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The main arguments I’ve heard that Tesla is bound to fail are briefly summarized as follows:
1) EVs make up a tiny share of auto market and/or are a fad - this is still up in the air to an extent but most indicators (legislative, technology, etc.) point to electric overtaking internal combustion engines in the next 10-15 years. Many automakers have realized this and have shifted their focus to EVs, which leads me to argument #2.
2) Other automakers are smarter, more experienced and have the scale to crush Tesla in the EV segment. This remains to be seen. Although there are rumblings of long range, high performance and affordable EVs, as of the current moment nothing comes near Tesla’s Model S, Model X and Model 3 in their respective classes....and nobody in their right mind can dispute this. There is another huge competitive advantage Tesla has over the EV market at the moment and that is its supercharger network. The fast chargers that other EVs can use in public (Teslas can use these too by the way) are molasses slow in comparison. Anyone who drives a Tesla knows what I’m talking about.
3) Elon cannot figure out how to efficiently operate an automaker and produce vehicles to mass scale - the haters may have a point here. I’m a Tesla fan and feel that there is significant opportunity for improvement here. Still, the production numbers have picked up in recent months. I got my car so I’m pretty happy about that.
1) they said the same thing about hybrids. The majority of the market obviously doesn’t care about the environment nor fuel efficiency apparently. In order to get them to switch from ICE to EV you would have to offer them an convenience. EV’s can start with a full charge everyday and a couple other tricks like heat themselves in an enclosed garage on grid power, but the trade off is recharging times and less flexibility on how the car is used. Sure it makes to have an EV as a commuter and a large SUV for long trips but the reason you see people commuting in large SUV’s is because it’s cheaper to one car that does everything than two that specialize in just one thing. Despite all the hype, it is not more convenient to do a long range drive in an EV. Sure Tesla has tried to mitigate that with superchargers, but most people wouldn’t bother either way as supercharging is not more convenient than a gas station.
2) other manufacturers are making EV’s to satisfy European and Chinese government requirements taking EV’s from niche to mainstream via legislation vs consumer demand. This is bad news for Tesla as prior to now, EV’s were mostly compliance cars that weren’t taken seriously. Tesla up until now has enjoyed a cushy niche where the profits (or lack there of) weren’t enough to excite the competition. Given massive foreign legislative requirements, all the competition has been excited at once.
There isn’t rumblings for long range affordable EV’s, the Bolt and the Leaf can be purchased affordable right now. Tesla can’t afford to make an affordable EV.
3) on this we agree. Another executive just left Tesla yesterday. Elon is becoming toxic for attracting executive talent. If Telsa’s board isn’t careful, they’ll end up with a company that no competent executive will ever want to work for and they’ll always end up with the industry’s “B team”. while all the top performers get poached by the competition. Elon needs to learn to humble himself and realize companies are an organization of teams of people not an extension of one egomaniac.
Anybody can make a car that goes 0-60 in 2 seconds. The trick is making a true performance car that can handle lap after lap at peak performance. Look no further than Formula E vs Formula 1. Nobody’s freaking out about anything. It’s nothing but a concept car at this point.
Well, it got this small niche car company that produces the fast car made to rethink it’s business. Then tell me why Lamborghini of all car companies has a full EV? This Roadster is just the beginning...
Well, it got this small niche car company that produces the fast car made to rethink it’s business. Then tell me why Lamborghini of all car companies has a full EV? This Roadster is just the beginning...
It’s a gimmick like most Lamborghini’s. If a rapper will buy it, Lamborghini will make it.
If you don't see the trend of the fastest cars made going hybrid/electric, then enjoy the rock you live under. Cars with warranties that can also make fast turns around tracks, not rocket cars Steve down the street made for Bonneville.
It's certainly up for discussion. Point to... three aspects of Tesla vehicles that are more than marginally evolutionary over prior art.
Hint: increasing battery range by five percent is not "innovative."
Novel thermal battery management system. This is why Tesla's batteries degrade less and have better performance than other production electric cars.
Novel integration of skateboard battery pack system at bottom of car which 1) Improves Center of Gravity for better handling and 2) enhances structural support of car
Reduction of some "dirty" materials in next-gen batteries (e.g. cobalt) ahead of competition.
Optimized benefits of EV structural designs to enhance front car collision energy absorption (lack of engine improves this), higher side impact protection than other cars (due to battery pack rigidity), and lower rollover risk (due to lower center of gravity). Keep in mind these are all improved in Tesla's than other BEVs (at least currently).
Best in class Level 2 assistance driving (this was the case even when they worked on top of MobileEye's system, still better than competitors).
Custom system-on-chip designs way better than anyone in car industry.
And so on.
Take a look at this video for Detroit-based Sandy Munro, expert at breaking down cars:
You’re throwing around labels, painting those who disagree with you as the “bad guy” and using the played out term “Fake news”. It’s a discussion, no more no less. This forum is full of heated discussions ranging from everything from Domestic vs Imported, to Manual vs Automatic.
For the record I’ve been hating Elon since long before anybody had ever heard the term ”fake news”. That’s only because I know a fraud when I see one.
For the record the Volt was in production before the Model S. The Bolt was in production before the Model 3.
The retoric regarding the Model 3 being the first “affordable” long range EV is already outdated by GM and Nissan.
Tesla didn’t necessarily innovate anything. The challenge was an affordable long range EV. Tesla simply made large battery and charged a lot more for it. The complete opposite of innovation.
See now you are the one who is insinuating that being first is what's innovative. No, I'm talking about doing specific things better than what was done before, not first.
I don't know if you are one even talking about profitability. Those blabbing about cash flow without understanding what it is spent on is what what I am referring to as fake news.
I get a little confused and I am bored of the VW commercial for electric cars. But the car in the commercial looks like it has the Chevrolet emblem. What is the connection with VW or is the commercial just to get Americans thinking about electric cars?
By the way, for a State that likes us to think they are champions for environmental issues; the LA basin has just set a record of 87 days of unhealthy smog.
By the way, for a State that likes us to think they are champions for environmental issues; the LA basin has just set a record of 87 days of unhealthy smog.
Lovely snark with absolutely no grasp of historical issues.
To make it real, real simple: Imagine SoCal smog without the extreme measures California has held onto despite continual (and now aggressive) federal opposition.
Lovely snark with absolutely no grasp of historical issues.
To make it real, real simple: Imagine SoCal smog without the extreme measures California has held onto despite continual (and now aggressive) federal opposition.
This LA Times article does not blame the Federal opposition: 87 days of smog: Southern California just saw its longest streak of bad air in decades - Los Angeles Times. I don't blame them either since I used to drive to LA once a week from PA. But that is another story. This is about Tesla competition and we heard much out of California and LA about cleaner vehicles. Regardless of the talk; it isn't doing them too much good.
VW is spending a ton of money trying to get America to think Electric. They obviously do not feel that Tesla will be without competition.
Novel thermal battery management system. This is why Tesla's batteries degrade less and have better performance than other production electric cars.
Novel integration of skateboard battery pack system at bottom of car which 1) Improves Center of Gravity for better handling and 2) enhances structural support of car
Reduction of some "dirty" materials in next-gen batteries (e.g. cobalt) ahead of competition.
Optimized benefits of EV structural designs to enhance front car collision energy absorption (lack of engine improves this), higher side impact protection than other cars (due to battery pack rigidity), and lower rollover risk (due to lower center of gravity). Keep in mind these are all improved in Tesla's than other BEVs (at least currently).
Best in class Level 2 assistance driving (this was the case even when they worked on top of MobileEye's system, still better than competitors).
Custom system-on-chip designs way better than anyone in car industry.
And so on.
Take a look at this video for Detroit-based Sandy Munro, expert at breaking down cars:
No. The reason Tesla’s batteries last is because people buy a car larger pack than needed. If you ran the pack close to dead everyday and recharged it to 100%, you would wear it out much sooner regardless of thermal management. The catch is of people bought exactly what they needed, the pack would need replacement much sooner, but would much less expensive.
The low CG and everything is BS. Sandy Munro also said that Tesla’s build quality is “like a Kia from the 90’s”. Personally, I think Munro says whatever somebody pays him to. He’s also coincidently being sued because of that tear down report... https://www.google.com/amp/s/insidee...-teardown/amp/ Until that’s all squared away, I’d take what he says with a grain of salt either way.
Tesla likes to credit its battery pack location with a lot of stuff, but I’m calling BS on using it as a structural component of the car as that is a pretty stupid thing to do and would not allow for an easy replacement (remember the failed battery swap stations?).
It’s at the bottom of the car because they didn’t have any other place to put it if they wanted to maximize payload space. Being at the bottom also allows it to get hit by debris which has been the cause of at least a couple battery tires. In marketing, you brag up the good and down play the bad which is what has been done here.
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