feathered new tires? (2015, plugs, fuel, brakes)

[NC211]

So, I put new Michelin tires on my car about 10 days ago (2015 VW GTI). Have driven maybe 800 miles since then. Car is in the dealership shop to have a wheel bearing looked at. Dealer just called me to say all 4 tires are feathered badly on their insides due to alignment. The car tracks perfectly and I have no drivable issues. So if it's out of alignment, it can't be all that bad.


Do I smell BS here? My BS detector is going off badly and considering my warranty is up in a few hundred miles, I am getting the feeling they're just pushing off the wheel bearing item until it's on my dime to replace it.

[Lux Hauler]

Ask for before and after alignment measurements, it is typical for them to provide this documentation. As for steering and handling true; yes, that can absolutely be experienced with out of spec alignment. In fact, many DIYers and enthusiasts purposefully tweak alignments (sometimes in, sometimes out of spec) in order to achieve the driving characteristics they desire.

Feathering results from an interaction of camber and toe angles. Camber can be in spec, or out of spec but equal on both sides (little to no cross-camber), combined with excessive toe (which will not be felt unless you know what you are looking for and how to test for it) and will not be felt. Cross-camber is something that will cause pulling and the tolerances are kept tight for this specification to mitigate that. I could give you a car with both excessive toe-in and camber (with no cross camber) and it will track/handle true, but wreak havoc on tires.

Bottom-line, hard to tell just from the information you have provided to know if they are fleecing you or not.

[wankel7]

What really sucks....you can't un feather your tires. Hopefully they aren't too loud now.

[NC211]

Thanks guys! I do think they're pulling a fast one on me a bit, because they did the alignment 8 months and 10,000 miles ago with the original tires that I just replaced 10 days ago, and those original tires were not feathered. So for a brand new set of tires to be severely feathered w/n 800 miles of initial usage, would mean the alignment was so badly out of whack that I would have had some idea. Of the 800 miles, 500 were a road trip down to NC and back (I live in DC) over Easter weekend. Car was perfect, but still had that slight humming noise at certain speeds. I think it's my rotors causing it though (about to replace with new OEM's anyway). This dealership's "go-to" excuse has always been the tires, regardless. Car has 35,500 miles on it now. At 9,000 miles I took it in to complain about vibrations coming from the back, and complained the rear rotors were already warped from normal highway cruising. They blamed the tires, saying there is something weird about them because they can't quite get them to balance perfectly (even with the Hunter system). Funny, kept the tires and took it back in at 15,000 miles for oil change rotate/balance, and it came back fine.


If the tires can be destroyed within 800 miles from a slight alignment issue, then I think I need to address the concern to Michelin instead of VW. That's just not acceptable. The car is 100% pure stock. I use it to commute 60 miles round trip with 90% of that trip set to cruise control. I'm a mid 40's guy, and long past my "Hotdog McGee" days. If they're slightly feathered, I'm not too worried about it as I'm sure it'll all settle itself after a few more miles and wearing of the tread. Bought the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3+.

[NC211]

Just picked up the car. While I am not a mechanic, I am not ignorant to the automotive world and have DIY'd several brake jobs, suspension bushings, cam followers, plugs, every kind've fluid, mounts, etc.. myself over the years.


The tires are absolutely fine. Still look brand new. At MOST, Toe / Camber were no more than 0.03 degrees out of spec, with most only 0.01.


Maybe over a few thousand miles with those measurements. But less than 10 days and less than 800 miles, to "feather" a set of new tires to the point of hearing noises? I don't buy it.


I'm 99% sure the noise is coming from my brakes. I bet a new set of rotors and pads and cleaning up/greasing the slider pins on the calipers will fix the problem. I suspect the floating calipers aren't floating as smoothly as they should be and the pad is ever so gently harmonizing on the rotor. Never get the noise when it's wet out, just when it's dry.


My GTI was one of the first off the line in the new assembly plant in Mexico in 2015. I've had some quality control issues with it in the past, all related to assembly. The rotors are crap and warped within 8,000 miles. The rims had to be completely replaced because they weren't finished (not painted correctly on the insides). Had the fuel pump regulator recalled due to probable damage during assembly (which explains the stalling of the car 3 times), window switch was loose, tie rod end not properly torqued down, and a few more irritating little nits. All taken care of so far, but looks like I'm ready for the brakes. Considering I just ordered all new rotors and pads (OEM) for $400, I think it's time to dust off the torque wrench myself and do this job correctly, instead of paying VW $1,400.


This dealership isn't very good, but is convenient to my office. Sometimes I think I could bring the thing into the service bay on fire, and they'd say "we could not duplicate the problem" and deny the claim. Always a hassle. Never had the problem with any of the others. In this case, it's always the tires fault. Service Tech even took an attitude when he asked who I bought my tires from (they've done that to me before), suggesting the tire shop didn't know how to install a set of tires correctly. Asked why I would go there instead of the dealership. Easy answer - $400...

[TrapperL]

ALL 4 tires? I'm not buying that. You need to have them show the tires to you.

[NC211]

I looked at them at the dealership (I showed up early to pick the car up just for this reason). They said they're feathered, but clearly they're not. Then they said they're slightly feathered, but clearly they're not. Then they said they're showing signs of starting to feather, that's when I asked for the alignment printout, and reminded them they aligned the car a few months ago, the old tires were not feathered at all, and I doubt these slight differences in camber/toe would feather these tires inside of 800 miles of driving up/down I-95. That's when they said "it's the tires, they're loud tires." That's when I barked and said they're the only people on the face of the planet to say new Michelin tires are loud tires, and goes against the thousands of positive reviews for these specific tires that specifically rave about how quiet they are. Specifically for the GTI itself!


The only mechanic that looked like he knew they were BSing me stood quiet. I turned to him and simply asked "how are my wheel bearings?" - "They're fine sir. If they were bad, it would roar louder and louder with speed, which this isn't doing", and I agreed. Looked at the service tech and said "then it's the brakes, like I suspected". At which point he offered to replace them for $1,400. I said that's ok, the OEM's will be at my house on Saturday and I'll take care of it myself on Sunday. Asked how I got OEM parts, I said "the internet is an amazing place".


Parts.com - been buying OEM from them for several years on several cars.

[J Baustian]

I do not know how many tens of thousands of dollars I've saved in the last 10 years, just by staying away from VW dealerships. Probably at least $25,000 -- and maybe my car would not have lasted me so long, because I might have neglected the maintenance rather than pay dealership prices.