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I blame the fact that working on cars isn't as interesting as it used to be.
I agree completely with you in some ways about that. I think cars now are just becoming over-engineered, ridiculously complex, and harder to work on. I'm planning on quitting my job at the dealership eventually and going back to just working on my cars and doing what I want to do. Doing this for a living everyday has really killed my passion for working on cars, at least other people's cars who don't give a **** about them.
But you don't think flat rate had anything at all to do with it? This unnecessary push for everything to be done faster and faster to the point of impossibility, all the unpaid time in doing this job (i.e. waiting for parts, waiting for an OK from customer, wrong parts, pushing a dead car into the shop, jumping cars with dead batteries, free MPI's, tire pressure checks, service writers underselling jobs, etc.), the list goes on and on.
jimmy ... you just wrote: "I think cars now are just becoming over-engineered, ridiculously complex, and harder to work on."
That's the exact opposite rationale of "working on cars isn't as interesting as it used to be". Fact is ... it's more challenging and interesting than ever if you're a real techie/diagnostician/mechanic.
But you've posted your attitude about this biz/profession here when you post: "Doing this for a living everyday has really killed my passion for working on cars".
OK. We get it. You've lost the drive, the interest, the motivation to be of service on other folks cars within the structure of the business model you're working in.
IMO, if you were really still passionate about this biz, you'd be seeking out the ways to fulfill your goals/dreams/professional career development.
But you seek to rationalize why it's time to leave this biz. Blaming it on a compensation plan that doesn't fit your program is only a crutch. Maybe you're in the wrong shop for your work ethic/personality? maybe it's the "golden boy" syndrome that you're seeing is "unfair"? so many possibilities present, but you have control. Denial of service is within your grasp.
Perhaps it's time for you to move on to something else. Do so instead of aggravating yourself about something you can't change in the current employment.
Curiosity here: have you considered that going forward with higher levels of professional training to enhance your skillset/value to your employer might help you reach your financial and professional goals?
PS: I know that if I had anybody in my employ so dissatisfied with being in the biz that I'd move them out ASAP. No point having an unhappy camper in my shop to potentially affect my other workers.
PPS: I just spent an afternoon working to put together a big JD tractor diesel engine ... major overhaul. 5 other techs were in the shop. When I needed assistance moving the block around, or guiding a connecting rod into place when a piston was going into a cylinder ... the guys around me would see that I was ready to do so and ask if I needed help then. With a nod, they all assisted as needed with a smile on their face. But they know that when they run into difficult diagnostics or need some advice re tooling/techniques ... I'll drop everything to be of assistance. What goes 'round ....
Shrug, I used to work on my cars at home. Previously I had a lift in my garage, I've got an air compressor, air tools, etc. Aside from a few specialty "one-off" tools for rare jobs, there wasn't much that a professional mechanic had at a shop that I didn't. I have the factory service manuals for my cars, for Porsche, it comes with an addendum that states what the billable hours are for the job.
By and large, Porsche OVERestimates the time it takes to do something. In some cases, it's pretty extreme too... To do a clutch job, you don't have to remove the engine, you just have to lower it a bit. But book calls for complete engine removal, which takes several more hours that you don't need to take.
Bottom line, I've found that billable flat rate hours are more than fair for the cars I own, and being that I used to work on them myself, just me, alone in my garage, if I can complete the work in less time than the book says, or even slightly longer, being that I'm not in an actual shop, that tells me that someone who complains that they're getting raped with a flat rate system isn't a great mechanic to begin with and should probably find a new line of work.
I really just don't enjoy all the stupid things on cars nowadays (tire sensors, ABS, how almost every part has a module with it, the list goes on and on) and want to do something else for a living so that I don't lose my passion for cars. But I still am vehemently against flat rate pay, it absolutely kills quality work and breeds the attitude of "I don't care about doing as good a job as possible, I just have to get it done"
I do know that some brands are more liberal with their labor times than others, but the brand I've worked for (Chrysler) the labor times on almost everything are a total joke. Customer pay rates are pretty fair, but warranty times are just outrageous and should be criminal.
On that note, does anyone actually know 100% how labor time are actually calculated? Because what I was told by someone was they take a car and perform the same procedure 10 times, and then take the average of the last 5 times and that's the labor time. I don't know what tools are allowed to be used, whether only hand or air tools as well, but that seems skewed from the start because of course after doing something 5 times you are going to get faster at it, but the first time you do it you'll probably lose your ass.
I agree completely with you in some ways about that. I think cars now are just becoming over-engineered, ridiculously complex, and harder to work on.
Yes, but if your at a dealership, you should have the tools. Put yourself in the shoes of the small shop owner who doesn't have compatible diagnostic software.
That tells me the tech is a rather lazy mechanic who can't be trusted to do most warranty jobs.
Maybe, maybe not, it could be the warranty rate is less than the customer pay rate and the guy not getting the warranty work is the service writers buddy. Maybe the tech gives the service writer a nice Christmas gift. (It happens in other industries.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by duster1979
I blame the fact that working on cars isn't as interesting as it used to be.
It's also a lot more technical than it used to be, with computers for just about everything. Back in the day, you could change a set of points, clean a carburetor with gumout, bleed brakes without having to worry about ABS, didn't need a laptop (or at the least a code reader), etc. to work on cars.
I really just don't enjoy all the stupid things on cars nowadays (tire sensors, ABS, how almost every part has a module with it, the list goes on and on) and want to do something else for a living so that I don't lose my passion for cars. But I still am vehemently against flat rate pay, it absolutely kills quality work and breeds the attitude of "I don't care about doing as good a job as possible, I just have to get it done"..............
You're right. You are absolutely right. It has been that way for years and years.
Actually, you sound more like a diesel truck mechanic. That's the way they work. And I have a friend who is a trailer mechanic for UPS - he works by the hour, too.
But that's just it, more people are leaving the field than coming in and I blame flat rate almost completely. One day there's going to be a shortage of techs and dealerships will have to accept the fact that this bs pay structure needs to change. If you are in business, you as the owner should assume all the risks of doing business, not your employees, and if an employee is more of a liability than an asset then they should be fired, not starved out of a job passive aggressively.
I also don't get this mentality of "if you don't like it you're free to leave, but don't you dare speak up against it and try to change anything, because it won't work anyway so just give up" Again, people like you are the reason companies can get away with murder without so much as an unkind word because "if you don't like it, just leave" **** that bull****, shops would be nowhere if no techs would work for them, we need to take the power from the employers and return it to the employees, the backbone of the business. I can't wait for the day that shops are scrambling for techs and they all refuse to work flat rape, them they will be forced to change.
Sounds like you need to work in a unionized shop - you would probably be much happier there, you know, where the employees have all the power.
But that's just it, more people are leaving the field than coming in and I blame flat rate almost completely. One day there's going to be a shortage of techs and dealerships will have to accept the fact that this bs pay structure needs to change. If you are in business, you as the owner should assume all the risks of doing business, not your employees, and if an employee is more of a liability than an asset then they should be fired, not starved out of a job passive aggressively.
I also don't get this mentality of "if you don't like it you're free to leave, but don't you dare speak up against it and try to change anything, because it won't work anyway so just give up" Again, people like you are the reason companies can get away with murder without so much as an unkind word because "if you don't like it, just leave" **** that bull****, shops would be nowhere if no techs would work for them, we need to take the power from the employers and return it to the employees, the backbone of the business. I can't wait for the day that shops are scrambling for techs and they all refuse to work flat rape, them they will be forced to change.
Actually, I agree with you. I was being a bit tongue-in-cheek with the "if you don't like it, find another job" comment. Eventually, the tipping point will be reached where auto repair facilities won't be able to find enough qualified staff to meet demand and the tables will turn. The key to a successful business is to find the balance point between treating employees well enough to attract new talent and retain existing talent, but not so well that profitability is negatively impacted. That balance point is constantly moving and sometimes entire industries are unaware of the shift until there's a shortage of qualified employees.
Mechanic competence varies widely and at some point incompetence makes said employee a liability to the company. I worked as a mechanic many years ago and once watched an ASE certified mechanic struggle with getting a newly installed engine to run correctly for an entire week. I generally mind my own business, but eventually felt sorry for him and suggested that it sounded like the firing order was wrong. He said he had hooked up the wires per markings (in magic marker) on the distributor cap put there by the owner. I looked up the vehicle in Alldata and once the plug wires were attached correctly, the truck started right up and ran great. He spent 40 hours on a 5 minute problem. Had he been payed hourly, the shop owner would have had to absorb the cost of his incompetence.
Your playing in the dealers play ground. The dealers rules, the world according to the dealer. Many in a similar situation spend time building their collection of tools and eventually open their own play ground where they can set the rules. A close friend worked for a Honda Pontiac Dealer for years. After living in that world he talked his brother in law into going in with him on a shop. Within five years he bought the brother in law out and owned it outright. A few years ago he sold that shop to one of his employees and moved out of the area. Last month he was visiting and I asked how things were going. Said retirement was not as fun as he thought so he now teaches at a school in another state. Said he loves it. Does not have to worry about working for someone but gets paid to teach others to fix cars.
When I was in High School I worked for a shop that had a similar story. The owner used to work for someone else and after he had built his tools and put some money aside he opened his shop.
A neighbor of ours does work out of his garage. He worked for a local dealer and wanted to restore cars at his home. He built a nice home shop and then people started asking him to repair their cars. He quit his job and started doing it full time right out of his house. One car at a time in the garage. You would never know that he is fixing cars all the time.
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