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Old 07-18-2009, 09:25 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC, USA
392 posts, read 1,553,109 times
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There is a growing biodiesel industry in Florida, the Southwest, and other areas of the country. I'm not knowledgeable of the efficiencies of biodiesel production verses ethanol production, but it would not surprise me if biodiesel had some efficiency advantages due to the way it's produced.

I hope that they don't crowd out everything else by forcing Ethanol to be the only game in town.
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Old 07-18-2009, 09:29 PM
dgz
 
806 posts, read 3,393,230 times
Reputation: 707
I think that when you give money to someone who has screwed up (i.e., the auto companies), there should be strings attached. Frankly, I angry that it's 2009, and I still can't buy a car that can get 80 mpg. There is no technological reason why we could not have one right now.

And yes, I too would rather give money to an American farmer than to a Saudi oil magnate. It's sad that we have people dying in the Middle East because our country is so dependent on oil.

I feel like every time I'm at the gas station paying to fuel up my car, the money is going to the Middle East where some of that money is going to extremists who kill our troops. I really wish I could be fueling my car with something other than gas. But I would also like to see a different technology such as electric or algae providing the fuel. I don't like the idea of driving on corn because that is something that others need to survive. I recall there was story a while back when there was a sudden rush to use corn as a fuel, and suddenly the price of corn products in Mexico went up--causing hunger for many of the poor.
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Old 07-18-2009, 09:50 PM
 
Location: Floribama
18,949 posts, read 43,612,080 times
Reputation: 18760
Quote:
Originally Posted by dgz View Post
I feel like every time I'm at the gas station paying to fuel up my car, the money is going to the Middle East where some of that money is going to extremists who kill our troops.
Maybe, but some of that money also goes to Americans who work in the Gulf of Mexico and Alaska.
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Old 07-18-2009, 09:55 PM
 
Location: Lafayette, Louisiana
14,100 posts, read 28,530,849 times
Reputation: 8075
Quote:
Originally Posted by dgz View Post
I think that when you give money to someone who has screwed up (i.e., the auto companies), there should be strings attached. Frankly, I angry that it's 2009, and I still can't buy a car that can get 80 mpg. There is no technological reason why we could not have one right now.

And yes, I too would rather give money to an American farmer than to a Saudi oil magnate. It's sad that we have people dying in the Middle East because our country is so dependent on oil.

I feel like every time I'm at the gas station paying to fuel up my car, the money is going to the Middle East where some of that money is going to extremists who kill our troops. I really wish I could be fueling my car with something other than gas. But I would also like to see a different technology such as electric or algae providing the fuel. I don't like the idea of driving on corn because that is something that others need to survive. I recall there was story a while back when there was a sudden rush to use corn as a fuel, and suddenly the price of corn products in Mexico went up--causing hunger for many of the poor.
With today's technology we can make a car that can get 100 or more miles per gallon. However, in order to do that they'd have to ignore some modern crash safety standards. Think back to the 1980s when a special model of the Honda CRX HF could get 50 mpg without a hybrid engine. That car could not be mass produced today as is because it would never meet US crash safety standards. It's vehicle weight would greatly increase as well as it's size in order to meet those standards. All that weight reduces miles per gallon numbers. Take the CRX, rip out the engine, transmission, and electronic controls. Insert the engine and transmission of say the Honda Fit and it would be fast and fuel efficient but would be deadly in a wreck. Remember the Geo Metro and Chevy Sprint? Same thing. Very light weight body and tiny engine resulting in about 50 mpg numbers. Could never be built today. Compact sedans once weighed 2400 to 2500 lbs. Now many of them exceed 3000 lbs which is about what my 2003 Malibu weighs. Midsize sedans are close to or above the 4000 lbs mark when they were once in the 3000 lbs or less range. Full size sedans are easily exceeding the 4000 lbs range but are among the safest vehicles on the road (Ford Taurus for example). Even motor scooters get 60 to 70 mpg depending on your body weight, how you drive, and how flat the roads are in your area. So why would you expect modern cars to exceed the mpg numbers of even motor scooters?
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Old 07-18-2009, 11:31 PM
 
Location: USA
3,966 posts, read 10,699,583 times
Reputation: 2228
Quote:
Originally Posted by pinetreecity View Post
There is a growing biodiesel industry in Florida, the Southwest, and other areas of the country. I'm not knowledgeable of the efficiencies of biodiesel production verses ethanol production, but it would not surprise me if biodiesel had some efficiency advantages due to the way it's produced.

I hope that they don't crowd out everything else by forcing Ethanol to be the only game in town.
Biodiesel is so much better and does not have sulfur in it compared to normal diesel. I would not even bother with ethanol takes too much energy to make.
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Old 07-19-2009, 07:39 AM
 
Location: Lafayette, Louisiana
14,100 posts, read 28,530,849 times
Reputation: 8075
On another board I once poked fun at some liberals by saying "perhaps the federal government should regulate what type of vehicle each person drives. If you're single you qualify for a small two seat hatchback car. If you marry then you must submit a request for the two of you to each have a small two seat hatchback car and the reasons why you feel you need two vehicles. If you have children then you must submit a request to qualify for a small sedan. If you wish to have more than 2 children then you must submit a request to the federal government along with your family's educational, social, and political background. If you need to move something too large for your vehicle then you must rent one from the government fleet pending approval after submitting a form stating the exact dimensions and nature of the object you wish to move and why. Once such a plan has been put in place, all non-approved vehicles will be confiscated under the eminent domain clause and all such vehicles will be recycled to form government approved vehicles."
At the time I made such a statement they called me a conspiracy theorist. How much longer before such a plan creeps into their minds? Remember when they started to ban smoking in many businesses? Most people said they'd never ban smoking in bars and casinos. Most people also never thought that the government would look into banning smoking within your own home. Some cities have tried to do just that in trying to ban smoking in apartments and townhouses. heck, some cities have even banned smoking on sidewalks, city parks, and public beaches.
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Old 07-19-2009, 09:31 AM
 
11,555 posts, read 53,182,360 times
Reputation: 16349
Quote:
Originally Posted by w1ngzer0 View Post
Biodiesel is so much better and does not have sulfur in it compared to normal diesel. I would not even bother with ethanol takes too much energy to make.
Really?

It doesn't have the lubricity of regular diesel, and is very hard on the injection systems.

Ford, for example, doesn't approve the use of higher percentage biodiesel blends because it destroys the injectors when used over about 15%.

In my recent travels to Ohio, I found some fuel stops displaying placards that the bio-diesel content could be as high as 20%. When I fueled with that, I could tell the difference in the motor running and a loss of 7-10% of my fuel mileage on my 1995F-250 Powerstroke. I had to use fuel additives to restore the lubricity and clean out the deposits in the fuel system ... and seek out real diesel fuel to restore my fuel economy.

As a shop owner/specialist in MB diesels for many years, I saw folks converting these to bio-diesel blends for years. While the motors would run on these fuels, the mechanical injection pumps didn't last very long ....
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Old 07-23-2009, 05:30 AM
 
Location: Cold Frozen North
1,928 posts, read 5,166,670 times
Reputation: 1307
Quote:
Originally Posted by sailordave View Post
My dad retired from the oil industry. He's also traveled outside the US and was horrified by some of the oil rigs run in other parts of the world. Enviromentalist would go into shock if they saw the oil rigs run by some foreign nations. Pits dug into the soil and filled with waste oil and chemicals was common.
I'm not surprised that foreign countries operate like this. They want the money at any expense. What I never understood is why the environmentalists wage such a war against industry here in the US, yet conveniently ignore much worse conditions elsewhere. I always believed that there was a higher/hidden agenda at work. It's too obvious.
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Old 07-23-2009, 07:26 AM
 
Location: Lafayette, Louisiana
14,100 posts, read 28,530,849 times
Reputation: 8075
Quote:
Originally Posted by HighPlainsDrifter73 View Post
I'm not surprised that foreign countries operate like this. They want the money at any expense. What I never understood is why the environmentalists wage such a war against industry here in the US, yet conveniently ignore much worse conditions elsewhere. I always believed that there was a higher/hidden agenda at work. It's too obvious.
I'll give you an example of why enviromentalist don't go there. My dad was sent to Nigeria to train oil field workers there. He wasn't a big wig in the company and yet the company gave him an armored car with a driver. It was to protect him from the local authorities. He saw a car wreck in which the car hit a tree and the driver, partially hanging out the car, was killed. Nearly a month later the car and body was still at the same spot. He asked the driver why wasn't the car and body removed. Driver responded that the family didn't have the money to pay authorities to move the body and car so the body was left there to rot. When my dad was ready to go home, his passport and visa came up missing. The local authorities told him that for $100 American dollars they would find his passport and visa. He handed them $100. After taking and pocketing the $100, the local authority said he found his passport and visa and handed them to my dad.
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Old 07-23-2009, 07:50 AM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,379 posts, read 60,575,206 times
Reputation: 60996
SOP in much of the world.
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