Margaritaville hopes to drop anchor in downtown Atlanta (buyers, luxury)

[Iconographer]

Originally Posted by joey86

Here's a section taken from the article linked by samiwas. The article also notes that John Carson, who recorded the songs at the Nassau St building, was not the first country musician to record.

"Carson’s commemorative ballad “Little Mary Phagan” caught fire, especially among mill workers outraged by the crime and by what they perceived as attempts by Phagan’s supervisor and suspected killer Leo Frank to buy his way out of responsibility for it. On the day of Frank’s 1915 lynching, Carson sang the song for a crowd gathered at the Marietta Courthouse until he was hoarse."

Here's some of the lyrics from the song referenced above. I'm posting this so people here will know what kind of person made the recordings that gave the Nassau St building its history. Wikipidea also states that Carson was a regular a KKK rallies.

Fiddlin' John Carson & Rosa Lee Carson:Little Mary Phagan

"Little Mary Phagan, she went to town one day
She went to the pencil fact'ry, to get her little pay
She left her home at eleven, when she kissed her mother good-bye
Not one time did the po' child think, she was goin' right to die

Leo Frank met her, with a blues we hardly know
He smiled and said, "Lil' Mary, now you go home no mo'"
He sneaked along behind her, 'til she reached the little room
He laughed and said, "Lil' Mary, you met your fatal doom"

She fell upon her knees, to Leo Frank she pled
Because she was virtuous, he hit her across the head
The tears rolled down her rosy cheeks, the blood flowed down her back
She remembered tellin' her mother what time she would be back

He killed lil' Mary Phagan, was on one holiday
Then called for ol' Jim Conley to take her body away
He took her to the basement, bound hand and feet
Down in the basement, lil' Mary lay asleep

Newt Lee was the watchman, when he went to wind the key
Down in the basement, lil' Mary he could see
He called for the officers, their names I do not know
They came to the pencil factr'y, saying, "Newt Lee, you must go"

They took him to the jailhouse, locked him in a cell
The poor ol' innocent ni**er, knew nothin' for to tell
I have a notion in my head, when Frank comes to die
He took his damnation in the courthouse in the sky"

Does Atlanta really want a commemorative to this?

[JMatl]

Originally Posted by Iconographer

Does Atlanta really want a commemorative to this?

Not just no, but hell no.

[joey86]

Originally Posted by Iconographer

Does Atlanta really want a commemorative to this?

I would hope not. I doubt anyone who has actually researched John Carson would want to preserve the building because of his recordings. Even as a lifelong fan of early country music, I had never heard of John Carson outside of his connection to the Nassau St building, and the fight to preserve the building. His recordings made little lasting impact.

If people want to fight to preserve the building because it's a nice looking old brick nuilding, from the outside at least, that's one thing, but we shouldn't even have a plaque outside it referencing the recordings made there, unless it states that the recordings of John Carson may have lead to the lynching of Leo Frank, and that the lynching was celebrated by Carson. The history of the Nassau St building is one we should want to move past. Bring on Margaritaville.

[aries4118]

Originally Posted by joey86

...
If people want to fight to preserve the building because it's a nice looking old brick [b]uilding, from the outside at least, that's one thing, but we shouldn't even have a plaque outside it referencing the recordings made there, unless they state that the recordings of John Carson may have lead to the lynching of Leo Frank, and that the lynching was celebrated by Carson.

...

This would be the way to go.

Preserving and commemorating history/music/culture while stating/outlining historical atrocities do not have to be mutually exclusive. And I mean this for a plethora of places throughout the South.


It would actually be the best recipe and best way forward for Atlanta, Georgia, and The American South to reconcile its history, culture, and heritage with the truth--without erasing everything into a bland "Anything U.S.A." nothingness.

[Iconographer]

Originally Posted by joey86

I would hope not. I doubt anyone who has actually researched John Carson would want to preserve the building because of his recordings. Even as a lifelong fan of early country music, I had never heard of John Carson outside of his connection to the Nassau St building, and the fight to preserve the building. His recordings made little lasting impact.

If people want to fight to preserve the building because it's a nice looking old brick nuilding, from the outside at least, that's one thing, but we shouldn't even have a plaque outside it referencing the recordings made there, unless it states that the recordings of John Carson may have lead to the lynching of Leo Frank, and that the lynching was celebrated by Carson. The history of the Nassau St building is one we should want to move past. Bring on Margaritaville.

joey, thanks for bringing a moment of clarity to this issue.

[joey86]

Originally Posted by Iconographer

joey, thanks for bringing a moment of clarity to this issue.

No problem. I am really into country, blues, and rock and roll, and I thought it was weird that I never have heard the recordings of John Carson, or even heard reference to them outside of the fight for this building, when with blues and rock, most people who are somewhat deeply into the genres have heard, or at least heard of, the recordings considered to be the firsts of the genres. It’s pretty clear to me now why John Carson isn’t referenced more among country music fans.

[arjay57]

There's plenty of Fiddlin John Carson on YouTube but don't look it up unless you are ready for some pretty raw stuff.

Atlanta does have an estimable history in early country music. However, there are other locations (e.g., Ponce City Market or the Municipal Auditorium) that are probably more historically significant.

[samiwas1]

Originally Posted by cqholt

This hotel/resort will be consuming a surface parking lot as well. I agree it would be better to incorporate the historic building row facade into the hotel. Maybe DCP, Time Keane can work with the project to preserve the facades.

Maybe that's a compromise, although you still might wonder why...

Originally Posted by joey86

I would hope not. I doubt anyone who has actually researched John Carson would want to preserve the building because of his recordings. Even as a lifelong fan of early country music, I had never heard of John Carson outside of his connection to the Nassau St building, and the fight to preserve the building. His recordings made little lasting impact.

If people want to fight to preserve the building because it's a nice looking old brick nuilding, from the outside at least, that's one thing, but we shouldn't even have a plaque outside it referencing the recordings made there, unless it states that the recordings of John Carson may have lead to the lynching of Leo Frank, and that the lynching was celebrated by Carson. The history of the Nassau St building is one we should want to move past. Bring on Margaritaville.

That's what I'm saying. It appears that no one even knew the history of this building until someone happened to stumble upon an article from nearly 100 years ago. And the history is barely memorable at best. A song, or maybe a few songs, were recorded in a room in the building. Whooo! But those songs have no real historical value, and they haven't been remembered. Are we going to commemorate every garage where a band who made it, started out? Is there anything truly worthwhile about Fiddlin' John Carson that warrants perpetual preservation? I'm thinking no.

[bryantm3]

considering this is just down the road from the civil rights museum, i think knowing this makes the history even more worth remembering. if the first people to record music incited the lynching of leo frank, that's probably worth noting because audio recordings themselves were fairly new at the time, and multiplied a message in a way that had never been available before.

they literally used their privilege to create racist propaganda. that could really be a key untold part of the puzzle in the story of civil rights in atlanta and could really be insightful. similarly, the newspaper in forsyth county has destroyed or hidden all the copies of the newspapers from three days in 1908 when basically a pogram was seiged against all the black residents, property was destroyed and every black person fled the county. it's said that the newspaper may have been key in inciting chaos. i don't think we need to cover these things up. we need to know so we don't do it again. if germany was trying to cover up its bad history we would rightly call them out... but when we do it it's okay to forget?

[aries4118]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

considering this is just down the road from the civil rights museum, i think knowing this makes the history even more worth remembering. if the first people to record music incited the lynching of leo frank, that's probably worth noting because audio recordings themselves were fairly new at the time, and multiplied a message in a way that had never been available before.

they literally used their privilege to create racist propaganda. that could really be a key untold part of the puzzle in the story of civil rights in atlanta and could really be insightful. similarly, the newspaper in forsyth county has destroyed or hidden all the copies of the newspapers from three days in 1908 when basically a pogram was seiged against all the black residents, property was destroyed and every black person fled the county. it's said that the newspaper may have been key in inciting chaos. i don't think we need to cover these things up. we need to know so we don't do it again. if germany was trying to cover up its bad history we would rightly call them out... but when we do it it's okay to forget?

Amen. Well stated. Perfect post.