Do you all think the Beltline light rail line will happen? (Atlanta: sales, neighborhood)

[aries4118]

Originally Posted by primaltech

It really aggravates me that they can't do a Krog St infill station, and have an all-Beltline MARTA light rail line (not just a streetcar), that connects/integrates directly with that station and Lindbergh.

…and the Beltline corridor crosses right under the Blue/Green lines at Hulsey.

This would be a much better way to approach everything.

[Datdudebrah]

Originally Posted by primaltech

It really aggravates me that they can't do a Krog St infill station, and have an all-Beltline MARTA light rail line (not just a streetcar), that connects/integrates directly with that station and Lindbergh.

Having to go all the way from Downtown, via 1-lane Auburn Ave shared with cars, via that slow streetcar ride, just to get up to PCM which is on North Avenue, is silly, when there's a North Avenue MARTA station, not much more than a mile away, and the Beltline corridor crosses right under the Blue/Green lines at Hulsey.

The Krog infill is one of those thing that sounds great, but in reality isn't going to happen with Hulsey Yard there. Its too bad, but at least putting the streetcar in the vicinity today opens up the possibility in the future.

Also, I don't really see an issue with the proximity of the PCM streetcar stop and North Ave station.

[cparker73]

Originally Posted by primaltech

It really aggravates me that they can't do a Krog St infill station, and have an all-Beltline MARTA light rail line (not just a streetcar), that connects/integrates directly with that station and Lindbergh.

Having to go all the way from Downtown, via 1-lane Auburn Ave shared with cars, via that slow streetcar ride, just to get up to PCM which is on North Avenue, is silly, when there's a North Avenue MARTA station, not much more than a mile away, and the Beltline corridor crosses right under the Blue/Green lines at Hulsey.

If you look at the plans for expansion of the entire streetcar network, you'll see that there will be a streetcar that follows the entire length of North Avenue from the Eastside Beltline to the Westside Beltline at the Bankhead MARTA station, so depending on where you are downtown, it may be easier to take MARTA to North Ave. and transfer to the streetcar or just go enjoy the one-seat experience down Auburn Avenue and the Beltline. Ideally, the coming expansion would go beyond PCM and into Piedmont Park to make it more useful during events, but as has been said on this forum before, mass transit in Atlanta is a multi-generational project and nothing we should expect to use in our lifetime.

[primaltech]

Originally Posted by Datdudebrah

The Krog infill is one of those thing that sounds great, but in reality isn't going to happen with Hulsey Yard there. Its too bad, but at least putting the streetcar in the vicinity today opens up the possibility in the future.

Well, I mean the thing I'd like to see would be Hulsey sold and developed by some kind of private developer with MARTA as a partner, and they'd build an infill station and also all the apartments and offices and retail and all that mixed use stuff, all integrated nicely with the station. Also the Beltline light rail would be able to have its own platform at the station, with an indoor type transfer.

[testa50]

Originally Posted by primaltech

Well, I mean the thing I'd like to see would be Hulsey sold and developed by some kind of private developer with MARTA as a partner, and they'd build an infill station and also all the apartments and offices and retail and all that mixed use stuff, all integrated nicely with the station. Also the Beltline light rail would be able to have its own platform at the station, with an indoor type transfer.

This is the sort of thing that would make the rather unpleasant project along the Beltline potentially worth it. Turn Hulsey into a commercial node, spur redevelopment along the entire Marta east-west line, set the stage for expansion to the south, etc. The Beltline EST would remain a death trap for cyclists, pedestrians, and scooters, but perhaps a reliever trail could be built or something.

Doubling down on our disastrous streetcar ensures the system won’t live up to even the most modest expectations. The connection with Marta is just awful. That streetcar set Atlanta back 10 years at least in transit, and we’d be much better off if it had never been built.

The only slight silver lining is there is a maintenance facility. That’s all it brings to the table.

[Datdudebrah]

Originally Posted by testa50

This is the sort of thing that would make the rather unpleasant project along the Beltline potentially worth it. Turn Hulsey into a commercial node, spur redevelopment along the entire Marta east-west line, set the stage for expansion to the south, etc. The Beltline EST would remain a death trap for cyclists, pedestrians, and scooters, but perhaps a reliever trail could be built or something.

Doubling down on our disastrous streetcar ensures the system won’t live up to even the most modest expectations. The connection with Marta is just awful. That streetcar set Atlanta back 10 years at least in transit, and we’d be much better off if it had never been built.

The only slight silver lining is there is a maintenance facility. That’s all it brings to the table.

Building rail on the beltline is step 1 of making that happen. Once CSX decides to sell (if ever) the connection will be relatively easy to make.

[tacosman]

I don't know if light rail will happen to the beltine or not(and more importantly what parts), but I mean if atlanta wants something that actually connects parts of atlanta in any meaningful way for non-trivial numbers of people(and doesn't involve the car), then you're not going to get that with a walking or biking trail......which is what it is now.

Very few people use bicycles as a means of transportation. Heck very few adults 'bike' period, and the ones that do overwhelmingly use it as a hobby/exercise than to get from a to b. Similar to how we use boats.

Walking(especially as an excercise or social activity or whatever for moms) is more popular. But again people aren't going to walk long distances. Nobody is saying "oh I better use my legs on the beltline and trek the 4 miles from A to B". No way.

If the beltline is going to be more than a nice walking/biking trail(not that there is anything wrong with that) and actually connect different areas of atlanta in a different way, I'm pretty sure some actual way to move people on it has to happen.

[jetgraphics]

Barring a technological breakthrough, steel wheel on steel rail is the most efficient form of land transport. Due to the co:efficient of rolling resistance, rail ways can carry 20 times as much cargo as a pneumatic tire on pavement vehicle, for the same amount of fuel / energy.
- - -
Why rail ceased to be dominant is a tribute to government collusion with certain competitors, who shall remain ignored.
- - -
And that means government funded rail projects are going to be deliberately crippled, so the nay-sayers can point their fingers and shout: "I told you so!"
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If all government meddling (taxes on rail, and subsidies on the competition) was removed, Atlanta would shift 85%-90% of all traffic to rail, in all its forms : heavy, light, urban, commuter, interurban, subway, elevated, monorail, funicular, cogwheel, etc, etc.
Who wouldn't want to save 95% on fuel costs?
And end the daily commuter traffic jam.

: : : : : :
For those skeptics who say you can't profitably run trains and provide excellent service - - -

SWISS

... Not only do Swiss trains provide the best reliability and punctuality in Europe but also they are considered to be extremely safe with good quality service. The Swiss are the most frequent train travelers in Europe with over 10,000 trains running daily on the 3000 km rail network. The Swiss rail network has the highest capacity utilization in Europe.

https://www.saveatrain.com/blog/swiss-trains-ranked-best-europe/

SWISS Federal Railways (SBB) reported a record year in 2018, with operating revenue up by 2.2% to SFr 9.6bn ($US 9.6bn) and consolidated profit increasing by 42.5% to a record SFr 568.4m.

https://www.railjournal.com/financia...record-profit/
. . . . .
FWIW - Atlanta has great potential to host a renaissance of rail transport.

[ggplicks]

Honestly no. There's lots of opposistion to it and the city of Atlanta has been completely disinterested in building any type of rail this century. Maybe there'd be BRT on the beltline LOL

[JMatl]

Originally Posted by ggplicks

Honestly no. There's lots of opposistion to it and the city of Atlanta has been completely disinterested in building any type of rail this century. Maybe there'd be BRT on the beltline LOL

Wrong, the first phase is about to get under construction.