me, were absolute idiots and thus forfeited their right to advise me about anything. That wasn't so wise on my part, I have subsequently recognized that all intelligence is compartmentalized, and deficiency in one area doth not a fool make. Things might have gone smoother had I caught on to that sooner.
Raised Catholic, only 3-4 years atheist. It started when I quit drinking and I went from Catholic to non denominational to spiritual to agnostic to atheist. My transition was painful for many reasons, but being an atheist is also still painful. And I now understand why the "angry atheist" is a thing.
The upside to atheism is that it revealed what I was made of in the way of my non-profit work. It's no longer a way into heaven or in avoidance of hell. I know now that my motivations were genuinely driven by compassion. My work is far more gratifying and I am way more driven. I get to own my achievements and successes 100%. But my work, and my dog, are the only sources of joy in my life anymore. Oh, and food.
Which brings me to the downside. I can't relate to most people. Marriage, that was once everything to me, is now pointless. Monogamy as well. The old romantic is at constant odds with the new me, a Sheldon-like goof who sees love as nothing more than a chemical/biological draw. I don't have the filter of faith, the insulation of God's love, the buffer of Jesus between me and life's ugliness anymore. The world, as I know it now, wears me out. It is overwhelming. It also falls flat. I still find joy in little things, but those big things that made life so grand are just no more. I feel like I've been robbed. And I'm pretty p|ssed about that.
For those of you who went from faith to atheism, what was the transition like for you? And how are you now?
I am surprised that you find marriage and monogamy pointless. Was fear of God the only thing that kept you faithful to your spouse? Monogamous marriage is the common custom among most human societies, regardless of religion. Also among many species, so it is obviously an evolved tendency to fall in love and agree to devote oneself to that one person.
Marriage, that was once everything to me, is now pointless. Monogamy as well. The old romantic is at constant odds with the new me, a Sheldon-like goof who sees love as nothing more than a chemical/biological draw.
I'm not sure why you think marriage has no meaning without religion. I didn't marry in a church or as part of a church, but I am married (36 years) and monogamous. Religion had nothing to do with it.
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Last edited by PNW-type-gal; 03-28-2018 at 03:04 PM..
Raised Catholic, only 3-4 years atheist. It started when I quit drinking and I went from Catholic to non denominational to spiritual to agnostic to atheist. My transition was painful for many reasons, but being an atheist is also still painful. And I now understand why the "angry atheist" is a thing.
The upside to atheism is that it revealed what I was made of in the way of my non-profit work. It's no longer a way into heaven or in avoidance of hell. I know now that my motivations were genuinely driven by compassion. My work is far more gratifying and I am way more driven. I get to own my achievements and successes 100%. But my work, and my dog, are the only sources of joy in my life anymore. Oh, and food.
Which brings me to the downside. I can't relate to most people. Marriage, that was once everything to me, is now pointless. Monogamy as well. The old romantic is at constant odds with the new me, a Sheldon-like goof who sees love as nothing more than a chemical/biological draw. I don't have the filter of faith, the insulation of God's love, the buffer of Jesus between me and life's ugliness anymore. The world, as I know it now, wears me out. It is overwhelming. It also falls flat. I still find joy in little things, but those big things that made life so grand are just no more. I feel like I've been robbed. And I'm pretty p|ssed about that.
For those of you who went from faith to atheism, what was the transition like for you? And how are you now?
Very good, and thanks for that, and you might expand on 'atheist anger' as it is much misunderstood - deliberately, of course, but also genuine misunderstanding.
We Are angry.I am angry. Furiously angry, and if I don't come across as angry, but a cheery, compassionate nice guy....what's that? Bugger off. ....it's because I am not angry at believers. I rather feel compassion for them as they struggle to think without thinking, argue without arguments and believe without good reason. No. It's the century long global and often violent con of religion that I am angry about, and that also goes for Communist dogma, and a good deal of political manipulation of the flock of dupes.
So, while it isn't easy for you - I am also not a mixer as I find people very unreasonable - I believe you are better off with the hard truths rather than comfy lies.
Similar to the OP, I was raised Catholic. I think I probably knew from an early age, while still in Catholic school, that I didn't "get it."
I think as child, we were taught all the fire and brimstone talk. Maybe it wasn't worded that harsh, but it all boiled down to "we are sinners and we make bad decision. We should make good decisions so we don't go to hell." That's a gross oversimplification of the tenets of Catholicism, but as a child that's what I was hearing.
I got to thinking before Confirmation (when I'd be filled with the holy spirit to help guide me) that "is the only reason I'm supposed to be a good person was to avoid retribution in the afterlife" - it just seemed like the wrong reason to do the 'right thing.' If anything, I thought it made things more dangerous to tell a child that "you be good so you don't go to hell." What if that child either says "I don't care about hell" or "I don't believe this nonsense" - in either case if the only reason that person was making what we'd call the "right choices" was to avoid some form of punishment, if that punishment is removed, why make the "right choices" at all?
I went through the motions for about 6 more years. Took my mom to church, which she appreciated. I didn't really get anything out of it.
Similar to the OP, when I do kind things for people, I do it because it is the right thing to do, not because I'm building up a pile of "God Points" for Saint Peter at the Pearly Gates.
One thing I have noticed is how harsh believers can be towards athiests. I don't advertise what I am. But if I'm cornered, I'll say it. I can't say how often someone pushes me into answering "what church I go to." I've had some budding friendships with people lost over this one issue. I don't attack their religion. Honestly, I don't even find it worth talking about. I compare discussing religion to discussing sports. Many people have no real reason for what team they follow. Maybe it was what team their parents taught them to like. And what team they like has very little bearing on the real world. Does it matter if their team wins the game? It does to them but anybody not following that sport... they don't care at all. But they get so tied up in it, the point where if you don't like their team for some reason, they verbally attack you about it.
I am surprised that you find marriage and monogamy pointless. Was fear of God the only thing that kept you faithful to your spouse? Monogamous marriage is the common custom among most human societies, regardless of religion. Also among many species, so it is obviously an evolved tendency to fall in love and agree to devote oneself to that one person.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW-type-gal
I'm not sure why you think marriage has no meaning without religion. I didn't marry in a church or as part of a church, but I am married (36 years) and monogamous. Religion had nothing to do with it.
I appreciate the question. It's not that marriage doesn't have meaning. It's more ceremonial now, not necessary. As a Catholic, it was a sacrament, so it was very important for the ticket to heaven. It was also a social achievement; an elevation of status. And I recognize that this is still the case even outside of Catholicism, but being unmarried was failure. Being an unmarried mother was shameful. And I was an unmarried mother. So I felt less-than, which influenced many of my very painful choices in life that kept me unmarried. Now, I just don't feel the draw. If I love someone, I love them. I don't need a legal document to enforce or validate it. The only benefit to marriage, at this point, would be for the legal benefits and protections.
Monogamy was fine with me. It still is. But it isn't unconditional. And looking back, it never was. Those painful choices I mentioned up there were in my relationships. I was faithful. They weren't. They were also abusive (because I felt less-than, I chose crappy men). So, I would inevitably cheat. But thems ain't the rules. I heard a lot of the usual "There is no excuse to cheat. You're no better than they are.", which reinforced my low self image. But it never felt right to me. I'm a human being. I am not designed to go without. If you break your end of the deal, all bets are off. So, monogamy feels more compulsory, especially within marriage with the whole "for better or for worse" thing, and it's just unreasonable to me. If I love you, and you're good to me, I probably won't want to go elsewhere. If not, I will.
But love, again, is different to me as well. It's more a biological/chemical bond and not all those fluffy things. Maybe I'll get there again, but I'm not really seeing it.
Very good, and thanks for that, and you might expand on 'atheist anger' as it is much misunderstood - deliberately, of course, but also genuine misunderstanding.
I meant more that I understand why people see us as angry, why I saw atheists as angry when I believed. It's because we are. I know I am.
Quote:
We Are angry.I am angry. Furiously angry, and if I don't come across as angry, but a cheery, compassionate nice guy....what's that? Bugger off. ....it's because I am not angry at believers. I rather feel compassion for them as they struggle to think without thinking, argue without arguments and believe without good reason. No. It's the century long global and often violent con of religion that I am angry about,
I agree.
Quote:
and that also goes for Communist dogma, and a good deal of political manipulation of the flock of dupes.
Can you expound on this?
Quote:
So, while it isn't easy for you - I am also not a mixer as I find people very unreasonable - I believe you are better off with the hard truths rather than comfy lies.
Similar to the OP, I was raised Catholic. I think I probably knew from an early age, while still in Catholic school, that I didn't "get it."
I think as child, we were taught all the fire and brimstone talk. Maybe it wasn't worded that harsh, but it all boiled down to "we are sinners and we make bad decision. We should make good decisions so we don't go to hell." That's a gross oversimplification of the tenets of Catholicism, but as a child that's what I was hearing.
I got to thinking before Confirmation (when I'd be filled with the holy spirit to help guide me) that "is the only reason I'm supposed to be a good person was to avoid retribution in the afterlife" - it just seemed like the wrong reason to do the 'right thing.' If anything, I thought it made things more dangerous to tell a child that "you be good so you don't go to hell." What if that child either says "I don't care about hell" or "I don't believe this nonsense" - in either case if the only reason that person was making what we'd call the "right choices" was to avoid some form of punishment, if that punishment is removed, why make the "right choices" at all?
I went through the motions for about 6 more years. Took my mom to church, which she appreciated. I didn't really get anything out of it.
Similar to the OP, when I do kind things for people, I do it because it is the right thing to do, not because I'm building up a pile of "God Points" for Saint Peter at the Pearly Gates.
One thing I have noticed is how harsh believers can be towards athiests. I don't advertise what I am. But if I'm cornered, I'll say it. I can't say how often someone pushes me into answering "what church I go to." I've had some budding friendships with people lost over this one issue. I don't attack their religion. Honestly, I don't even find it worth talking about. I compare discussing religion to discussing sports. Many people have no real reason for what team they follow. Maybe it was what team their parents taught them to like. And what team they like has very little bearing on the real world. Does it matter if their team wins the game? It does to them but anybody not following that sport... they don't care at all. But they get so tied up in it, the point where if you don't like their team for some reason, they verbally attack you about it.
A friend of mine told me a while ago that it is more acceptable to go after atheists than it is to be a racist. I thought, naaaah. It's absolutely true. White sups aren't even as honest about their hatred of people of color.
Similar to the OP, I was raised Catholic. I think I probably knew from an early age, while still in Catholic school, that I didn't "get it."
I think as child, we were taught all the fire and brimstone talk. Maybe it wasn't worded that harsh, but it all boiled down to "we are sinners and we make bad decision. We should make good decisions so we don't go to hell." That's a gross oversimplification of the tenets of Catholicism, but as a child that's what I was hearing.
I got to thinking before Confirmation (when I'd be filled with the holy spirit to help guide me) that "is the only reason I'm supposed to be a good person was to avoid retribution in the afterlife" - it just seemed like the wrong reason to do the 'right thing.' If anything, I thought it made things more dangerous to tell a child that "you be good so you don't go to hell." What if that child either says "I don't care about hell" or "I don't believe this nonsense" - in either case if the only reason that person was making what we'd call the "right choices" was to avoid some form of punishment, if that punishment is removed, why make the "right choices" at all?
I went through the motions for about 6 more years. Took my mom to church, which she appreciated. I didn't really get anything out of it.
Similar to the OP, when I do kind things for people, I do it because it is the right thing to do, not because I'm building up a pile of "God Points" for Saint Peter at the Pearly Gates.
One thing I have noticed is how harsh believers can be towards athiests. I don't advertise what I am. But if I'm cornered, I'll say it. I can't say how often someone pushes me into answering "what church I go to." I've had some budding friendships with people lost over this one issue. I don't attack their religion. Honestly, I don't even find it worth talking about. I compare discussing religion to discussing sports. Many people have no real reason for what team they follow. Maybe it was what team their parents taught them to like. And what team they like has very little bearing on the real world. Does it matter if their team wins the game? It does to them but anybody not following that sport... they don't care at all. But they get so tied up in it, the point where if you don't like their team for some reason, they verbally attack you about it.
Very good, and revealing. You must have been a smart kid to crack the false rationale behind: "If you don't believe in God, you have no morality" Though of course the debunker to that is simple.
"You only do good to please God so as to get into heaven."
"No I don't. "
"They why do you do it."
"Because it's a good thing to do."
"That's why I do it, too."
But you may have missed something - Faith, not Works. What you do is not what gets you into heaven, but what you believe. I don't know why this idea of doing good works is wagged around so much when it actually doesn't get you anywhere in theological terms. Heaven or hell is decided on the basis of what you believe.
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....it's because I am not angry at believers. I rather feel compassion for them as they struggle to think without thinking, argue without arguments and believe without good reason. No. It's the century long global and often violent con of religion that I am angry about, and that also goes for Communist dogma, and a good deal of political manipulation of the flock of dupes.
